"Do you think condoms are less or more effective than the pull-out method?"
Depends on whether you're talking about each method as a form of contraception or to prevent the spread of disease.. It's a bit irrelevant. I am not dealing with the contraception issue here because the Catholic beliefs regarding that are spiritually based and it would be a huge tangent. I am talking about the physical implications when the teachings aren't followed.. Here is another example:
www.mercatornet.com/articles/view/an_ecological_blind_spot/?fbc_channel=1&fb_login&fname=opener&guid=0.4620698279856936&installed=1&session={%22session_key%22%3A%222.Jby_Ftsnk_dmRcypfbYRxw_.3600.1290520800-842380373%22%2C%22uid%22%3A842380373%2C%22expires%22%3A1290520800%2C%22secret%22%3A%22bifSNPJ3kuwVclrgQaDAEw__%22%2C%22sig%22%3A%223e8404d6728d571a0267ce9924b7d188%22
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-396612/Third-male-fish-rivers-changing-sex.html
"Condoms have nothing to do with promiscuity, unfaithfulness or diseases. That's like saying that vaccinations cause people to go out and be more unhygienic."
It's not really like saying that; people enjoy having sex but they don't generally enjoy getting unhygienic.
"But that's the point, the RC Church doesn't want to spread the knowledge. It campaigns vigorously in a number of nations to either stop education classes from ever happening or to have them stopped where they do happen.
And then when there is no education and knowledge when Bishops say things like AIDS being able to pass through condoms people are just not informed enough to know that that is nonsense."
That's a matter of opinion.. The Church teaches abstinence; the facts - the NHS do too if you look closely enough: You are only safe when you have sex with one person who has only ever had sex with you.
"I'll also take issue with that statement and point back to the countless examples of thousands of years of history to back my view up."
So you are both saying that despite that fact that society reached a point where it was not as immoral is it is now, it doesn't matter because further in the past and for longer, we were as immoral. Fine, but the fact is, that regression does coincide with the advent of contraception.
"I have no issue with you being able to tell people what ever you want. My problem begins when you, or any religious group, wants to be able to say whatever it likes and yet demands the door be slammed on the counter view point. That to me is not only damaging to people's health but also an admission that that viewpoint cannot survive exposure to the facts and informed examination.
When you have poorly educated people, who for example believe the statements on AIDS passing through condoms, being left to educate children and there being no education on contraception outside of the home then there will be trouble and people will die through ignorance."
You genuinely cannot argue with the definition of safe sex and you are letting down children if you tell them otherwise. That is where the real damage to people's health is being done. People are dying or being left infertile and the numbers are increasing.. I guess time will tell how successful contraception is. I know so many Catholic and Christian families who just don't have to deal with any of those problems because they followed a simple teaching.
"And what does all of this have to do with the topic at hand?
Well my point was that this sort of debate and inquiry can easily end up hijacked by organisations who have their own agenda that goes far beyond what's being talked about and that therefore we need to be careful about where this goes."
My first post just addressed the comment below.. I think that was the first hijacking of the sexualisation topic.
StuffingGoldBrass Mon 06-Dec-10 17:47:58
I'm with BadgerPaws: campaigns like this are very vulnerable to hijacking by awful people woman-hating arseholes, superstition-peddlers and pro-abstinence campaigners. NONE of whom are good influences on DC.
Sex is, don't forget, nice. It's not inherently something to flee from or be scared of.
I'm not wild about 'porn star' t-shirts for todlers myself, but opposition to such things (which are not, after all, bought by many people to actually dress DC in, except for the occasional wind-up) is attractive to the dysfunctional nuts who would rather see women covered from head to foot and all mention of sex prohibited.
We will never agree because we don't agree on the sanctity of life and that when couples come together they should always be open to life. I refer back to my previous posts and how I mentioned that to hand out contraception is just dealing with the symptoms and not the cause. I know you will come back with 'overpopulation' but have a look at this article:
www.lifeissues.net/writers/kas/kas_01overpopulation.html
The truth is that it is corruption and misuse of resources that cause poverty, not overpopulation.