To ask pro-choice MNers to email your MPs? <this is not a request to vote on anything>

[EricNorthmansMistressOfPotions]

There is an article here about the proposed amendments to the health and social care bill which will force women to undergo 'independent' counselling before being allowed to choose to terminate a pregnancy. The assumption is that BPAS and the like have a financial investment in encouraging women to terminate and as such their counselling is biased. The stated goal is to reduce the number of terminations per year by forcing women to delay between seeking and receiving termination, and having to undergo additional counselling (political bias unknown, though easily guessed at) prior to the termination. ND hopes that woman will change their minds during this enforced extended waiting period.

If you think this is a shit idea you can email your MP by clicking this link

This is not a request to vote on anything at all

kelly, I think you will find that was because the foetus had passed the age of viability. I think that particular case was discussed at length on another thread.

Why do you, bumbley, insist on referring only to abortion as a medical procedure?

Only in the context of what Kelly and I are discussing BIWI.

Explain more, please. I don't understand you.

Did you pull Wilson up on that SQ? Nope, only the pro-lifer - what a surprise!

If you are interested BIWI then read back over Kelly and my posts over the last few pages - it is relevant in the context of what we are discussing. TBH it's not really relevant to this discussion at all but Kelly is still bringing it up and for some reason I keep replying to her.

'another pro-choice twister of words'...what a truly bizarre thing to say. So the pro choice lobby is known for deliberately twisting words, does it? Very disingenuous, when your oh-so-innocent question was quite clearly meant to imply that I deliberately closed my eyes to the personhood of my embryo. Not at all. I just don't believe in it- any more than I believe in the potential personhood of the egg I just shed this month.

your oddly bright tone does suggest you're finding all this lots of fun. Not so much fun for the girls and women you'd like to saddle with unwanted babies, I can assure you.

What's your view on the morning after pill and contraception btw?

bumbley - I have read all the thread, thank you. I'm asking you because I don't understand why you keep making this distinction. Please could you explain it to me?

SQ,
Even in N.I, if a woman's life is in danger either from a physical or mental illness, the mother is a victim of rape, the mother has learning disabilities, or the foetus is deformed an abortion can be carried out.

Yuck. I'm getting the impression that this is some sort of sick entertainment for BM.

I don't see anyone else approaching this thread with glee. Even the pro-lifers I've seen respect that this is not a fun issue.

kelly's point is entirely relevant. this debate is about the need or not for compulsary councilling, and your insistance on women having the full facts presented to them with regard to them making an informed choice.

kelly is quite rightly pointing out that when making a choice between 2 options and she is not trusted to know her own mind, then all the facts about both options should be presented, not a one sided guilt trip.

So it is ok to charge a pregnant woman with murder if she tries to kill herself, and ends up only ending the pregnancy. That basicly means that once a woman has sex she is potentially giving up her body to the state. Nice, woman cannot even try to kill themselves without being prosecuted. The american foetus murder laws were meant to stop men beating women up so badly that they miscarried. Instead despite this still happening no man has been charged with murder, yet women who have late misacrriages and still births are being treated as murder suspects.

The 'misunderstanding' has started now.

Break time - I asked you a question I did not accuse you of anything. You are pro-choice and you twisted my words (as others on this thread have done before). I am not generalising about all prochoicers - some of them are perfectly capable of having a civil discussion without twisting words, raising non-issues or making false accusations.

Why ask me about my views on contraception and MAP? How is it relevant to this discussion? I think you just want something else to criticise me for. You could find my stance on them if you wanted to - I have talked about them on other threads.

kelly NI does have different laws to the rest of the UK on abortion though

Wiki says this

"Abortion in Northern Ireland is only legal in exceptional circumstances where the life of the pregnant woman is at immediate risk and if there is a long term or permanent risk to her physical or mental health. "

Michelle, no more of an entertainment than it is to anyone else posting on this thread on a Wednesday.

"Sigh... I don't understand why you all have to misinterpret me all the time sad face sad face. Let's all have a lovely fun debate about rape and abortion happy face!!"

Creepy.

Kelly, it's only if a woman's life is in danger.

Biwi - do you not consider abortion a medical procedure? What would you call it instead?

NI also has an excellent ferry service. And airports serviced by budget airlines.

And yes. It's quite clear that bumblymummy enjoys this. I would suggest keeping the debate on a higher level. Above the bridge.

Pregnancy and childbirth in the UK are in the hands of the medical profession.
That is what kelly means, I'm sure.

I think it would be a great idea for pregnant women to be honestly told the risks.

Michelle - I actually find you a bit creepy tbh. Not really sure what your contribution to the thread has been for a few pages now...

Bumbley, In N.I, It can also be used in rape cases, and if the mother has learning difficulties. And the life in danger bit also includes the possibility that the mother may commit suicide.
Narky,
Yes lets just stop enaging bumbley.

SQ - why don't you campaign for that then? Although you may be told that you are being patronising and women don't need to be told the risks and of course they all KNOW what childbirth involves etc...

I expect you're alone on the thread in your opinion of Michelle, bumbley....not that that will bother you.

agreed everyone- we should stop feeding this particular 'trollette' (to be fair she's not a troll, but she's enjoying all this far too much and the cheery personal nastiness combined with winks and smilies is really freaking me out)