Teachers to strike - 30 June

[meditrina]

breaking now on SKY

Overwhelming vote by 2 teachers' unions (92%)

on another thread someone is lamenting the low number of teachers actually voting (30% ish) - so the call to strike appears to be from 92% of those who actually voted and so does not represent the views of the majority of teachers
is there not some ruling as to what % of the overall membership has to be to
call a strike and not the % of those who actually voted
also can a teacher tell me what % of their salary THEY pay into their pension
and what % is topped up by the state
when I have this information I will be able to make an informed decision as to whether I support their actions

I really don't think that teachers strikes in 1986 and possibly in 2011 is continued threat to strike, is it? No-ones saying it won't be disruptive - it will be. To teachers, as well as to families and children. I started this thread still feeling rather ambivalent about striking- I've been sitting on the fence for months but I feel more strongly now than I did before.

I have often heard the idea that teaching is a physically demanding job, that it would be unreasonable to still be doing it at 65-70. They then leap to the conclusion that teachers should therefore draw their pension at 55-60.
What's to stop you retiring from teaching at, say, 55 and then taking up a second career and having 10-15 years at that? Just because you are incapable of one particular job does not mean that you are incapable of all work. Why should the State have to fund you when you are still perfectly able?

molly there is no set figure to validate a strike on the basis that if someone wanted to vote against the proposal then they had every chance.

However, as my old man, a rabid trade unionist miner always said, to have any moral mandate you need to be able to claim that the majority voted positively for strike action. Not that the majority couldn't be arsed or for some other reason didn't want to vote against.

I really do think that teachers need to ask themselves what it is they want to achieve.
If it is to make a stand against the government/cuts generally then fair dos...however they need to know what this will mean in the long term in respect of how the public perceives them.

I think this strike is playing straight into the governemnet's hands to be honest. Any shred of support for the teachers will evaporate.

verity - you can hardly call 9-3.15 full-time and i guess by across the months you are taking the long school hols into account. in the private sector some companies do allow you to take school hols off (mine for example, though i've never known anyone being permitted to do it) but you would never expect to get paid for it. perhaps this illustrates the different mentality between public and private sector

i think teaching assistants taking classes without a teacher is totally wrong. you sound an intelligent and well qualified one, but many of the ones i know and pretty dim and just get the job because they have helped out a lot at school and know the head teacher

I agree with mollymole's point.

Surely more than 50% of teachers should vote for strike action for there to be a result in favour of having a strike. If fewer than 50% voted how can union leaders say there is an overwhelming result in favour of a strike?

I don't think anyone in any profession/industry should have to work full time post 65 as it is harder to do most jobs at this age. Maybe a lower pension could be paid for the first few years till 68 and people could work part time to supplement it.

If you are a competent teacher and have been teaching for years surely the last few years are easier as you are so experienced and know your lessons off by heart. your children will have left home so you will not be working hard in the classroom all day and looking after young or teenage children in the evening.

Actually teachers only get paid for the contact hours ,I.e.it's just that they get paid in 12 instalments so you could,and the unions do,argue that they don't get paid for the holidays they just get paid during the holidays .

I have a great deal of respect for teachers,I have quite a few friends who are teachers and I work in s school and see first hand how hard they work and how dedicated most are to their pupils.But I really can't stand this attitude (which seems quite prevalent amongst mumsnet teachers )of martyrdom ,they really do seem to believe that their lot in life is worse than anyone else's and that no one could ever work as hard as they do.This does their cause no favours.

My dh works on average 16 hour days ,5 days a week plus frequent weekends ,we have had several holidays cancelled several holidays at short notice ,he is at his clients beck and call morning noon and night .His pension is nothing like a teachers.I work for a charity ,have a good degree work 3days a week through school holidays and have no pension .But I do think we are lucky and would never dream of sneering at anyone else's job or claiming that I work harder than they do ,on another thread the teachers even seemed to be competing to see who had the least time sitting down.

good luck to the teachers.

i can't stand the attitude that because teachers have adequate pension provision, and some other sectors don't, then teachers shouldn't have it. IMVHO people working in the private sector should be up in arms that in many cases their companies still return big fat dividends to their big fat share holders, whilst pleading that they can no longer afford to run their company pension schemes. what bollocks.

