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Home ed

Find advice from other parents on our Homeschool forum. You may also find our round up of the best online learning resources useful.

But what if ? - Pearls of wisdom needed

24 replies

messymind · 29/04/2008 13:58

I really want to Home Educate my ds age 7 and dd age 4, but I am so worried about letting them down in some way. I keep coming back to a few worries which are, what if I can?t teach my daughter to read and write and she ends up illiterate, or they get bored and fed up of me, or I miss out something important. What really is important? What if they want to go back to school (Senior school) and they are lacking somewhere or we haven?t used the correct way of working out? Or my daughter can?t cope because she has never been to school. Please help me to gain some perspective on this.

Ds is dyslexic and very creative he is at the moment sat on SEN table all day for school work but is on G&T list for his creativity/imaginative thought. I know that school is not meeting his needs in either area and he finds his work very hard. He is not unhappy at school and has lots of friends and enjoys being on the school council. I am all set to deregister him, and for his sister to never go to school at all. I?ve read lots of the books recommended and can totally understand why Home Education is so good for children, I just worry that I might be the only one who gets it wrong.

If at the end of their Primary years they can read, write and have all the basic numeracy skills as well as the general knowledge that they find so easy to learn, is that enough? I don?t want to follow the National Curriculum at home, but I want them to have choices and if they wanted to go back to school I would not want them to be at a disadvantage.

Would any of you be kind enough to have a go at addressing my fears? I don?t want to keep on sending him to school if there is a better way for him and I want to cry at the thought of my daughter starting, but I am paralysed by my own fear of letting them down ? thanks if you managed to get to the end!

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Julienoshoes · 29/04/2008 15:52

Hello messymind
Your fears are very common.

Have you managed to find any home educators locally to talk to in real life?
I found that enormously beneficial. You will find that so many had the same fears as you and can talk about their educational provision and how it all happens.

There is a thread here about finding other home educators.

What about talking to other home educators in a internet support list?
There will be many people who have very similar fears to you and have managed to over come them, on the HE Special Needs email support list

Our children are all dyslexic and had a variety of difficulties when they left school aged 13, 11 and 8. In the end we recognised that if we could help restore their self confidence and self belief then they would be able to get out there and get whatever else they needed to, in order to succeed in life.
Talking to other home educated youngsters help us to come to this-it is obvious when a child is set free to follow his own interests he cannot help but learn-you cannot fail them.
We now know loads and loads of home educated young people and are convinced this is the very best way of learning.

Alan Thomas has a new book How Children Learn at Homethat might be useful.

Synopsis
In his "Educating Children at Home", Alan Thomas found that many home educating families chose or gravitated towards an informal style of education, radically different from that found in schools. Such learning, also described as unschooling, natural or autonomous, takes place without most of the features considered essential for learning in school. At home there is no curriculum or sequential teaching, nor are there any lessons, textbooks, requirements for written work, practice exercises, marking or testing. But how can children who learn in this way actually achieve an education on a par with what schools offer? In this new research, Alan Thomas and Harriet Pattison seek to explain the efficacy of this alternative pedagogy through the experiences of families who have chosen to educate their children informally.Based on interviews and extended examples of learning at home the authors explore: the scope for informal learning within children's everyday lives; the informal acquisition of literacy and numeracy; the role of parents and others in informal learning; and, how children proactively develop their own learning agendas

IlanaK · 29/04/2008 16:16

You know, I think one of the things I have learned over the last 2 years of home ed is that you will always have doubts. Not all the time, but every so often. Sometimes you will feel things are going great, and sometimes you will have days where you wonder if you are doing the right thing. But from talking to friends with children in school, it is no different. They always have doubts about whether it is the right school etc.

messymind · 29/04/2008 16:52

Hi Julienoshoes thanks for your reply it has really helped.

I have recently joined EO and I am just waiting for them to send me a pack, the local contact for Lancashire has emailed me with a list of events so I will go down and have a chat with a few people.

I was totally convinced it was the right thing to do last week but then suddenly started to panic when the inevitable barrage of questions came from family, this then made me doubt myself and then typically my ds has had a great week at school which has made me even more confused.

Thanks for the link to the book I will order that as it seems just what I am looking for. I guess I'm just scared of the unknown, but I'm not happy with what we've got either. The temptation is just to keep going and muddle along as that's the line of least resistance, but it just all feels so wrong and such hard work for ds. I want my dc to have a fun, happy childhood and if they can learn whilst enjoying themselves then that is by far the best option, I guess I just need to step back and trust them which is easier said than done.

