Educational neglect???

[Rubyrainbow82]

So, I am concerned for my two nieces. They live 200 miles away from all of their family with just their mum and dad. They are 10 and 12 now and have NEVER had any form of education throughout their entire lives. They live a totally different lifestyle to to what we are used to which I totally understand everyone can do things how they want it's their lives after all. But I sometimes think it's borderline neglect and we clash a lot on these opinions when they are bought up. I have two children of my own, always been in education and are doing well at school and with friendships etc. I also work in a school so am very familiar with how the educational system works and is important for children of all ages. They on the other hand, do not work, and claim to 'home school' but when questioned what the home schooling involves the conversations become awkward. I don't believe they are or have ever provided any education for them in their lives. I feel as though they are very behind even socially. They have access to certain social media apps and I don't believe they are monitored very well on there. They claim to love the 'off grid' lifestyle and have very strong opinions on the normal working UK citizen and find our lives laughable that we get up every day and bring our children to school and then go to work to pay the government... 'We are slaves to the government'.
My two nieces have never had any vaccine in their lives as they are also anti vaxxers.
I am just so confused as to how they have got away with that lifestyle for so long. The older they are getting the more apparent it is that they struggle with simple common sense on life. I worry for their future and have no idea how they are going to live normal lives without a basic education. I have researched if it's illegal and have stumbled across educational neglect and read up on all the basic needs of a simple education that should be provided by parents if home schooled.
Can somebody please tell me what they would do if this was their family or is it absolutely none of my business? This has been going on for years and to think my eldest niece should be going into Year 8 soon is very frightening as she is no where near the maturity level of this.
Any opinions or advice is all much appreciated 🤗

Ah it’s a difficult one. I used to home educate my child until age 7 then I found it too difficult trying to arrange social stuff for them so they started school at year 3 and are flourishing and really happy (and thankfully not at all behind but I was pretty disciplined about teaching theme in line with the national curriculum).
Another family member home educates in a way similar to the one you describe and we have a lot of concerns about it, mainly that they aren’t being prepared for exams/the need for jobs/living independently. I think you could report your concerns to education welfare if you felt it was warranted. Home Ed parents are obligated to provide an education appropriate to the child’s age so if they aren’t then there are people who can intervene.

Can they read? Add up? Are they knowledgeable about any topics? You’ve not provided any of that detail at all.

on the one hand you come across as extremely wedded to the ‘normal’ school system, so it might be that they just don’t want to discuss this with you. On the other hand they may not be providing an education. But ‘an education’ is a very broad concept and is definitely not wedded to the national curriculum.

Basically the law is that a parent provides a full time education suitable to a child’s age, aptitude and ability but there is no set way that the education needs to happen.
If you believe they aren’t receiving a suitable education then U.K. can report them to their local authority education department and they would then have some form of contact with them be it a visit or by submitting an educational report. I will say though that working in.school doesn’t really give you any knowledge on education as a whole, just on the school system which can look very different to home education.

Sorry I didn't really go into much detail but no they cannot even read or write 😥 I just find the situation very sad that's all. As I said it's their life and maybe we just don't agree with each other's ways of living it. It's just their future that worries me more than anything. They don't really have any topics they are knowledgeable on that I know of. They spend their free time down at the beach, or going to protests and things like that.

If they can’t read or write, how are they engaging with social media apps? Do they just look at the pictures or?

I agree with pp in that you seem very embedded in the state/traditional system so seem very bias but agree you owe your children a certain level of education to be able to get by in the world so I understand your concerns!

I would report to the relevant authorities- as I understand it their local educational dept in their council should have some existing communication with them regarding their home schooling but don’t quote me on that!

Also the social skills/maturity levels thing is not the best marker necessarily, you can have social immature kids in school as well. You also can’t know for sure that they aren’t autistic or similar.

