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ATOS Medical

149 replies

Empusa · 26/07/2011 01:46

Link here

A report from the select committee on work and pensions has been published about welfare reform. Specifically work capability assessments (WCA) as they move people on to ESA from income support.

My personal experience is that the WCA is a farce, and although they are reporting huge numbers of people being deemed "fit for work", a huge amount of those are later overturned at tribunal.

Finally this awful practice of taking people off benefits when their health isn't enough that they can work is being taken notice of.

But what will they do about it?

For all of those who I'm sure will come on and tell us about their friend of a friend who is claiming fraudulently, that's a different issue.

We are talking about those who are genuinely disabled who are finding themselves not only without financial support, but also under suspicion. In my own experience the whole process took over 6 months.

That's 6 months of stress on top of the daily stress of disability. Stress and fear.

Surely we all agree that the most vulnerable in society should be protected? Not treated like criminals?

OP posts:
carernotasaint · 02/08/2012 22:37

EXACTLY 2 old. The propaganda in the right wing press is so reminiscent of the propaganda that was appearing in the German press in 1936. They also had posters up informing citezens just how much the disabled were costing them. WHY cant people (right wing idiots) fucking see it FFS!

joanofarchitrave · 02/08/2012 22:59

DH has recently stopped claiming ESA. Success! In fact, he's one of the 36% who's dropped out of the system, which is brilliant, isn't it? Proves he was malingering all along, doesn't it? He's actually delighted not to be festering on benefits any more, and so am I. He's looking forward to working again. All round it's win-win for the state, for dh and for me. Huzza!

I'm a health care professional. When I assess someone, I look at their diagnosis first because it helps me consider what I am possibly going to see when I meet a patient. I do not consider the diagnosis as any kind of absolute, or more than a rough guide to what I MAY see during the assessment, and the kinds of tools that MAY be helpful in the session.

So I do agree that benefits should not be awarded on the basis of a diagnosis - people are individuals. That is the cruel thing about this system - it is, in its first principles, completely right and I agree with it. I also like very much the idea of the work-related activities group.

So: DH has schizoaffective disorder, and has had it for 25 years. He has major depressive episodes and psychosis involving hearing what other people are thinking - and it's always negative, angry, critical. Imagine working for 22 years with your co-workers' despising thoughts popping into your head, with the belief that you can hear your wife planning to leave you, your neighbours planning to attack you. Every day. You are a rational being so you know that it's not real, but when you are unwell (which you are for part of most days) the reality of it almost overwhelms you. Being in crowds, or group conversations, or sometimes seeing people at all, makes it painfully worse. To manage this, you take medication, some of which is highly sedating, some of which gives you insomnia, makes it extremely hard not to gain weight, gives you dry mouth, reduces your sense of taste, makes you shake, gives you an agonising restlessness called akinesia, gives you twitches which make people look at you, increasing your psychosis. Despite all this, you do manage, mostly, to work for over 2 decades. Gradually your time on sick leave creeps up, and it becomes clear that your employers are basically managing you out, increasing your stress level and increasing your sick leave. Vicious circle. Rather than be sacked and go on benefit, you try starting your own business. This works quite well initially and then goes downhill as the isolation kicks in and the responsibility of working alone eats into you. You never let a client down, never miss a deadline, and yet it is too much. Your self-esteem collapses, the losses of the years overwhelm you.

Eventually your doctor signs you off sick; you apply for Employment support Allowance. Work Capability Assessment; you are fit for work. Basically; you are lying, you are worthless. The papers are full of disability hate; sensibly, you stop reading them. You plunge into a depressive episode. Your wife is doing finals at the time and holds things together as best she can. Your son sees you suffering and begins to have night terrors. Your doctor gives your wife the details of the local benefit adviser; they basically guarantee you that the appeal will be successful with the adviser's help; he has barely lost a case since the new system started. You drag through the months to appeal, gathering evidence, letters, reading about all the worst parts of your illness. You spend weeks barely going out of the house. You obsessively recalculate the household budget, what if, what if? Your wife comes home from work and spends the evening talking you down from your fears, trying to bring you out of your obsessive ruminations on the past, the future. She is knackered and worried that she will not be able to continue with her new job. It pays £7K a year, so the benefit is pretty much essential.

Appeal day: the tribunal reads your paperwork, rings you up and says not to bother coming to the hearing; 15 points, your benefit is reinstated. On the medical evidence, NOT the diagnosis.

