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Original poster

Electric problems ?

93 replies

Margaritte · 07/06/2015 10:22

I'm not sure if I've posted in the right place? DH cooked crumpets under the grill for DC this morning., and I washed up when they had finished. When I washed up the tray that had been used, I put it behind the draining board upright & as it touched the tap, I got a shock. I wiped down the kitchen sides, and when I wiped over the top of the oven I got 2 ore shocks. So I switched it off at the wall, and that also gave me a shock Confused

What does this mean? DH came in & tried and he didn't feel anything, although he didn't have a soapy hands / damp cloth.

OP posts:
Original poster
Margaritte · 07/06/2015 19:29

Has anyone had this problem before? Can I do anything that will keep the food good until the landlord manages to get someone out?

OP posts:
Pumpeedo · 07/06/2015 19:31

Switch off at mains but don't open fridge, freezer, etc. Monitor if you get any more shocks when mains are off. Re the frozen/chilled food, you should be able to switch back on after 4 hours or so without affecting quality or safety of food. Hopefully your landlord will get back to you by then.

BishopBrennansArse · 07/06/2015 19:31

Keep fridge/freezer doors shut. Don't open unless absolutely necessary.

Donthate · 07/06/2015 19:35

Has anyone else felt the shocks OP?

specialsubject · 07/06/2015 19:52

as everyone else is saying, OP, keep the freezer shut and it will be fine for 24 hours if not longer. Things in the fridge also last longer than you think; assuming you are in the UK it isn't that hot.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 07/06/2015 19:53

The thing is, it might be static electricity and it might not be. No-one here can say. The OP has not previously been shocked in this way, and feels it is a "proper" electric shock, not static. She could send her DP and DC around the house touching things to see if they get a shock....

Fridge/freezer should be food for several hours (exact times would be in the manual)

If you really don't want to turn it off you could sit tight and avoid touching anything conductive - that could be a bit tricky though...

EnlightenedOwl · 07/06/2015 20:01

Have you a friend/ relative (even the landlord!!) who could maybe store your freezer stuff for you

Psipssina · 07/06/2015 20:05

OP, if you need the landline then you will have to leave it on and just avoid touching anything metal. Don't go in the kitchen, don't even put a foot in there - and do NOT test anything for them if they ring you back and say 'can you just turn on such and such' NO.

Emphasise to them that you have food in the freezer, no landline without power, and that you would appreciate someone calling to your home tonight to sort this potentially fatal issue out.

Don't go in there to turn anything on or off, don't touch any switches if you can help it - now is the time to get some torches ready for when it gets dark.

And if they don't have an RCD in the house then no, they are not good landlords. This is mandatory, and they are avoiding legal requirements.

Original poster
Margaritte · 07/06/2015 20:10

OK, could someone please explain to me how to post a picture up of the box behind the cooker?

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 07/06/2015 20:11

Take a picture on your phone.

Click on the paperclip icon below the box in which you type your message. Choose the picture. Type something. Post.

PigletJohn · 07/06/2015 20:18

"She could send her DP and DC around the house touching things to see if they get a shock"

Christ, no.

It is not the box behind the cooker, it is the consumer unit (fusebox) which will be near the electricity meter. Seeing it will give us an idea of the age, quality and condition of the installation, and the wires and cables around it will give clues about main bonding. It will not remove the need for professional testing.

specialsubject · 07/06/2015 20:25

RCDs are not mandatory in England/Wales rentals, same as they aren't in owned houses. They are only mandatory if there is an outdoor socket. Electrical regs.

decent electrics are of course mandatory - but things go wrong in even the best installations.

the landlord cannot magic up an electrician. OP says he is a good landlord and has proved to be on the case before, but it is still not always possible to produce instant professional help. However it is good management to call the OP back and explain progress, and promise the next call (and keep to that). This is how you deal with customers.

we all have to learn to cope when things fail in houses, whether we are owners or tenants. So we all need to keep a torch with charged batteries, a corded landline phone and so on.

fortunately it is June, so it isn't cold and it won't be dark for very long.

Psipssina · 07/06/2015 20:40

Apologies SS I was under the impression that an electrical safety cert was requisite these days, and that requires an RCD/new consumer unit? Must be some agents who require it. Ours certainly did.

OP - are you posting on a PC? If so there should be an images option at the bottom of the thread, under the box you type in.

If you have a photo uploaded onto your PC, you click on browse and it will offer you a selection of images to choose from - you click on one and press 'open' and it will appear in your post.

Original poster
Margaritte · 07/06/2015 22:08

Sorry haven't been back on yet - was trying to get this all sorted. Landlord called back, and turns out it was the yellow & green wires (?) in the airing cupboard that stops the electricity running through the water wipes. one had come loose from behind the little washer type thing.

Landlord told DH to put it back, and then all should be ok. [??]

OP posts:
PigletJohn · 07/06/2015 22:34

loose secondary bonding itself cannot cause a shock. Furthermore, if only one had come loose, and the others were connected, then the bonding circuit would still continue through the copper pipes into the cylinder, and back out again into the cold feed and taps, hot supply and taps, and primary circuit to boiler. We like to bond each pipe individually as a "belt and braces" overkill.

