How do I get rhough to my mil?

[AbbyLou]

Hi all. I don't want to open a can or worms here but could really do with some advice. My dh has a half sister who is in Year 7. For various reasons she was 'educated' at home for Y4 and Y5, returned to school for Y6 and is now back at home. The trouble is my mil seems to do absolutely nothing with her. She has no idea of the curriculum an 11 year old should be studying. She is still buying books from Smiths for Y6 and working through them for Literacy and Mathematics. That's all they do apart from the odd bit of History or Geography. Dh bought his sister a book of Science experiments you can do at home with normal household stuff but the book has lain untouched on the shelf. They hardly ever go out and just sit around at home all day. It makes me so cross that she can het away with this. How can it be right? I am a teacher myself (Y1) so I am perhaps more frustrated than most about her lack of education. Mil doesn't seem to realise that she is sending her daughter now a path to the dole because she has no education. Dh has had to agree not to talk about it with his mum because they always end up arguing. She just can't seem to realise what she is doing. Do you think I am being harsh here or am I right to be concerned? I know there is an association for home educators to join and dh even offered to pay the subscription for her but she said she doesn't need it. Please don't jump on me for this. I am not questioning home education at all and I know from friend's experience that it works very well for some children. However, surely it need a bit more work on the parent's part?

There are two possibilities abbeyA

1. There are real concerns to be had here. In order for Abbylou to be sure of that, she needs to offer support, ask the child if she's happy and, if it is cause for concern, and the parent is not providing the child with an education suitable to her age, ability and aptitude (isn't that the official definition?, then she needs to contact the LA who will instigate official proceedings. That's a last resort really, since it is likely to damage family relations, and she needs to be REALLY sure the child is not being adequately educated before she brings the machinery of the State down upon them.

1. There are no real concerns to be had here, but Abbylou, like many others, has little or no experience of HE, what it might look like, what the child might be learning in an eccentric set up. Every HEer here, all the ones who you are thinking "yeah, she sounds like she's doing a great job", every single one has been approached by family or friends or strangers assuming that whatever their HE looks like, it's WRONG. Those childrenwould be better off at school. And because every HE parent here knows that (s)he has been wrongly accused, countless times, of doing the very worst possible thing for their child, they are at least going to consider the possibility that the OP is just another of those occasions.

But we don't know the people, we don't know the details, it is not our call.

I hope Abbylou won't be offended by us pointing out that while this might be a 1)-type situation, it might also be a 2)-type situation, and she needs to be quite sure it isn't before calling in the EWO squad.

There may well be a certain amount of defensiveness, which I'm the first to admit exists among HE parents.

But when people repeat certain assumptions casually and pejoratively (like your own descriptions of an education style you don't agree with - a lot of which bore some resemblance to my own situation) it's not mitigated by saying 'look, I know there are some really good HE parents'

Essentially, I think we're talking at cross-purposes here. Parents are directly responsible for their children's education - other than what was suggested, it isn't the OP's responsibility to 'get through to her MIL', and if she is concerned that an education isn't being given, and her concerns are not dealt with by looking at it from a different perspective, then the law says that it's the remit of the LEA to step in and investigate.

What a relief to get in and find 2 reasonable posts! I think perhaps I don't see it from the same perspective as HEs and I would imagine that you get your decision queried all the time and so you do get very defensive. I don't think that you realise, to an outsider, how defensive you appear when you all close ranks!
I haven't been on this site long and I find the different views fascinating-some people have the most bizarre (to me opinions). I find that if someone posts AIBU if...... I can write YABU because...... and then there will be those you say YANBU and there will be every shade of grey inbetween, and most importantly no one seems to get really upset.
On the HE site everyone agrees and if you put in a slight concern or criticism you are most unwelcome (or at least your views are).It very quickly gets aggressive.
I find the whole thing very interesting-would like to learn more and would like open debate but I find it quite scary! I don't think that you realise, because as soon as Abbylou said she was shocked by the reaction, people said that they were friendly and helpful! Not to an outsider, they weren't!
Abbylou has a difficult problem, if I was in her position I wouldn't want to go to the LEA but I would want to help MIL and this is where pointing her to a web page doesn't really answer her OP.

