telling/consulting dd

[morethanpotatoprints]

Hello, sorry if this has been done to death but

When/ how do we approach the subject of HE with dd. Too many hints she will guess as she is bright seeing through most scams. Also don't want to worry/ upset/ her if it isn't what we decide. Nor do we want it to be a shock if we do decide.
It is particularly difficult as I have said in previous posts as she loves school, is happy there, has confidence and good friends. How can I put forward great differences to enhance her life when put like this. BTW considering HE to free time from endless stupid activities at school so she can pursue her dream of music, which she would practice for hours every day given the opportunity.

she loves school, is happy there, has confidence and good friends. Do not, for the love of god, do it then! She will rightly resent you, possible indefinitely, for taking her away from somewhere she's happy, popular, and doing well to stay at home and do music with you.

And practicing for hours and hours every day, to the exclusion of all else is a bad idea, no matter how talented she is. You sound a tad well, pushy mummy when you say the things in your post...

As a HE advocate, this is NOT a decision you should be making on behalf of your child, but one in which she should be a full participant.

If the music dream is genuinely hers, and she would genuinely rather have hours a day to practice than go to school then fine, just put it to her as a possibility (but not until it is a genuine possibility) and see if she's up for it. If not then, meh. Plenty of successful musicians spent 13 years wasting their time in school. Just get her into one of the conservatoire junior departments if she really is as passionate about it as you suggest - then she'll get regular music making opportunities with people who are similarly talented (there's a pecking order in London certainly - junior college, academy and guildhall are much more highly regarded than trinity laban, who are much less selective. I don't know as much about the provincial JDs. And, for the love of God, don't go down the specialist music school route, unless it's Wells (which is the least crazy IME))

Am I right in thinking she's near the end of primary school age? I think it would have to be her choice, rather than yours - she's old enough to think it through. If she really wants a lot of extra time to practice, then she'll see the benefits. If she doesn't want it enough to give up what she enjoys about school, then leave her in school, even if you think HE would be a good choice for her.

And when you talk to her about it, be honest about the pros and cons - extra time to practice, but what about playing in groups? Can she still join the orchestra etc? And how much does she want that level of committment to music? It's a big choice for someone to make at her age, even bigger than a music school.

FWIW DS was at music school as a chorister from 8 to 13, then had 2 years HE to give him far more time for music than he could get at the available schools, then went back into (normal) school for the last 2 years. It worked well for him, but we made sure he also got a decent set of academic qualifications and didn't allow his focus on music to stop him from getting a rounded education - the reality is that most people don't earn their living from performing, no matter how talented they are or how much time and effort they put into it. So, don't let her make any choices (or push her into any) which limit her other options.

I'll be honest....I took DD1 out of school because she wanted me to...it took a long time to come to this decision but it was definitely made for her and her reasons, not mine. I personally wouldn't remove a child from their schooling if they are happy, loves school, confident and with good friends. I wish I could've used all those lovely words to describe my DD1's experience with school, but no I couldn't. I would hate to remove a child from school and have that child resent me for doing so. Please don't do it unless you are BOTH absolutely certain it is the thing to do.

Thank you very much. I know to some I may sound pushy but I just want whats best for her. If I gave the opinion she would just do music then that wasn't my intention as we would do many other subjects for rounded education. The music ideas do come from her and she has told me she wants to go to jd. Her Dad is a musician and tutor and has colleagues who dd knows who teach there. She has said she would practice all day if she could which made me think of HE as a possibility, I know this was probably an off the cuff remark but food for thought. She is no protege but loves it and plays 3 instruments, but only 2 to a basic level. If she decided she doesn't want to do it anymore then thats fine, obviously it would be a shame but her choice obviously. We will wait until we have decided it is a good idea then ask her what she thinks, if its not a good idea then we won't mention it then.

Happy child at school, loves school, confident and good friends = a child who will do well. Please don't pull her out just because you think its the best thing for her. If you think HE-ing is the best option for her then you must MUST get 100% from her. I would hate to remove a child from an environment they are so happy in. She could resent you for the rest of her childhood. I'm sorry if that sounds abrupt/blunt but I do think you need to re-examine your reasons for HE-ing which have to be in the best interests of your daughter, not you.

