I thought this was really interesting...

[Floopy21]

www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/photography/8063624/Where-children-sleep.html

yes it was intresting thank you

Yes, I saw this in the magazine on Saturday, it's quite harrowing actually, looking at the haves and the have-nots. I mean, we are all aware that there are some people who have everything and some who have barely anything, but at such a young age, the extreme contrast was a real eye-opener and really made me reflect on the injustice which we have always known about, but maybe on a more abstract level.

D

that's v interesting. And sad.

That is so sad. I want to show the DCs, but there's that dilemma - do I make them very aware of the harsh inequalities of the world, or will I upset them over something which at this stage in their lives they can do nothing about. How old is old enough, do you think?

Hassled, how old are they? I think even at quite an early stage, if they get nothing from it but a sense of gratefulness for what they do have, then I think that's still a good thing. And if they think they can do nothing about it, you can help them find small ways they can.

On the whole I tend to think children will process this kind of stuff on a level which they are able to deal with...

D

Hmm, I don't know.

While it was interesting, the comparison, I felt that it was too divisive. Not all Americans children are beauty queen contestants/gun nuts.

It was very much "we in the West are so spoiled and pampered", when for many this is not the case. There are plenty of American and British children living in poverty.

I think it's an important lesson to impart, you could chat about ways in which you can help others not so fortunate, other than just ££. IMO age 5/6 (depending on your child; you know them best obviously) is old enough to understand & act. The tribal girl in the article could start an interesting discussion, as could looking up all the different places on a map - it doesn't have to all be about poverty.

My youngest is 8 - most of the time he's not what one would call a sensitive flower but I know that this would prey on his mind for a long time and upset him hugely. But maybe that's not a bad thing? Obviously he knows about poverty elsewhere in the world, and inequalities within the UK - I think he knows he's lucky, but not quite how lucky.

Hassled, I think 8 yrs old is a good age to think and talk about these things. We did a project with our Brownies (and all Brownies/Guides and Rainbows across the country will have been involved to some extent) called 'Changing the World', and the girls were very enthusiastic about the ways in which they could help, and the results, although small in the general scheme of things, were impressive.

I understand you don't want him to dwell on it as a hopeless case that would upset him, but I think engaging in a positive way about inequality, and about how we can all fo a little bit to help, is a good thing.

I do agree with MdmeBody though that it was a bit of a sweeping generalisation re pampered rich kids in the west etc. Although in other ways it is all relative. Whilst there no is no denying that children live in poverty here and in the US, there are relatively few children in either country who don't have access to safe drinking water, education, and a roof (of some kind) over their heads. Not saying this means they're all fine and dandy, of course they're not, but not having those things is also the reality for kids in lots of countries, so I think context is important too.

D

I think I'll show this to my 8yr old later. I've always wanted to protect him from the harsher realities of life but lately we are talking about more things like the Holocaust, war, how poorer people live etc, he's seeing more on the news, even the radio on the way to school, many things definitely catch his interest and his 5 yr old sibling.

Don't know if they are suggesting though that every little girl from first wolrd/developed countries are like the first 2.

"Whilst there no is no denying that children live in poverty here and in the US, there are relatively few children in either country who don't have access to safe drinking water, education, and a roof (of some kind) over their heads. Not saying this means they're all fine and dandy, of course they're not, but not having those things is also the reality for kids in lots of countries"

Poverty in the UK is now measured on a relative scale, it takes no account of peoples abilities to access the necessaries of life. Using the current measure of poverty in this country you could double everyone's income and you'd still have exactly the same % labelled as "poor".

You clearly can't compare that relative definition of poverty to the real and absolute poverty in the third world where people can't get food or water.

Ending poverty here is a social campaign with an agenda of equalising peoples incomes.

Ending poverty in third world is about saving lives.

fascinating! joey is quite scary isn't he

i will show my son too

BadgersPaws, yes I agree you can't compare the two, which I guess is what I was trying to say. There is poverty here, there is poverty there, this is what it's like for these people, this is what it's like for those people', etc.

I didn't mean to undermine the experiences of people living in poverty here in the UK, but I do think it's sometimes difficult to communicate the difference to children, who might think poor = poor, no matter where you live. I don't mean that one is more or less deserving of help than the other though...

Eeek, I don't know what I'm trying to say really... I agreed with MdmeBody that there was a bit of a generalisation, but also felt that there actually is in real life as well, as poor does not = poor wherever you are... I think I'm going to shut up now.

D

I have a lovely book called if the world was a village which says that if the world was a village of 100 people then 12% would go to school or 80% would speak chineese etc - it's a good book to start of these conversations.

I'm shocked by the boy in Italy.
How sad.

BadgersPaws
I agree that poverty for a child in UK is rarely life-threatening in the way it is in many third world countries.

I still feel that the photos show a distorted vision of life for children in the world by showing the most extreme of each country.

It would have had more impact for me if they had shown normal, everyday kids in UK or America. The ridiculousness of the pampered Japanese child in comparison to the child living in a rubbish dump means that the message is watered down.

If the comparison was to how our own children live, then it would have been a stronger comparison.

Not sure that makes sense, difficult to explain what I mean.

Both examples are too extreme, it is difficult to relate to either of them.

very very sad, but glad i saw it as i think i will introduce ds to it. he is 5 and i think he will be able to deal with this without dwelling on it or feeling that sense of helplessness. i think at his age, and knowing ds as i do, i don't think it would reach him on an emotional level rather on a factual level. as in "some chidlren live like this." at least at his age, this is teh way i will be explaining it to him.

MmeBody I think I agree with you. If they had showed more gradients, rather than just the extremes, it would overall have been more informative. But less shocking, which I suppose was part of the point...

I do agree though.

D

Yes, the shock value is greater as it is, and that is what they are aiming for.

Thing is, I think that the pictures and the stories of the children in Nepal or Cambodia are shocking in themselves, even without the spoiled Westerners.

it's all relative as well. A 'poor' child in the UK might not be in such dire straits as some of those pictured but will feel it hugely if he realises how much better off some of his classmates are etc. And, some of these kids pictured (like the Somalian girl) might be perfectly happy if they are living in the same circumstances as the rest of the village and don't view themselves as being disadvantaged or poor. It's not necessarily awful having to share a small apartment or room with lots of siblings, many of us grew up like this in similar neighbourhoods and were perfectly happy. The kids having to work in terrible conditions, treat of war or violence, lack of food and medicine etc as another matter.

i agree fastedwina.

as a child i didn't know of riches. i knew what was around me and we were happy. when looking at those pictures i actually thought i bet the girl in the tribe has a pretty happy life (apart from the thought of her circumcision looming ). it was the child who lived on a mattress by teh roadside and the ones who worked 6 hours a day in the quarry and only had one meal that struck me as really poor.