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messymind · 29/04/2008 17:20

Hi IlanaK yes you're right. I'm always worried and anxious about school as I feel quite helpless really. I want my children to have some control over their learning. They are both very practical and need to "do" things rather than just see things.

Actually you've made me think, life is just a series of doubts about decisions we make with the best of intentions, the hard part of this decision is that nobody will bat an eyelid if they failed whilst at school, even though their education is my responsibility at school, it is accepted that school has done the best it can, but if I take them out the book stops with me.

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BeNimble · 29/04/2008 17:45

messymind... it's really freaky, your last paragraph just sums up what i've been thinking about in the past hour!

BeNimble · 29/04/2008 17:52

we're in lancs, but we've no experience with schools, my children are only 3 and 4 years. you should get some good info from pam (local contact). there seem to be quite a few folks around... best if you've got transport though.

i can relate to your doubts, especially as they are the sort of worries that family and friends chirp up with too.

messymind · 29/04/2008 18:08

BeNimble great minds and all that

It's not easy this motherhood stuff you're wrong no matter what you do. I guess I need to do what's best for my dc, and not what other people percive to be best for them. Now what would be best for them? and so the loop continues

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AMumInScotland · 29/04/2008 19:50

It might help to remember that the schools will still be there in a year or 2 if you don't find home ed suits you after all. Even if you were starting with older children, there will still be options on schools or colleges if you or they decide on a change of direction. I HE my DS (14) at the moment - it's going well, but I've always had the backup plan that he could start college if things change (or even if not - we're only taking this a year or to at a time)

That makes it feel a bit less daunting, I find

messymind · 29/04/2008 21:03

Thanks AMumInScotland it does help to think of it as a year at a time.

I am probably thinking of the future far too much and should just look at our situation right now, plus I have never read about anyone who felt that home ed was the wrong decision for them, even when children have later returned to school, they all seem to have benefited from home ed.

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AMumInScotland · 29/04/2008 21:13

I've heard of lots of people who only planned to home ed for a short time to deal with a particular situation, but then carried on. And I've heard of others who then did go back to school and were confident and academically fine. But I can't think of any who regretted having done it.

And, as far as making them learn goes, I think short of locking them in a cupboard and never speaking to them, you can't go far wrong - children are naturally curious about things and will pick things up. As you say, so long as they manage basic literacy and numeracy, there isn't a particular list of things you have to know in life - what's far more important is being interested in things and knowing how to go about learning them when you want/need them.

messymind · 29/04/2008 21:58

I think I need to deschool!!
You see all this national curriculum and sats stuff makes me think that if we jump off the mad merry-go-round of school for a while, they might miss an important bit which then means they will not understand the next bit if they went back to school if that makes any sense? Is that really the case though? or is it what schools would like us to believe?

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Julienoshoes · 29/04/2008 23:14

messymind
When our ds was deregistered the head teacher of the high school, asked "what about the National Curriculum?" and when I told him we didn't have to follow it, he said "Oh for the pleasure of teaching a child what he wants to learn!"
I have heard similar sentiments many times over from teachers since then.

Remember too that SATS are meant to test the teachers and the school-NOT the child. They are actually of no use to the child.

I remember being surprised as well, when I realised that you actually need 11 years of schooling to do GCSEs, you don't need GCSEs to do A levels and you don't actually need A levels to get into University.

Our eldest went to FE college post 16 and did two GCSEs on one day a week.
He used those two GCSEs to get into another FE college where he did A levels (and did very well.)

Our daughters have chosen to go a different route-and would certainly ask why would anyone want a child to be restricted to things only covered by the NC?

At 18 our daughter got herself the job she wanted, with a very well known national organisation, without any GCSEs/A levels. Instead her CV listed her life experiences as including working 20 hrs a week in a small retail outlet and managing it whilst she was there, working for a mobile internet company developing mobile internet sites for some well known names, helping to run workshops for women who have been victims of domestic violence, co-chairing the launch of a new dyslexia charity with a well known dyslexia expert from the USA and spending two long summers sailing around the British Isles helping to crew the boat, navigate and look after three young children,

Now she is working a at a job she loves and saving for her Competent Crew sailing certificate.