You have been left hollowed out by the process. You hate yourself and feel worthless as you never have before. You try to come off medication. Six months of hell ensue, darkness as never before. Your wife gets a better-paying job; you are no longer eligible for benefit anyway, but you still get national insurance contributions paid, and there is still recognition in you receiving the benefit that you ARE ill, you are not malingering.

May; the notification for this year's work capability assessment arrives. You plunge into a psychotic episode. Your wife is stretched across a chasm; she is working full-time with a new employer, managing childcare for your son as you cannot safely look after him, trying to catch official letters before you see them so that you cannot obsess over them, talking to you, trying to work out if it is safe to leave you during the day, endlessly on the phone. Your son starts talking about killing himself; it turns out he is being bullied at school. You and your wife agree to pull out of the system.

That, in my opinion, is a genuine success of the system; DH has been driven out of it at a cost to his wellbeing and a cost to our whole family that I doubted our ability to pay; but there we are, he is better (today) so we managed to pay it, and we are still together (sort of) and surviving. He is talking about going back to work, which is good; I personally will believe it when I see it; for example, I asked if he would pick something up from a shop in town today, the first errand I have asked him to do in a very long time. He didn't manage it. I can't imagine him working anywhere, if I'm quite honest, though I have to talk him through the possibility of doing so, every single night, there is barely a night we aren't having the same fucking conversation. The lack of belief from his fellow taxpayers is a fairly brutal experience, to be honest.

I would apologise for such a long post, but I am past apologising. It won't have changed anybody's mind, no doubt.

2old2beamum · 02/08/2012 23:06

rant on joan we are behind you

carernotasaint · 02/08/2012 23:06

Seconded.

NicholasTeakozy · 02/08/2012 23:43

Just rant on Joan, from posts from friends on my Arsebook and other sites I have no doubt this scummy government want to get rid of disabled people. Cunts. All of them.

FrothyOM · 03/08/2012 07:59

Joan ((((((((((hugs)))))))))

2old2beamum · 03/08/2012 16:30

These posts are soul destroying I am sure animals get more respect than the disabled.
Surely some disabled groups could become more proactive, I could round up about 300 people who would WANT to demonstrate.
There are 7 of us.!!!

carernotasaint · 03/08/2012 16:39

you are so right 2old The apathy drives me fucking insane. I have tried so hard to tell my Daily Mail reading parents whats going on. I tried to explain it to my mum but unless youre talking about the latest celebrity diet or what Kate Middleton is wearing she switches off or tells me to stop going on. A lot of people have been brainwashed. Its fucking scary. Brainwashing and propaganda is exactly what happened in the German press in the run up to World War 2. WHY CANT PEOPLE SEE IT FFS.It makes me want to SCREAM.

2old2beamum · 03/08/2012 17:44

Most of my friends are OAP's and are not bothered unless it affects their lifestyle, so selfish. Of course they all know "benefit scroungers" and immigrants who get OUR houses.Thanks Daily Fail
My poor old Dad will be turning in his grave he was a card carrying communist in the 1950's

Like you apathy is driving me mad I am so scared for this country's poor people

JuliaScurr · 03/08/2012 20:32

falseeconomy.org.uk/oct20

Don't agonise - organise!

Empusa · 03/08/2012 20:47

I think a lot of the problem with this is, the people it affects the most often can't do anything to protest, and the people who could do something often don't care as it doesn't affect them. :(

OP posts:
NanaNina · 03/08/2012 20:49

I thought I'd heard the worst about this "welfare to work" crap but NO worse to come. My friend's son (in his early 30s) was made redundant from HMV a few months ago, and has been on JSA for 4 months. Apparently he can only stay on it for 2 more months because after 6 months it is means tested and because he lives with his parents (who like me are OAPs) and his dad has Parkinsons, he gets nothing after 6 months.

This shit govt are scaring me so much.

Julia I agree "don't agonise - organise" and I have been on more demos over the years than the average person I think. In my younger day I was a member of the International Marxist Group, but I'm afraid my demo days are over at aged 68 with some health problems, but thank god am fortunate enough to have a public sector pension, and state pension. My generation (in the main) are very fortunate but I worry for my kids, grandkids, their kids etc etc.

There should really be a national strike but that is not going to happen.

CouthyMow · 03/08/2012 21:40

It is so difficult. My friends that are on benefits won't believe me when I tell them of the changes that are coming through the Welfare Reform Bill. Until they get a letter from the DWP, they refuse to believe that this will happen.