"Abbylou has a difficult problem, if I was in her position I wouldn't want to go to the LEA but I would want to help MIL and this is where pointing her to a web page doesn't really answer her OP".

I am interested to know what you think would have constituted a satisfactory response then, AbbeyA?

The OP was offered advice on where to look for further information on HE, both from books and websites.

She was advised that if she had concerns that her DN was not receiving an adequate education, the official route was to inform the LEA.

She was given very full explanations of the theories of autonomous Home Educating.

She was advised about more formal styles.

I'm honestly not sure what else anyone could have done to answer her OP.

And I'm not being aggressive.
Or being involved in a conspiracy of silence.
Or closing ranks with the other 7 home educators who have posted on this thread.

I will admit HumphreyCushion that you were the first to reply and you made concrete suggestions, for which you were thanked.
Unfortunately by the bottom of the page Abbylou was saying that she was sorry it had taken an aggressive turn.
Abbylou,perhaps if you have the energy to plough through this thread when you get home from work, you could comment on whether you found the replies helpful or whether you felt that you opened the can of worms.

I am still interested to know what you think would have constituted a satisfactory response then, AbbeyA?

The start of it was satisfactory and twice AbbyLou thanked people for their suggestions. She then felt it turned aggressive and further down she asked'whose life choices did I criticise? She said from the outset that she wasn't attacking HE but was worried that MIL was in the house but was not HE when she should. I just thought it would have been nice for someone to suggest that it was possible that she was right to be concerned and someone can HE badly. Watching TV all day can't be blamed on the fact she went to school (quite a long time ago).There are huge areas of grey-it is not HE= good:school=bad. It isn't very fair to keep talking about AbbyLou-she will probably come on tonight and say I have it all wrong!

Thanks for your support AbbeyA and for trying to explain my point of view perhaps better than I did! I had left this thread well alone as I did honestly feel as though people were being very unfair in their comments towards me. To be honest as a teacher I felt I was seen as 'the enemy', especially when people made comments about sceptical relatives and saying 'oh and they're teachers too' with raised eyebrows.
I'm not going to go into the whole argument again as I don't want to be accused of criticising people's life choices when I did nothing of the sort. I have looked at the Education Otherwise website and given mil the address for it. She has said she will look at it when she goes to the library so hopefully she will get some ideas and maybe realise that perhaps she's not offering sil all that she could by allowing her to sit and watch tv all day. The other day I was talking to sil on the phone and I was telling her about taking my Y1 children up to the Secondary School to do some trampolining. Her comment was 'I wish I could do more sporty things' - that's the kind of comment that worries me. I told her to ask her mum if she could maybe join something. I think if she says no dh will have a word. If it's the cost then he will offer to pay and sil need not even know.

I am glad that you felt I was supportive AbbyLou, I just felt very sorry for you because you said at the outset that you were not attacking HE and it was quite plain to me that as a teacher you were very concerned about the well being of your SIL and if you had a gut feeling she was doing nothing there was a 90% chance that you were right.What really upset me was the defensive position that you couldn't possibly know and that you were wanting MIL to do it your way, which you had bent over backwards to say that weren't.I felt that it was very aggressive and you hadn't done anything to warrant it. Someone will post in a minute and say that there was no aggression but it was so bad that when I went to collect my son and I thought that if I get back to anymore intimidating posts I will never post on the HE thread again-however to my relief they were quite calm and reasonable so I am still posting. There is another thread about hating school but at least it has a range of opinions which is quite refreshing.

Sorry-I should proof read-sorry about the last but one sentence-however I am sure you will understand what I meant!