workfare - does anyone have a defence for it?

[nkf]

Or do I really have to start travelling miles to the co-op? I'm sure I do but what is the argument in its favour?

'Working for no wage was alright when us working class scum had to do it.'

I think if the Tories had been in power then, then there would have been a coordinated outcry from the unions and the movements similar to Right To Work. I think the reason the outcry was not very loud at the time, was because it was a New Labour government and the left did not want to upset the apple cart. That is why they didn't stand up for the working class then.

'Now that graduates (Cait Reilly for instance) are being forced in to doing it as well as older middle class people who have found themselves unemployed there is an outcry'

You're spot-on carer. I didn't notice because it didn't affect me. I've noticed now.

Sorry if it sounded like i was having a go. It wasnt meant that way.

Not at all carer. Posted my protest back to a BHF begging letter as I told you btw. Why not use their own SAEs against them? Might make them think of how people who worry about basic costs live

It was a bit angrily scrawly but I think they got the general message.

Thats fab limitedperiod. I will do that too when the next one arrives.

Oh, btw bob thank you. I think

Bit off topic but

"I work for a small charity, and I'm afraid that we would be very reluctant to take on someone to gain work experience - it would simply take up far too much of paid staff time to supervise them (that is, assuming that we took the placement seriously, made sure that the person did something of value, that they were appropriately supported and managed throughout, etc)."

Sorry to cut and paste, it seems rude Grendelsmum but that person sent to you to gain "work experience" could be someone who has worked all their adult life and has plenty of qualifications. Why would you be reluctant to take them on? I'm interested because having been out of work for over two years i'm probably classed as long term unemployed now...and if a charity wouldn't even want me what bloody hope is there!

TheFroggy - oh, it's not meaning that you wouldnt have plenty of skills and experience that would be highly useful to our organisation if you were given an actual job, training etc! It's simply that like any job, the first couple of weeks mainly consist of explaining what we do in a fair level of detail, getting a computer account and email set up, talking through fire procedures, going through all the admin, agreeing the project that they'd work on, identifying skills that need to be developed to achieve this etc. etc. We don't have enough regular work that needs no experience or skills in our specialist area that we could take a general volunteer - they'd end up twiddling their thumbs for two weeks. Plus, taking on an additional person means that we have to do quite a lot more management of that person, plan a programme of work for them, etc. All of this means that in practise, unless they had exactly the right skills already (which some people do, of course) it would cost us more in staff time to give someone work experience than we would gain from their input.

I do actually volunteer myself in my spare time, and it's fascinating to see how other charitable organisations run it!

Oh, forgot to say that that's assuming that it was a relatively short placement. Of course, if someone wanted to come and volunteer long term, the costs and benefits would be very different, but our funders have a policy that if someone is doing a job, they must be treated as doing a job and paid properly for it (even though we do have some retired people who would more than happily volunteer to support the charity).

Back in my day Charities didn't exactly offer New Deal people places, you had to demand it, they had their approved providers list but there was a clause that you could request a different placement and they would have to try and get you it.

So as I was working for free I said I ain't working for ParcelForce, Woolworth etc If I'm not getting paid I want to work with a charity.

Apart from the shouting of the well off over Workfare I think you will all so find that the unemployed are not scum anymore, not scroungers, not lazy fat layabouts who must be stupid if they can't find a job etc, they are suddenly poor unfortunate people who have fallen on hard times.

Never mind give it 5 years and the economy will have picked up enough for all those middle students types to be able to get jobs again, and then they can all go back to thumbing their noses at the working class and declaring that we must all be lazy scroungers or stupid if we can't get jobs.