Well I'm taking my son out of school so he has time to pursue his music. He was a chorister but his timetable wouldn't allow him to practice his instruments - yes, it's true! So we moved him to a specialist music school but the academics are so shocking as is the behaviour and attitude of many of the kids. It's costing us a fortune and it's not worth the money. He remains completely obsessed with music and we can't fit in a good school and music - he was offered places at other schools so we did think long and hard about it. Our plan is to home ed for two years and put him back into school for Year 9 or he may go back to music school once he's got some A'levels under his belt, which would probably be before sixth form.

Would I do it if I didn't think he was gifted in music? No, nor would I do it if he was thriving and happy at school. I'd also wait until she went to a JD, but if you don't think she's anything special then she may not get in.

Fwiw, I wish my son wasn't so passionate about music as it's such an unstable career.

...should've read....'then you must get 100% agreement from her'

Nelehump, don't worry I like bluntness its much better to get a direct answer. The problem we have is fitting in practice and the other musical stuff like listening. She also does dancing and doesn't really want to stop that either.I think there is every likelihood that she would get in as she is determined and practices well, and she is only 8 and wants to audition at 11. She will also for the time being be able to keep her orchestras choir and lessons which would be a bonus as she has friends here. We won't even consider it if she doesn't want to, its just I would like her to give an informed response and without telling her we are looking at this we are unlikely to get one. I'm also beginning to feel bad now for suggesting it. Maybe it would be a mistake

I think home ed should be done if one does it from the start, a child is not thriving or happy, whether that be academically or socially or your only option is the local sink school. Otherwise I wouldn't disturb the apple cart. If I had my time again then I'd do it from the start.

I honestly don't think it should just be your decision at this age. She is happy and confident and probably enjoys the "endless stupid activities" !

It is particularly difficult as I have said in previous posts as she loves school, is happy there, has confidence and good friends.

Why even try? She is likely to resist because she doesn't think it will enhance her life.

Don't even try hints. Sit her down and discuss it straight-it isn't something to be tricked into or persuaded into-or it will backfire on you. Honesty is the best policy.

I agree with all the posts on this thread. I have an 8yr old myself. She is blissfully happy at school, doing really well, very confident for her age, has some lovely friends (and yes they have their occasional girlie fall-outs) and academically she's flying. Would I HE her just because I would want to? No way. Would I HE her because I HE my eldest DD. No I wouldn't. I did actually ask DD2 if she'd like to be HE like DD1 and she flatly refused. I asked her why and she said she'd miss her friends too much and loves school too much. That was enough for me. I would never dream of pulling a child out of school because I'd want her to have the time available to persue a particular subject that she desperately wants to do. Remember...she has her whole life ahead of her and she's only 8yrs old. Think about it again when she's older and will have a much better idea of what she wants to do with her life. Kids can be fickle - you might even find she completely switches off from music as she gets older. She's just a very young child after all. :)

Well said, nelehuap-one size doesn't fit all-even DCs in the same family can be very different.

Thank you for your comments they have given me food for thought. However, I must say that we wouldn't have tricked her into anything. I meant that we didn't want to come straight out with it if we hadn't decided if it was a good idea or not. Why bother her over something that might not happen. At the same time its not nice for us to spend along time considering this without mentioning it to her. My original post was really asking how to go about this. We would certainly not consider HE unless she was totally happy about it even if we thought it right. ATM our research into HE is relatively new and I welcome all input, so thank you again. She did mention it once before as we have gypsy ancestry and many of our family are HE although this isn't a factor as they are not family that brought me up and we know very little of them. She did say it would be good though and listed several benefits, I think her teacher also discussed it with her when they did work on cultures. I never paid much attention at the time as it wasn't something we had considered.

