Should I go back to home-ed?

[montymoocow]

Home educated my boys for 2 yrs, and they're both now in high school (yr 7 and yr 8). My yr 8 son has mild autism and struggles with the lessons and hates school. He can't deal with the bad behaviour, screaming and shouting and has been attacked twice, although it was dealt with. My yr 7 son is quietly getting on with it but hates it. He comes home with heaps of work every afternoon which I have to bully him into getting done.

The reason I put them back into school was a) I'd had a baby (now 2) and b) I was getting worried about them getting older and exams getting nearer, and would I be able to get them to do any work now they're older.

I am constantly wrestling with the best thing to do. What's worse is that my yr 8 son has a best friend (really nice boy) who also hates school with a passion and is on anti-depressants and is threatening to harm himself. Not helping really.

I want to do right by all three children. My husband is supportive whatever, but feels I'd be taking on too much again.

Anyone got any words of wisdom?

Many thanks.

"My husband is supportive whatever, but feels I'd be taking on too much again."

What was your home ed experience like before? Did it feel like too much for you to cope with then? I wonder whether there might be a different way forward that you could try, a different style of home education now that they are older.

Things don't sound very positive if they stay at school. If they are unhappy, they probably won't be learning much there. Would they be learning even less at home, do you think?

Or, another way of looking at it: if they don't get such a good education at home as at school then which is more important, their happiness or their education? I know of people whose children were really deeply distressed who have taken them out of school because they felt that no matter how well or badly HE might go, their child's mental health was the most important thing. I don't know whether things are that critical for either of your sons?

I've given more questions than answers, I know! Just wondered whether those were things you'd thought about.

Thanks for your comments. I think the problem is I'm rather structured by nature and as they've got older they kick out against it. I worry they'll not do enough and take advantage of the situation. I have to say though that I think whatever they'd do at home would probably be more than at school. It just all seems so much more scary because they're a bit older and at high school.

In answer to your question "what's more important - happiness or education?" - then there's no question. I want them happy more than anything, but I don't want them on the Playstation all day with me constantly moaning.

You have given me something to think about, so thanks for answering. It's much appreciated.

Do a google search for "de-schooling". Part of the process of them leaving school might well involve them spending hours a day on the playstation for a few months, as part of their healing. Just FYI :)

You may well be right. I probably worry far too much!

Thanks for your reply!

How did it go when you were home educating last time? For you and for the boys?

Hi Milou!

Thanks for your words of encouragement. Last time it went well, but they were approx. 6 and 7 and they went back at 9 and 10, but within a few months they hated most of it. My eldest then went off to High School and I took my other son out of school again for the final year of primary (everything had gone backwards whilst at school - I showed his teacher the handwriting he'd produced at home against what he was producing at school, and she said "oh! It has changed a bit hasn't it, I wonder why". Along with lots of other reasons - mainly he hated it - I pulled him out. Well .... he's now started year 7 at high school and my eldest is in year 8. Both hate it and would rather be at home. They both complain of bad behaviour, swearing and rubbish strewn everywhere. They say the teachers spend all the time shouting and they say they don't learn anything. They then are given numerous tests to see what's gone in (in most cases the answer to that is not much!) My husband however worries that they'd do absolutely nothing and muck about all day. They're older now and have definite ideas about their likes and dislikes! They also either get on together great or argue (like most siblings I know), but I have a baby to think of too and my own sanity.

Home education I think worked really well, although when they went back into school the school remarked that there were gaps in their education. I did some curriculum based work but not strictly so. We spent a lot of time reading, writing, doing spellings, had a maths tutor, we started learning instruments, did lots of crafts, attended a home ed group, did a few science experiments and of course educational visits.

I'm going round in circles, and really don't know what to do which will be best for them. I do know what my heart says though.

Sorry this has been so long, but thanks for listening!!

Betelguese! Sorry I meant to address my last message to you really. You gave me some good advice. Thanks!

"there were gaps in their education"

yes, and there will have been areas where they were streets ahead of their peers. Both equally heinous crimes to a syllabus-led type...

Listen to your heart.