Our younger daughter is 15 now. She left school aged 8 unable to read or spell a single word-not even her own name.
Now she can read and spell very well indeed-the same cannot be said of the schooled peers in the remedial class that she left behind.

Each day we follow whatever her current interests are. Right now we are choosing another OU course, looking at "Tall Ships" sailing options, focusing on geography/longitude and latitude, and philosophy. All of this is her choice.
We are looking at a maths course on managing finances. Managing her diary is also a focus, as she needs to fit her education around the gigs that are being booked, as she sings with band, meaning she also travels a lot around the country.
There are also five or six HE camps and other festivals to fit in this summer too!

She has a small budget to manage herself to fund travelling expenses and clothes for performances etc, which she often spends shopping on ebay for a bargain, altering her outfits as necessary.
She now travels independently around the country, managing train and bus time tables on her own, as the guys in the band we all formerly home educated, but are now at college and live about 80 miles away from us.
Travelling independently was not something I ever imagined she would be able to do, when I was told she would need one to one support all through her schooling years.

She enjoys being on MSN-again very helpful in helping her to learn to read and spell without pressure-both of which she does very well and she is very adept at IT skills too now.

And of course I haven't touched on all of the educational content of all of the purposive conversations we have every day, again conversations usually instigated by dd2 and answering whatever needs she has at that time.
Yesterday's conversations included, the voting system in the UK, local and national Government and proportional representation-all very topical at the moment.
We have also be discussing further conservation issues, veganism and dietary needs and how this can impact the environment.
She also has a continuing interest in the root and language base of words and so have been researching with dictionaries, a thesaurus and the internet. A lot of English Idiom has come up too so we have been researching and discussing that too!
She also really enjoys philosophy and we have just arranged to hold a philosophy debating evening at one of the home ed holidays we are booked to go on.
Last year at the same camp, we did lots of kayaking, cycling, treasure trails and one evening the kids organised a complete "Master Chef" programme themselves without any adult input!
There was lots of wild garlic and young nettles, so the six teams of two people could cook any two course meals as long as they used those two ingredients.
They filmed the whole thing and my dd was the commere. They had judges and they also filmed commercial breaks! The whole thing was brilliant!

Mt dd also lead a group of teens locally to pitch for funding for their dram project last summer.
They got £1500 and designed their costumes and had them made, designed and built their props and recorded the music and performed twice at Malvern Street theatre and twice at Hereford World Conservation day. You can see their picture at the bottom of our local HE website

I don't think our children are unusual in the home ed teens that we know-and we know literally hundreds now.
I know of a home educated young person who is at Oxford doing Law, having bypassed GCSEs/A levels altogether and going straight for an OU course to use as evidence of his ability to study at the required level.
Another friend was 'invited to apply' to a university to do a Paediatric Nursing degree after attending the open days and chatting to the tutors. She too had gone the OU route. Others use the OU to complete their degrees and avoid university debts altogether.
Another mom on this forum, has a son who did do GCSE and A levels -at his own pace-and is now the youngest person ever to do a PhD in medical research at his University.
I do think it is true that our youngsters are likely to 'think outside the box' more than others perhaps.
I know young people who have joined circus schools and some who have successfully started their own business.

If you are interested in the work of Alan Thomas there is an article to keep you going until you get the copy of his latest book, comparing informal and formal home education
and also the last chapter of his previous book "Educating Children at home" can be found on the EO website:A Different Kind of Education

I also like another article from the EO website: Organic Structure by Ian Wild.

hth

Julienoshoes · 29/04/2008 23:16

oops! sorry that of course was meant to read "You DON'T actually need to do 11 years of schooling to do GCSEs"

Why do I never see these mistakes until after i press 'post message'?

Julienoshoes · 30/04/2008 08:34

Sorry I was tired when I wrote that last night.
The links for Alan Thomas there both lead to the same online article.
The final chapter of his previous book is here: [L=www.education-otherwise.org/Links/Research%20Papers/AT%20ADiffKEduc.htm A Different Kind of Education]]

Reading back the post, it sounds quite boastful maybe-I didn't mean it to be, I just wanted to demonstrate the sorts of things that are possible education that is possible when you leave the NC and SATS behind.

Not all children will choose to do all of this-my son spent loads of time on the PC and playing role play games and Warhammer(although he did also do lots of camps and gatherings.) He still isn't the most adventourous sort, much more of a home bird. The educational path of his choice though, got him to the stage where he could do A levels, get a job and consider Uni anyway.

