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Home ed

Find advice from other parents on our Homeschool forum. You may also find our round up of the best online learning resources useful.

don't want to clutter another thread but a question..

12 replies

NeverKnowinglyUnderstood · 09/06/2012 17:02

So from what I have been gleaning about HE, in a VERY simplistic manner is it that your children are still being schooled but you are in attendance? When you go to these HE groups are there lessons taught, so like school but with your parent's there?

I have hard hat on and ready to be shouted at, but would like to understand.

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streakybacon · 09/06/2012 17:14

Not necessarily. We've had workshops where parents are banished so it's just the kids, others where parents are welcome to stay and join in. Some where parents sit on the sidelines. For practical reasons, if there's an event arranged at a central location parents would have to accompany their children as they wouldn't be able to get there on their own. Depending on the 'rule' of the event, parents might stay or slope off for coffee and a natter. It also depends on the children's age too and whether siblings are involved - some groups are mixed but others are age-specific. It depends whether it's a social activity or a learning one too.

It varies loads regionally too. There is no set way to HE, classes and groups are set up by parents and might involve a professional group leader or parent/s themselves. Some groups in some areas have been going for years and evolve with new people joining, focus changes, they develop.

Workshops held at museums and visitor attractions will usually have their own rules about having parents present, age restrictions etc and you have to go along with that, obviously.
It's what you make it, really.

NeverKnowinglyUnderstood · 09/06/2012 17:17

so how do you ensure your child is educated to the levels required for later life?
ie most jobs require education certificates to show levels of learning achieved.

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streakybacon · 09/06/2012 17:27

Most of the older kids I know are doing IGCSEs, Open University or other courses with certification or points towards higher education. There are lots of ways of doing it.

I think there tends to be some confusion about HE and a bit of an assumption that everyone does it the same way and throughout the child/ren's education. Most of the families I know with under 11s are very much focused on play and self-learning, but as the children mature and develop their own interests parents will facilitate those interests and usually point them towards more academic study.

It's up to the individual to work out what they want/need from a particular learning group and if they want more they find it. For academic study I use tutors as I know my limit Wink, and we do a lot of practice exam papers to be sure my son is ready to take the finals. There are ways and means of evaluating.

NeverKnowinglyUnderstood · 09/06/2012 17:33

so do a similar percentage to non homeschooled kids go onto university?

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streakybacon · 09/06/2012 17:39

I don't know the statistics but I'd imagine so. It's up to the individual really - if that's what the child wants to do when they reach that age there's nothing to stop them.

I'm logging out for the evening now but will pop back to the thread in the morning so ask away if you have more questions Smile.

ommmward · 09/06/2012 17:44

WElcome to the HE board NEverKnowingly :)

THere are as many different ways of Home Edding as there are families who do it, to be honest. Let me give you two extremes:

Some families get a whole curriculum as a package. Every day they sit down in what even looks like a little school room with desks in their house, and they work their way through today's bit of the curriculum for each bit of the age range that's in the family, with the parent really having the teacherly role, keeping everyone on task, answering questions. Even in such a top-down environment, it's terrifically efficient to teach the material to a small number of children, so it rarely takes more than 2-3 hours to get through the day's work. THose families would almost certainly do "end-of-term" exams within the curriculum package they follow (there are lots of American ones, from ones aimed both at Christian families who prefer a bible-centred education all the way to ones aimed at US diplomat's families (the Sonlight curriculum is a famous one of those)). So for those children, the parents get a clear measure on a regular basis, right through the education, of how the child compares to others of a similar age. Of course, these children sit GCSEs and A levels when they get to the relevant point (although often they do a couple of GCSEs a year when they are ready, from about 12 onwards, rather than doing 9 all in one go).

The other extreme would be families who are what is often called "radical unschoolers". Here there is NO formal learning. The family life basically looks, every day, like one of those long family days in the middle of the summer holidays. They go on all sorts of trips, visit all sorts of fun places (the zoo, museums, petting farms, the library, the park), they have lazy pyjama days, they play imaginative games, they do baking, they play on the computer. The parent divides their time between keeping the house running like everyone does, and answering their children's questions as they arise, and making sure their children have the resources they need to do what they are wanting to do. Months can pass without any sort of formal educational product emerging from that family. THose who live this way believe that their children drink in knowledge through the purposive conversations they have, and through the activities they undertake. THey believe it's educationally best for their children to make the decisions about what to learn and how to learn it. IN these families, there almost always comes a moment when the child has a very clear plan for what they want to do next - and they get the necessary work experience to do it, or they realise that to go to university they'll need a couple of GCSEs (probably maths and english), and some A levels, so they go to college to do those, or they do them privately with tutors, or they do some of the OU foundation level courses, which universities often accept as an alternative to A levels. On this path, sometimes also called "autonomous HE", there are almost always outcomes that everyone recognises as "educational"; the difference is that the person having the education makes the decision about what those things should be.