Dreaming of the sun, do you really think teachers only work 9-3:15? Really? Honestly?

My Dad has just retired as he is bloody knackered - he is not a teacher, worked in a warehouse. His bones were aching everyday, he is a real work horse anyway and would do any job 100%, his body could not take it anymore, he is 63 and fit. He is doing without money (by thinning out what they have now) until he gets his pension. They do not claim any benefits and they do not have much money.

I am guessing that some of the people here spouting how ridiculous teachers are, also believe teachers have all the holidays, finish work at 3 and do bugger all inbetween. My DH generally works a 12 hour day and sundays. We have sat together. he is a very good teacher and very much liked by his pupils. But he puts in a lot of effort. I cannot imagine him having the mental energy at 68 to be planning until 8pm at night to keep his 15 year olds interested, or to keep the 11 year old abused child calm and chasing him round the school as he is the only member of staff the child trusts. I would say much more than physical energy, it is the mental energy that is required here. He also has a family to fit in, oh and a life! You are never switched off from your job when you are a teacher. (and other jobs too)

My parents are mentally sound - but they are still far far different than they were 10 or 20 years ago. However, my Dad's job as I said was physically knackering, none stop - but he did not have to meet government requirements where every child mattered and was treated accordingly.

JoJo, schools change ALL of the time. My DH has hundreds of lesson plans that are already of no use as things are no longer in use etc, even things from last year - I cannot imagine that in 30 years time he will still be using the same lesson plans then. can you imagine if we were all using the same lesson plans form 30 years ago now? also it is not JUST about planning lessons, my DH often comes home to lots of emails from parents " little johnny had his blazer on today and no one gave him a merit, he is MOST distressed, please can someone look into this for him" "Sarah tells me you have been mean and horrible to her today and actually expecting her to do some work, please email me back immediately as this is unacceptable" information about children in care, info about children that need keeping an eye on, are being bullied etc. He spends evenings putting plans into place for these children too and for being observed etc, MARKING, report writing, shopping for items needed for lessons..............

I am a classroom teacher in a comprehensive and I voted not to strike. Were not all militant trade unionist idiots.

Support for you teachers on here. You rock (with the obvious occasional exceptions).

Agree totally with pooka from some pages back:

In order to attract the bright and motivated, who are basically the people we all want to be teaching our children, there have to be some perks. The salary is not exceptional. The pension scheme is one way of attracting men and women who could earn more in other employments, to become teachers.

More Beta - about the same turn out as the 2010 general election then.More Beta - about the sane turn out More

Voter turnout at the 2010 election was 65.1percent

Dh voted no. He doesn't agree with it at all. He thought he was 'safe', given his union has never striked struck been on strike before. Now he's torn as he's told he 'must' support his union, even though he disagrees with the decision (and also as rightly pointed out should it even be happening after such a low turnout of voters?), and he doesn't want to let down his students.

not getting into wrongs or rights of it .After being my sons 1-1 worker for a term .I have seen just how much work and extra work goes in to it.But know some parents going to find it a pita

But how can we ind out if the schools our dc attend will have teachers out on the 30th. know if even one is out at dd school they will need to close ( only 4 teachers plus head so small school ) and is it just one day ?

Someone quoted the average private sector pension above.

I'd like to know what the average % contribution is? How much is the average private sector worker coughing up each month?

And to point out that there are some pretty good private sector pensions out there. I have a frozen one that was non-contributory.

My dh has paid 11% of his salary into his public sector pension for the last 20+ years - should he not get what he thinks he's paying for? And if they put up his contribution to 14% (plus his tax and NI) and we have to pull out because we can't afford it what will happen to the pension then? Less contributions. How will it be sustained?

I am a teacher who was educated and originally trained for teaching overseas (i am qualified in the uk)

Can any teachers tell me can it be held against you if you strike here? Can you be fired or demoted or denied promotion, or only given the worst classes etc to get back at you

I support the strike but i am quite afraid of the fallout