Julienoshoes · 30/04/2008 08:35

AAgghh!
A Different Kind of Education!!

messymind · 30/04/2008 10:30

Wow Julienoshoes that is exactly what I needed to hear/read!. It doesn't sound boastful at all and is very inspiring
Thank you for all the links etc they are a great help and my book is on the way.

I really need to move mind away from the NC, we are led to believe that it is a kind of treadmill for education which I guess it is almost like you can't run before you can walk, but we like to run everywhere in this family and in all different directions

It is very good to know that the standard GCSE's, A Levels then onto Uni is not the only way to do it. It never suited me that way, and I could not wait to see the back of school, equally my fairly average GCSE results did not hold me back once in the world of work, to be honest I spent most of my time at school looking out of the window. It is this that has made me look for another way for my children, and it is also this that makes me doubt myself. I found learning to be hard and a chore not to mention very boring and therefore I now do my very best to not learn anything Does that make sense

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Julienoshoes · 30/04/2008 12:18

messymind
You said
"I found learning to be hard and a chore not to mention very boring and therefore I now do my very best to not learn anything"

You are right you do need to Deschool!

Julienoshoes · 30/04/2008 19:59

messymom
I just found this blog post about gaps in an education not getting in the way-and thought of you.

Julienoshoes · 30/04/2008 20:00

oops sorry I meant 'messymind'!

messymind · 30/04/2008 21:33

Thanks Julienoshoes I really appreciate the link. I am sometimes a messymom too!

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Janni · 30/04/2008 21:57

I don't HE but DS2 was at a Steiner School and we were desperately unhappy with his education. I knew I would have to teach him to read before we could move him. I followed a programme with him and within six months he was completely fluent. I was fitting this in between myriad other commitments and we were only spending about ten minutes a day. I think the teaching/learning thing will not be the big issue. It will be about how YOU get time to recharge your batteries and about how you all have enough time away from each other and the children have enough friends/activities so that you don't all get on each other's nerves.

Good luck!

milou2 · 30/04/2008 23:17

re not wanting to learn anything...I have been busy 'deschooling' for 3 months now with my son aged 10, ex yr 5. The sites use the phrase 'detoxing' too, they are so helpful.

We do fun stuff, so at the moment I am putting a lot of effort into doing Germbusters on my nintendo brain training. He got going on it today too. I hope he won't go crosseyed. He pays a lot of attention to car magazines, programmes and websites. I often say, but how on earth do you know that? he just smiles proudly.

We now have lots of random conversations, pretty much all initiated by him. He sets the pace, so all I have to do is follow his lead and be honest when I don't want to talk because I'm on mumsnet! I have learnt so much about cars it's unreal. He treats me as if I am a pupil sometimes and I hate it, but he's getting it out of his system. I want to teach you x now, but I don't want to know about x, it's boring, I'm quite happy reading about y thanks.

I'm sure the talking is the most important part for us at the moment. There's a lot of banter and negotiation. I can read his moods better and am much more relaxed so can cope with any challenging behaviour without getting into a shouting and bullying cycle.

I have found that it's like the pre-school years and also like the summer holidays. I have to be creative about getting time out, eg I have evening walks when my husband gets in. I also take advantage of any time to go out by myself and have a list of errands, special plans I can do anytime I am free.

messymind · 01/05/2008 10:26

I love the school holidays I am sure some people think I am odd but I do really enjoy having them around all day and doing things together. Having said that it is nice to have sometime to myself if only to think without the constant interruptions, and tidy up!

The thing is, now I know about Home Education I can't help thinking it would be a better way for my dc to live/learn.

My ds is generally happy at school but is finding the learning side of it hard, I guess I am just looking for ways to make it as easy and painless as possible.

We are big on talking in our family, in fact you have to be quick to catch the pauses if you want to speak When he was 6.5yrs he did some tests at school for reading, numeracy and spelling, and also the British picture vocab test, the reading, spelling and numeracy placed him about 6 months behind his age average, but his bpv score was that of a 9 year old, which may be why he finds school so frustrating, this is what prompted me to see if there was a different or better way for him to learn.

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Julienoshoes · 01/05/2008 11:53

messymind
The other place that would be good for support for you is the Early years HE support list which is attached to the lovely MuddlePuddle website, which is for families who home educate children under the age of about 8 ish.

There will be lots of parents there who have been in the situation you now find yourself.

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