They AREN'T like me, protesting against the WRB as if happened, they wouldn't know how a bill goes through parliament, much less have a clue on what to do about it.

I try to explain what changes are coming, but they think I am exaggerating (I have a few friends with 4 DC's like me).

And they don't really 'get' the issues with the disabled, I'm the only person they know with disabilities, and they have only recently realised HOW much my epilepsy affects me, when I had a seizure in front of them. I think before then, it was just something they 'knew' I had, but didn't see the full impact it has on my life. It's only now that they have started asking WHY I don't get DLA or incapacity money.

A lot of the people out there just don't think it is as bad as it really IS, as they think that everyone who is disabled gets 'money thrown at them'.

CouthyMow · 03/08/2012 21:45

And I can't GET to demo's etc, both because of my own disabilities, AND because I am caring for two DC's with disabilities. Which the DWP refused to accept is possible.

When it comes to a situation like mine, a disabled Lone Parent caring for TWO disabled DC's, it's a case of 'computer says no'.

When the Coalition came into power, people like me were told that that loophole would be closed. Now we get told that it is 'too costly' to do so, 'too costly' to change an IT system so that it recognises that it IS possible to be disabled, to be a Lone Parent, AND be caring for a disabled DC or two.

carernotasaint · 03/08/2012 22:01

Couthy i have a friend who is on DLA for epilepsy and ive told her of the changes that are coming. I think shes starting to believe it now but to start with she just kept saying "But it wont affect me because mine is a "for life" award"

NanaNina · 03/08/2012 22:10

I think couthy that the reason people don't believe what horrors are happening and what is still to come, because this is the first time that most of us have ever witnessed such an evil govt. Thatcher was bad enough but this lot make her look vaguely reasonable and I never thought those words would come from me!!

I commented to a friend recently (who is a competent historian) that this govt were taking us back to the 1930s and he said "they're not, they're taking us back to the 1890's and the Poor Law" and I have to say that I believe him and it is very scary - as I said I am not worried for myself particularly but at 68 old age is in sight and we may end up in the workhouse and I'm not really joking. I am worried for the the next generation and the next because I think the damage they are doing to the country will be irrevesible.

The other thing that worries me is that I don't think Labour have a chance of getting in with Ed Milliband - WHERE is he FGS - we never hear anything from him, and he's too nice, too polite. He doesn't have enough "fire in his belly" and I thought Ed Balls was going to spread Osborne on his toast but NO - I am beginning to think EM doesn't want to win the next election. My money would be on Yvette Cooper.

And to coin the phrase "we ain't seen nothin yet" - ATOS has just been awarded the contract for assessing people on DLA or that should read telling people that they are not in need of DLA. The Housing Benefit ceiling haven't yet come in (April 2013) I think and a whole raft of other stuff to put disadvantaged people in their place while the Etonians swan about in the lap of luxury.........aaaaaaaaaaaargh!

CFSKate · 03/08/2012 22:20

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2182685/When-going-stand-sick-disabled-Mr-Miliband.html

The deadline has been extended until midnight tomorrow.

edam · 03/08/2012 22:42

Have commented and signed.

I don't think the general public really understand what's going on - if they think about it at all, most of them probably imagine it's about dealing with shirkers who could be looking for work.

2old2beamum · 03/08/2012 23:05

NanaNina It grieves me to say I agree with you over EM, being a LP members we voted for EB. Frankly you and I could have floored fucking DC etc. as like you approaching old age I am terrified for the for the future generations s it is our responsibility to hand them a caring and safe country.
I have 5 severely disabled people age 7-32 dependant on us we are saving this government millions OK we adopted them but at 18 plus they should be semi independent or am I talking out of my arse.
yep your friend may be right not 1930 maybe 1890
But why are we putting up with it Surely someone else cares? 2 wheelchairs oiled ready to go plus 5 others

carernotasaint · 04/08/2012 15:29

have received a letter asking me why i didnt go to my assessment.
It says please tell us why you did not tell us straight away that you could not go to the assessment.
FFS they got a fax from my GP asking for a home visit. But i couldnt send it with the ESA50 cos the GP refused to do a letter until Atos had actually asked me to come in for a medical. Then he did a fax because Atos insisted on a fax instead. And then Atos sent me a letter refusing me a home visit. i was too unwell to go to their medical centre so i couldnt attend. Now they are asking me why i didnt tell them. They WERE fucking told.

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