The boiler and/or immersion heater will also bond the plumbing (unless you have plastic pipes) and so will the main bonds (if present), especially if you have a gas boiler. These fortuitous bonds are not officially considered to be reliable, as they are not calculated and measured, but they usually do the job anyway.

Even if both main and secondary bonds were all missing, you would not get a shock unless there was also an electrical fault.

Original poster
Margaritte · 07/06/2015 23:14

So I still need to disconnect, or get the oven changed?

OP posts:
Original poster
Margaritte · 07/06/2015 23:22

Sorry, I meant get the oven fuse changed?

OP posts:
PigletJohn · 07/06/2015 23:33

you need to get an electrician to trace the fault.

I gather there is no letting agent here.

As I understand that you got a multiple shocks from the oven (you mean cooker?) and one from a tap, and one from the wall switch (is it metal?) then I doubt the cause is the oven/cooker unless you had one hand on it all the time while you were touching the other things. Even if the cooker did have a fault (e.g. oven element insulation broken down with age), it should have an earth connection which would (1) protect you (2) cause the fuse or breaker to cut the power.

You can only get a shock if you are touching two conductive parts at the same time. E.g. any two of sink/drainer, cooker, metal switch, pipe, boiler, radiator, metal kettle, metal toaster, damp floor, damp wall, metal knife rack screwed to wall (if the screw has gone into a hidden cable). Bathrooms are especially worrisome as the person may have wet skin (which lowers resistance) which is exposed to touch, plus there are metal pipes and taps. A proper UK installation will be smothered in multiple protective measures intended to make you safe, but in your case, at least one of them has failed or is not properly done. Older installations still have protective earth conductors for metal appliances and plumbing to protect you from shock, even though they are not obliged to have RCDs. The wonderful UK 3-pin plug is part of the protective design.

Still looking forward to those photos.

If you are on a PC (not a mobile) look for a box marked "Images....Browse" under the "Add your message here" box.

If you know how to copy photos to your PC, you can "browse" to the directory where you copied them to. If you connect your phone or camera to the PC you can probably browse to them on that.

PigletJohn · 07/06/2015 23:34

the fuse is 100% irrelevant.

Psipssina · 08/06/2015 07:42

Oh God your landlord is 100% incorrect. Please don't mess about - ask them to call an electrician of their choice, or if all else fails, call one yourself.

You absolutely cannot continue to live in this house until the fault has been found. The bonding he is talking about (yellow and green wires) is NOT the cause - it is a protective measure that should be in place in case of fault. The fact you're getting shocks when it is undone, means there is a fault, and one which needs sorting out or it could prove fatal.

Normally even without bonding, there would be no shocks to be had from anything no matter how hard you tried or how wet your feet were.

It's a back up, and in a way it's good that it's failed, because now you know there's a major problem.

PLEASE get an electrician out TODAY at all costs. It's Monday - it won't be so dear for the call out, and then you can get them to speak to the landlord and explain what is wrong and what it will cost to fix.

I'm going to fret about you till I hear otherwise Smile

Original poster
Margaritte · 08/06/2015 09:18

Ok, so DH checked the fuse box behind the oven last night, after sorting out green & yellow wires. I spoke to landlord again, and they are sure the problem is fixed now. They are calling back in a while
Could it be the oven itself? I don't really know what to do other than that really Confused I cant afford to call an electrician out.

I understand what everyone is saying, I just don't know what I'm meant to do about it.

OP posts:
magimedi · 08/06/2015 09:52

I would insist to the landlord that he send a qualified electrician round to check it all.

Just (gently) remind him of what the consequences could be for him, as well as you, if he doesn't & there is an ongoing fault. Be polite but very firm with him.

specialsubject · 08/06/2015 10:25

oh dear. Not good.

as the others say - the landlord needs to provide a competent and registered electrician. The earth bonding should not be loose but that would not cause this problem.

yes, it will cost the landlord money. That's not your problem.

time to make that call back, remind the landlord of his obligations and say that you really don't want to involve environmental health.

Psipssina · 08/06/2015 10:36

I think you need to be very assertive here. Sorry. Can you call the council at all? They have an environmental health dept and they also have a private tenants' advisor.
If you speak to them, they will send someone out to check it, not a a spark but someone who advises tenants if their property is fit for habitation and so on.
Explain that you are very concerned, (by the way your DH should not have done any of that - he could have had a very nasty shock, and it isn't his job) and that you have had shocks from various items and that your LL won't do anything about it.
They will tell you what to do.

Sorry you're in this position. BTW some electricians do free call out, and that way you could get a professional opinion and use that to back you up, without/before paying for any works, which hopefully your LL will then agree to do.

How long are you hoping to stay in this rental? If you don't mind me asking.

Psipssina · 08/06/2015 10:37

Also it IS a legal requirement that the electrical system is SAFE. They are breaking the law and putting your lives and those of your children at risk.

Don't use your shower atm, till it's been checked.