I think you need to be careful as this is your family and it would feel wrong to me to report them. Have you considered offering them some support or help? Maybe suggesting some resources yourself or visiting if you are that concerned?

I would also check you fully understand their situation because home education looks very different to the education that's delivered at school.

As someone who was HE in a very similar way I would say you're entirely justified in your concerns. I am very anti unschooling (which I assume is the general vibe they're going for!). It's so much more about parents than the children's own needs. I feel like I missed out on so many educational opportunities in my childhood. If it helps to reassure my siblings and I have all joined mainstream society as adults with jobs and good degrees (and vaccinations - was a funny first visit to the nurse when I was 21 and thy pulled my records). However we all wouldn't do the same with our own kids and I think there should be regulation of all HE families and a set of standards ensuring children actually receive an education. I would suggest if you're able to speak to the children without their parents around and perhaps provide guidance towards steps they can take to start an academic education that could be worth a try. I was terrified of all that stuff because of the propagana my parents would spout but having a relative to offer real world support would have been amazing.They might need to be reassured they're not stupid and just haen't been given the chance to learn these skills. Hope that helps, happy to chat more via DM!

It was interesting to read Molly1990 response.

My sister and i were also unschooled, we lived in a cottage in the hills of Snowdonia, without mains electricity although we did have power from a stream were water came from too, well my parents still live there. We had an old American motorhome that always broke down but we would take it to Devon/Cornwell during much of summer. Later it got replaced by a newer smaller motorhome.

Neither of us learnt to do maths, I remember gran who was dismayed at out upbringing tried to get us to read Three Little Pigs once when I was about 13 and neither of us could or wanted to, although we did recognised some words, mostly these from shopping like Strawberries, Spaghetti, Chocolate and so on. We could interact with computers using programs that would read text and voice apps,

My first job was packing eggs on a production line but my sister started to learn to read and do maths and now is studying to be a chemical engineer. I kind of followed learning basic maths which didn't take long, although i can't do algebra, calculate angles, I don't even know my times table or do division beyond the basics but neither do most people I know who did go to school, i know enough to get me by. Reading and writing was a greater effort to learn, took about 6 months I guess although my spelling is still not great, but spell checker steps in when I fail.

I work as a waitress and I am fine with that. Do I feel I missed out, well I did on some experiences and occasionally I wish I had gone to school, especially secondary school, but my childhood was also fun, no stress, no homework, no parents demanding good grades, or do dance and play the piano (although I can play the piano).

Will I unschool my four year old daughter????? I will certainly delay her going to school until she is seven, maybe eight, after that I don't know!

@Rubyrainbow82 what did you decide to do in the end OP?

How do you know if they can read or write?

You've just described my niece... my sibling who is her parent is beyond concerned.

Hello op do you have an update

That was my thought . School kept telling me they were the experts .
They werent , they nearly destroyed my child.They neglected her and it was shocking when i asked for a full sar report. We took her out for 18 months while we argued with them .
In that time she got a science btec at merit level , she was only 13/14 when she was doing it .
school doesnt suit all children , and if they can read and write its maybe their choice as a family

if they are going on social media they must be able to read .
you work in a school so your absolute opposites .
if they spend time going on protests i imagine they are quite political .
What are they doing on the beach ?
unschooling isnt for me far to chaotic .However i cant see them meeting the criteria for neglect . If they can read and write (i presume they can to go on social media )there has been some education somewhere.
we have a ehcp so in a different position .
But i wasnt impressed by the school system now, 35 to a class .
if they live that far away you maybe only get a snap shot .
Are the parents teaching them their jobs ? for example i know a family who homeschool and the daughter loves painting .The family business is painting and decorating and she wants to do the free hand work.
im against unschooling if im honest , but i found regular school a disaster .
As for getting away with it , its legal as long as the child gets an education.
They can obviously read to go on line .They maybe play on it to annoy you if they know your feelings are so against it.
Very different life styles ,is it abuse ? only if there is no adequate education or learning