If you haven't decided if you're prepared to yet then I can see why you wouldn't want to raise it until you are. But if she says something else about music/practice time etc can't you just ask 'well, would you prefer it if you didn't have to go to school? Because I know you enjoy x, y and z while you're there.' And see what she says?

I'm sure lots of kids enjoy school but out of those there will be some who might enjoy home ed even more but don't know that it exists as an alternative (or it actually isn't for them). I mean I LOVE my job, but if someone was thinking of offering me an alternative I'd want to consider myself rather than them making up their mind that they won't because I enjoy what I'm doing already. Assuming that because she's happy in school, when she thinks that is her only option, that the OP should just leave it entirely alone and not even raise it as a possibility is no better than the OP making the decision to pull her out without talking about it.

It is sensible to mention that there are options other than school-most DCs don't realise it-that was what I meant by honesty.
However you have to be prepared for the fact that knowing the options she might well choose school.

I wouldn't mention it to her at all at the moment as I think this could unsettle a child who is happy. Plenty of kids go to JD and are at school. In fact most are at school and cope fine.

I can't stress this point enough....if your DD is happy then leave her where she is, at school. A happy child will do beautifully at school. By removing her from that environment could result in such an unhappy child and should you have to put her back into school it'll be complete turmoil for her and unfair. She is so young and decisions like this should not be taken lightly and certainly not without her full 100% agreement, even if she is just a child of 8yrs old.

I agree with everyone else that this has to be the child's decision. But I don't agree with the opinion expressed by some people that if she is happy at school then that means HE shouldn't be considered. It is entirely possible to be happy at school but even happier if HE.

If you were happy in your job but someone offered you a job which you thought you'd love even more, you'd give it serious consideration. Many children such as my older daughter are happily home educated but still go and try school in case it might be even better. And many schoolchildren are perfectly fine at school but still would rather be HE if it were offered to them: it often happens that they decide to come out of school after an unhappy sibling is removed from school and they see how good the alternative can be!

OP, I've forgotten whether you have mentioned your daughter's secondary options. Trying HE might be risky if it would be difficult to get her (back) into the desired secondary school if she decides HE isn't right for her. If that's the case then maybe it would be better to try HE at the end of primary - Year Six, for example. Then the worst that could happen would be that she'd miss out on a year when she'd rather have been at school, and she could then go into Y7 without much harm done. If it isn't hard to get into your desired secondary school then she could equally well try HE in Y7.

Honestly, I don't understand this notion that HE should only be a last resort, that it takes very serious consideration, or that it should only be done throughout a child's entire school career. Except in unusual circumstances, it is not that hard to move in and out of school. Why the fear from so many people over trying something different? Sometimes home education works in the long run and sometimes it doesn't. But the only time I've ever heard anyone (parent or child) say that they regretted even trying HE, is when it was done to older children for an extended period of time against their will. They rightly resent that. However, that is pretty rare. Few parents take children out of school and keep them out when they would rather be in school.

"I wouldn't mention it to her at all at the moment as I think this could unsettle a child who is happy"

If the mere mention that HE exists as a possibility for a chid unsettles them so much they're no longer happy at school, I'd question how genuine the happiness was in the first place.

I used to practise the piano for 30 mins before school and violin after. That was with leaving the house at 7.50am and not getting back until 4.50pm - which, unless you live far from the school or she does classes every night, doesn't sound likely. I would start by making sure that effective time is being made of the time you do have - and then that she practices efficiently too. As for 'listening' etc - that can be done as part of everyday life - we often have music on in the house.

Saracen. No I didn't mention her secondary options. To be frank they are not good, lots of over crowded chav attending horrible places. I am not a well off person and we couldn't afford private. Even the church secondary school is no better. We have 2 older children and honestly If I had known about HE then, there is no way they would have gone. One did ok the other went all through school without his Aspergers being diagnosed. Neither reached their full potential.
I do have other issues besides the music practice, such as in other posts, the possible dyslexia and our belief or none belief in the standard of education offered by the curriculum. However, as stated my main concern was the way we went about making decisions and consulting dd and at what stage. Also obviously making sure we were considering all the issues so we could be better informed.