Just a little question: how would HEing them be harder than trying to get them to comply with the school routine/homework/type of behaviour?

ommmward, I was going to say exactly the same!

"Gaps in their education" makes it sound like the home education was lacking. It's more accurate to say that what the children learned at home didn't map exactly onto what was being taught at school. Of course it didn't!! This would have been the case even if they had pursued a very traditional schooling abroad, for example. There were undoubtedly things that they learned at home far better than they would have done at school. For some reason no one would describe this as showing a "gap in the education" of schoolchildren!

I don't home ed and both my children are in private school , so my response is just based on your op and subsequent posts:-

I think you should go back to it!

I think you should discuss it with both children and explain your worries and then maybe draw up a plan or a code of conduct or such like WITH them.

I suspect both of them will comply willingly and be far happier for it, just from what you've described.

I'm sure I read on here of internet based 'class' lessons....don't know how to describe it....but you go on the tinterwebby and learn with a teacher on-line or summat like that.

Good luck what ever you decide.

Thanks everyone for your wise words. I too agree with the "gap in their education" scenario. Probably these gaps maybe a good thing since much of what they learn in schools is not what I would wish them to learn. My yr 7 son this morning asked "please ..... can I stay off today? I really hate it" I'm meeting with his teacher this afternoon for one of their settling in meetings. It should be a short meeting when I just say to that question "no, he hasn't"!

Interestingly, he also got sent home with a letter regarding a survey which is taking place hashed together by the Government (I think) and a University (not sure which one), finding out if children in yrs 7 and 9 are happy and if not, then what can be done -ha! ha! I looked at the parents' survey on line and didn't complete it, it was another really impertinent, nosy questionnaire - George Orwell style. Questions such as "is your child easily distracted?, does your child lie?, does your child do as he is told? Does your child answer back" etc. etc. Absolutely nothing in there about what is wrong with school and why does it make children so unhappy. Needless to say I didn't complete the questionnaire, as it also asked for the child's name, date of birth etc. (hardly anonymous). I also sent him in with the reply slip asking for him to be withdrawn from their "experiment".

I'm sure I could make home ed work again for us, although I think my hubby may need to be convinced that I will not be taking on too much. Also, it will make it difficult for me to go back to work at some point, which is what I was planning to do. The children's happiness though is far more important to me.

Thanks again for listening!

Hi betelguese! Well, the info with the questionnaire said that it would only be used for the purposes of improving kids' wellbeing and happiness in schools (if that's at all possible). As a matter of course I usually say no to all things such as this in schools. I said no to the measuring and weighing scheme. I think they have far too much info on our kids anyway, and if I have any problems with my kids' weight or other health issues (which I don't) then that's between my husband, myself and our GP. Well, that's my opinion anyway. They're supposed to go to school to learn and they can't seem to get that right so I wouldn't trust them with anything else (not really bitter and twisted!!)

I'm still having sleepless nights thinking things through. My eldest went to school today - but not a happy boy. Complaining of pains in his neck, headache and nearly started crying at the thought of assembly. He just hates it. My other son is still off sick, but due to go back on Monday (but dreading it).

When I made the decision to de-register them last time it was much easier, but it all seems so much harder now they're older. I think it will be one last straw which is needed to break the camel's back.

Nice talking to you!