the first extreme is the one that wider society can accept, kinda, except that of course people often get worried when it's a Christian family and worry about whether the children are being taught to uncritically accept creationism or whatever. [and of course there are easy rebuttals to that if you want me to make them... in brief, that you can't control a child's use of reason for ever, and you can't control a child's exposure to outside ideas for ever and ever, so in the end they get to make their own minds up. It doesn't seem to me to make a huge difference whether the ideology they come to weigh up in the end is the one of their parents or the one of the people who invent the national curriculum ]

the second extreme is the one that wider society finds really repellent, usually. I think this is mostly because it seems like cheating. Most of us spend 13 years in school, and work hard during that time, and undergo boredom and stress and probably times which are socially suboptimal, and we are sometimes sleep deprived because we stayed up last night watching something interesting on TV. And we have to wear clothes that are maybe in colours and styles and materials that we hate and don't suit us. And now comes along Mrs ommmward-smug-home-educating-bastard to tell us that, actually, we could all have got to exactly the same place by being on a 13 year-long summer holiday, going on fun trips and baking with our mothers, and talking about anything and everything with whoever we meet. I mean, WTAF? And then we get into conversations on crazy threads like that one running at the moment which I carefully did not post on before hiding, about how actually children somehow need to learn to be bored and to expend most of their daily energy on someone else's agenda and to get used to spending much of their time in a large group of people, and on an externally determined and rigid timetable, because that will prepare them for adult life. Me, if I am going to have to (let's pretend) have a finger cut off once a year from the age of 22, I really don't see the point of getting in practice for that by cutting a toe off once a year from 4 and a half onwards!

How was that for a long answer? I enjoyed writing it though - sometimes it's fun to present the extremes. Of course, most home edders are somewhere in between the extremes. And of course, most non-home edders are nothing like as violent in their disapprobation as the straw men I set up here - it's all just for rhetorical effect, and I hope it makes it easier for you to imagine the middle ground where most people sit.

ommmward · 09/06/2012 17:44

cross posted with streaky, who said the same thing in 1/10th of the words Envy

wolvesdidit · 09/06/2012 22:03

ommmward, I loved your post my dear Smile

julienoshoes · 09/06/2012 22:07

so do a similar percentage to non homeschooled kids go onto university?

From my viewpoint as a parent of three autonomously home educated/radical unschoolers-as brilliantly described by ommmward above, young people, who now knows literally hundreds of other (mostly autonomously home educated)HE youngsters between the ages of 15 and 25, the percentage is very high indeed.

and the Universities include Oxford/Cambridge/Edinburgh/Warwick/Birmingham/Bristol/Cardiff/Nottingham/LSE/Leicester.......
and the courses they are doing/have done include Law, Classics, Economics, Astro Physics, Psychology, Art, Music, Medicine, Nursing, Sociology and Social Policy,It and Veterinary Science.....

and that's just off the top of my head...

NeverKnowinglyUnderstood · 09/06/2012 22:28

THANK YOU
I now feel that I can understand a little more why people make the choice to HE.

It isn't something that is right for every family unit, but I can see why it would work really well for others.

Trying not to be defensive about the decision I have made for my family I totally feel it is important for the greater education to come from home. In the little experience we have had with 4 years of primary, so far, it is clear to see the children and families who do a lot of home education (outside school hours) and those for whom education stops at the school gates.

Have had conversations with people at school saying they dont get the kids to do their home work or do reading etc because it "isn't my job to teach my kids, it's what they (the school) get paid for"

Thank you for your brilliant answers.

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ThreadWatcher · 10/06/2012 21:44

Just popping in to comment on something Ommward (whose posts I love and respect enormously, I bow to your autonomous greatness Ommward!)

Those families would almost certainly do "end-of-term" exams within the curriculum package they follow (there are lots of American ones, from ones aimed both at Christian families who prefer a bible-centred education all the way to ones aimed at US diplomat's families (the Sonlight curriculum is a famous one of those)

Based on my experience I dont know any HE families who follow a structured curriculum and have 'end of term' exams (never heard of such a thing tbh)

The sonlight curriculum is fab, but is most definately not aimed at US diplomat families (though there may be many such families who use it that is not who it is aimed at). I am about to order direct from them (eek American dollar confusion!) so I am a wee bit biased!

FWIW we are a HE family with a little bit of structure (though I have never yet signed up to the forum of the same name, must do that!) We work through a bunch of things in the morning for about 2-2.5 hours then maybe an hour of craft, cooking etc in the afternoon and an hour of reading fabulous books cwtched up on my bed (cwtch is a welsh word meaning 'cuddle')
All the autonomous "ooh I want to do xyz" happens around the 'structured' bit.
Plus we have lots of days where they spend all day doing the "oooh I want to do xyz" and lots of days/mornings/afternoons out locally and week long adventures elsewhere.
I am truly in awe of people who sucessfully home educate their kids autonomously - its not for us though :)

I think whatever method works for you and your children is the best :)

ommmward · 10/06/2012 22:52

Hmm. I must have got the wrong end of the stick about Sonlight - I have some american friends who use it, and I thought that was what they told me its origins were. They just luff it. I hear nothing but good about it!

I suppose following a curriculum you can get a good idea of where your child is at compared with the "grade level", and that's as close to formal testing as you need to go. You'd be aiming at GCSEs in the longer run, presumably? Do you abandon a package curriculum at that point, or are there still good ones, do you think?

Your last sentence - yes, that, in spades!!!!!

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