Would you worry about qualifications?

[musicposy]

Hi there, our elder daughter has just turned 13. The Secondary LA bloke came round just before Christmas and was very refreshing - we were worrying about GCSEs etc, and whether she would need to eventually return to school. He said to write to all the places and careers she might want at 16/ 18, and find out what she needs to achieve.

Well, we've written to dance schools, ballet schools, performing arts colleges, employers such as holiday companies etc. She wants to do something in dance.

The overwhelming response we've got is that they couldn't give two hoots about her GCSEs. I'm not sure I wanted this response because it obviously hasn't motivated her towards studying! I've told a few people and they were utterly shocked. They've all said "well, of course you need good GCSEs". But it seems if you want to be a dancer, performer, holiday camp worker (we're talking redcoat type stuff) or the like, you don't, actually. They want to see that a)she's not just dropped out and is doing something useful with her time, and b) they care about how good a dancer and performer she is, nothing else. Holiday camps also want experience with children (which she is getting, she helps her ballet teacher with the little ones). A few places said they looked for 5 GCSEs or equivalent but added the proviso "but we don't care what grades, we don't look at those".

Now I'm in a dilemma. She's a clever girl and the school had her in the 10 A* GCSE type track. Am I selling her short if we don't bother much with GCSEs? What if she changes her mind career-wise later on? Do you think that if you can get into a top university, you should?
On the other hand, am I selling her short if I take up her time studying loads of miscellaneous subjects when she could be doing ballet practice?

Only 4 months into home ed and I feel we have some choices to make that will affect her whole life! But I know some people like Julie have been here before, with home educating teenagers, so I wondered what everyone's take on it was. Thanks for all advice, whatever your opinion!

That's an interesting link Onward, though I don't see why anyone thinks they're "keeping their options open" by narrowing them down to ones with a focus on academic or financial success.

I don't think any of the "pro-qualifications" posts on here are saying that musicposy's dd should stop focussing on being a dancer and instead focus on getting 10 good GCSEs in order to have more options. What I'm saying is "Yes, focus on being a dancer, but it's worth having a backup plan".

Many very talented dancers, musicians, etc can't make a living out of performance and do other things - some of them teach, work in music shops, repair instruments etc. But lots of them also end up with a "day job" which is not what they love doing, but pays the bills and funds their evenings and weekends, or else they intersperse periods of fulltime performing with fulltime temp jobs.

Qualifications won't help her with the dancing, but they are likely to make it easier to pick up a "day job".

Of course she could get qualifications later if she wants/needs them, but for me it seems much simpler and more convenient to do them now.

Balance dancing + qualifications now.
OR Balance dancing + qualifications + earning a living later.

She might be lucky and never want/need qualifications, so it is a bet to some extent.

If the choice now had to be dancing OR qualifications, I'd say "follow your dream" and don't worry about qualifications. But if it's not that big a deal to get some now, then it's simpler to do than it would be later.

AMumInScotland's post is excellent.

Shouldn't be about giving up dreams, but about evaluating the possible need for a back-up plan.

Our friend's dd went to RADA and did, I believe, do very well there: she still hasn't been able to make a living from it.

SO it is partly at looking at your dancing dispassionately and asking how good am I going to be? Am I going to be one of the tiny percentage whose future is assured? (Presumably if you're DArcey Bussell standard, you can go into teaching once your own dancing career is over and will never need a job outside of dancing).

Or is it likely that mine will be the kind of career that needs a bit of gap-filling from time to time?

Maybe talk to her dancing teacher too.

I think, all things weighed up, she will do some qualifications, but we won't drive ourselves crazy in the process. One ballet school have said they would like 5 or equivalent, including English, Maths and Science, just to show she can apply herself (it's because they effectively tke you on a degree course at 16) and I'd have thought we could do one or two a year without too much effort. Even though most don't want them, the one place that said they do she is quite keen on, having had a friend train there, so she says she doesn't want to limit her choices.

Who knows whether she will make a full time career performing? We know that she's good -she always gets high distinctions for all her dance exams and usually gets picked for the things she auditions for. Like most things when you are very "into" them, we tend to see the same people over and over again at auditions and at things we've done such as summer schools and youth ballet work, so you do get an idea of how you measure up to others. And currently I'd say she's looking very promising and measures up well against her peers, but there are definitely others who stand out more - and it is a very competitive world.

I think we will try to find a happy medium between giving her more time to dance and between getting some qualifications. I'm looking at the ones that don't have coursework and I think we are going to come out with a very unusual mix of stuff copmared to school, though!

Our big disappointment was that one of the things she asked was whether they would take high music grades in place of GCSE music (she is currently Grade 4 in both piano and singing, so a 5 or 6 shouldn't be any problem by then). Most places said no, which is a shame because they are supposed to be accredited as equal and carry UCAS points. Most people said they liked to see an instrument but if they were looking for qualifications they wouldn't count.

Hi musicposy - if you're looking at courses which don't need coursework, it's worth looking at the iGCSEs, if you can get an exam centre somewhere near you, as they can all be done without marked coursework.

It's a shame they don't take the music grades - I know Grade 6 and up get UCAS points on a par with AS levels, which I think is fair given how much they have to work for them, but I guess the GCSE covers a different range of stuff.

I don't think it's a bad idea to get qualifications! But I think it's a better idea to have an idea of what one wants qualifications for - to have a goal in mind and to be pursuing that goal rather than just to be going through the standard mincing machine of 9 GCSEs and then 5 AS levels and then 3 A levels and then a degree and then a law conversion course and then articles and then 40 years of working and then taking up golf or bridge in retirement and then dying. I mean, if those things would truly fulfil someone, then of course they should follow that path, but if not then why spend one's life jumping through the conventional hoops?

That's all. Not GCSEs are pointless, but if you're going to do GCSEs, make sure you know what you're doing them for. Make sure they have a purpose. (and really, like various of us have said, doing a GCSE is only really a big deal if you spend 2 years doing it at school from 14-16. If you just had fun learning and then at 15 or 16 decided you wanted to do 5 GCSEs, it would be massively more efficient that way because you'd be learning at your own pace for your own goal of getting the piece of paper.

To a point I agree with onward. Definitely your dd should follow her dreams and go for it if she has talent.

But if this is something the ballet schools are going to be looking for, then it makes sense to have them. And if she is generally bright and dedicated, then it needn't be a massive chore- far less so than for someone who is just doing them because they're expected to, without any ideas of what they might actually want them for.

Im late in joining this discussion but ime 5 gcses are really useful - especially in Maths and English, possibly science/humanities

A lot of employers ime want prove of acheivement in key subjects.