Popes visit costing UK taxpayer £12 million

[Beaaware]

I read in the papers that the popes forthcoming visit will cost the UK taxpayer £12 million! Seems rather a lot of money at a time when the government are telling us to expect huge cuts. How important is this visit and is it value for money for the taxpayer?

Shrieking - personally I'd quite happily have cancelled both the Olympics and the Pope's visit. On cost ground for both but moral grounds for the Pope.

Well I was in Bellahouston today and IMO it was worth every penny of the tax payers money. Thousands upon thousands of Catholics cheering on the Pope. God bless you Benedict! An amazing experience.

Agree completely Bilbo! I'm another one who thinks the Pope's visit is worth every penny I can appreciate that non-Christians would not agree, but taxpayers money is spent on a huge variety of things and we cannot agree with all of them. The Pope's visit is giving A LOT of catholics the chance to celebrate what they believe in, and it's also promoted a lot of healthy discussion, both of which are very good things imo.

Bit of a shame about the whole paedophile ring child rape thing though.

Thousands of kids raped. That we know about, many many thousands more likely raped.

Church refuses to hand over evidence.

Nice.

Praise him praise him.

He looks so sweet in his nice gold dress.

"Church refuses to hand over evidence."

That's the least of the Church's sins about child abuse. They covered it up, moved accused paedophiles to other areas where they were free to abuse yet more children, threatened victims into keeping quiet and allowed paedophiles to retain their positions within the church.

"nice to know some of the moeny dh and I have paid in taxes has allowed him to brand us as nazis"

Takes one to know one.

Sorry, couldn't resist...

I knew that all this negativity would have to creep in pretty soon, but for once I just don't care! Seeing all those people on the news last night out to support the Pope has proven beyond a doubt to me that there are a lot of others out there who still want to celebrate being Catholic... and a thousand posts on condoms and paedophiles etc... cannot take away that fact

all this negativity

well that's one way to describe the reaction to the money-grabbing, land-hogging, woman-hating, paedophile-protecting loonies led by a nazi I guess.

Praise be.

yeah, right. How on earth do they get that figure?

Are there going to be threads about cost every time there's a state visit? I didn't see any when Sarkosy was over the other year, or Zuma. Or is it just because it's the Pope and the visit is controversial for other reasons?

I guess real heads of state do visit each other all the time. Just one of those things. The Pope isn't in charge of a country that we have trade relationships with, though.

"Are there going to be threads about cost every time there's a state visit? I didn't see any when Sarkosy was over the other year, or Zuma."

Sarkozy and Zuma are undeniably Heads of State.

The Pope's status is far more complicated and far from clear cut or obvious. See my earlier posts but in short it involves understanding the Holy See, the Holy See's difference from Vatican City, International Law and Mussolini's dubious actions in 1929.

The last Papal visit was not done under the guise of him being a Head of State. And since then the whole issue of Child Abuse within the Catholic Church has been exposed and AIDS has highlighted the Church's stance on condoms.

So this visit was bound to be far more controversial.

"money-grabbing, land-hogging, woman-hating, paedophile-protecting loonies led by a nazi"

hully who are you referring to when you say this?

I agree it is uplifting to a lot of Catholics to be able to celebrate their faith in so public a way, particularly after the horror of the child abuse scandal. Try to remember that most Catholics worship God, not the Pope.

It's the adoration of the Pope that gets me. He's only a man and a learned theologian with a penchant for the high life and archaic dress.

The sheer extravagance of his lifestyle that gets me. He reminds me of an absolute monarch with all the pagentry and excess that surrounds him. That flamboyance and the papal message of no women priests, no contracptives, maintenance of the church over paedophiles, anti- homosexual and, I'm afraid to say, latent anti-jewish and muslim stance, seems utterly divorced from ordinary Roman Catholics in the UK and their faith/church/community. I find it hard to see why catholics identify with him.

"As the supreme head of state for Vatican City, I would surmise that his status is no different to Mugabe etc."

Read above, yes it is, it's very different.

The Pope is the Head of the Holy See and it is the Holy See that he and his ambassadors represent and it is the Holy See that issues those Diplomatic Passports. Likewise it is the Holy See that countries have diplomatic relations with.

The Vatican City State was created in 1929 by Mussolini as a bit of hand waving to try and get around the whole issue of the Pope not being a proper "Head of State".

However the Church kept the separation of the territory of Vatican City and the Holy See. So the Holy See has no territory, which by international law means that it is not a state, but on the other hand it has recognised ambassadors (and had them even before the creation of Vatican City State), which only a state can have.

So his status is different and questionable.

I'm not saying that he isn't a Head of State, or that is is. What I am saying is that you can't claim that it's simple and obvious.

Ah ignore that, it was a reply to something on the end of Page 1, whoops...

Why aren't the catholic church paying for it then? After all, they won't let us send our children to their schools with the self-funded arguement. I don't see why I as an atheist tax-payer should ontribute to a visit that means absolutely nothing to me.

Plus if he's here as a "head of state", rather than head of a church, why has so much of his activity since he's been here involved the usual incense-waving, incantation and muttering and denouncing of the heathen aggressive secular atheist evil godless? You don't see Barack Obama or Jacques Chirac doing any of that on their "state" visits.

Amused that the Sun has ignored the child abuse cover-up angle and gone for the earth-shattering news that the Pope likes Fanta and wears red shoes. Red shoes??! Is this in case he gets into trouble? He just has to click the heels together three times and say 'There's no place like Rome!' and he'll be instantly transported back to the Vatican.

"the earth-shattering news that the Pope likes Fanta"

Fanta? The Nazi Coke?

Orange Fanta, apparently.

I don't read the Sun, btw, I just look at the pictures browse it in Smiths.

All the insults in the world wont make a blind bit of difference to catholics who want to see the pope. It didn't in Scotland yesterday, and hasnt today in London.
Where are all the protesters though? I was looking forward to reading all the banners,- People have spent hours painting them bless em.