I Home Ed'ed mine for 4 1/2 years and my DD started High School in yr 7 (like HP going to Hogwarts!) and my 15 yr old DS started after christmas in yr 10 - their decisions. HE has been fabulous for them and my DD is well ahead and top of her class and my DS is over the 'puberty hill' and found his confidence. They are both really enjoying it - but I hear a blow by blow account of every thing that happens every day!! HE established our relationship so it is amusing hearing about the teachers' debacles etc but does get tedious...
My point is that we are all different and specifically that the human to human interface that your child will discover at school - with fellow pupils and teachers is a matter of total chance! Yes it is a part of life but as parents we have to make a decision as to what is acceptable and what is destructive to our child's long-term wellbeing. It does seem to me that it is when parents are 'genetically in tune' with their offspring that these issues become acute. If not then the parent/s (like the teachers) are seduced by the 'it is only a matter of time before this problem goes away' argument. HE is always an option and may be the best for a time but it is a dynamic situation and a differnet school with different people may work. Possibly the single biggest thing that HE has given us is that we talk. the best iillustration of this was when, after just one year at home, my 11 Yr old DS attended the High School Open Day for new pupils (the Hogwarts argument!) and told us that no, he did not want to go but preferred to continue with HE. BUT THEN, wonder of wonders, he proceeded to tell us in minute, and wittily observed detail, about his whole day! It seemed that he had drawn an poor hand in terms of the 'lessons' (none of the exciting new subjects and having to sit on a filthy' hall floor whilst the head of PE told them how he had hated his school days at the same school!). But in truth DS wasn't ready to return to school then. These lines of communication we now have are precious and, even if it means handling some pithy criticism of my own shortcomings, should stand us in good stead as they become young adults.
So, I merely offer my own experience to help you get your own perspective (that is all really anyone can do) and admire you for being in tune with your child to take this so seriously(notwithstanding that that is probably more to do with genetic luck and not meaning to be critical of other parent/child relationships...)
All the best to everyone struggling to 'do the best thing' anyway.

I've just read this response and thank you for that.

We're still sitting on the fence really. My youngest still cries each morning but perhaps not as much as he did, but I do worry as they seem to change a lot while at school - fight with each other more, become sarcastic, frustrated and poke fun. Not what they are usually like at all.

Interestingly too, my younger son came home with spellings to learn for the week, but a spelling had been written in incorrectly by either the teacher or TA. Needless to say I put a note into his book (much to the horror of my son), but all this does nothing but confirm my concerns. If I'm not sending them in for an education, then what am I sending them for?

Thanks for all your responses!

maybe this is the wrong school for the boys. Is there another school option?

Are you planning on HEing the 2 year old when the time comes through primary?

I think if you decide to HE the boys againand you are most comfortable with structure, look now into programmes/course material and when you find something you like the look of to base your work around, sit down with your 2 ds and discuss how it is going to work, exlaining that with exams to work towards HEing secondary school aged dc is going to be a bit different and requires them to get a certain amount of work finished each morning before they have freer educational time to pursue their other interests (which they can have a freer hand in selecting).

You had a tutor for maths before, you can do that again. How would you manage science, can you see that working? I couldn't personally do that, having been rubbish at it before and having no genuine interet in experiments etc. Do you see a way around that.

The difference now is that they have the basic skills which you taught them and they need now a certain maturity in application to get on with learning (same as at school with all the behavioural problems/screaming etc) there is only so much teaching coming across, the rest has to be esentially self-taught IMO.

I would take them out personally if no other school option seems viable.

sorry about all the tipos - jetlag...

you could set them off with a year-long internet based course (no idea of cost etc) to get them into the working from home mode. Then if you didn't like it, couldn't afford to continue, you could use that basis in sitting down and getting work done at home which you have now re-established, and do your own thing with them.

Hello!!

As to choosing another school - there is no other, so can't move them.

We still have a maths tutor who comes round. Interestingly most of the children I know of have extra tuition on top of going to school which tells you something really.

Neither of them enjoy science at school - they say it's too boring, although they love Braniac and are generally interested in how stuff works etc., and my eldest is interested in biology.

I know I could make it work but I just feel we'd be taking a huge great jump off a cliff. It's like ..... everyone's walking one way and we'd be daring to walk against the flow. Is everyone else right and we're mad, or are we the sane ones? Don't suppose there's a right or wrong answer to that one.

It was all so much easier when they were younger.

As for the baby, I shall just see as he grows. He'll be one of the youngest in his year (an end of July baby), but he was premature and wasn't due until Sept anyway. So ..... he may not be ready for schoool at 4, or he may really need it. I shall have to wait and see.

I'm really grateful for all the your responses though, it's been a great help!

Thanks!

An 8 year old boy on anti-depressants

WHen you describe the school environment, it sounds like the sort of thing any adult would have trouble coping with. And we expect children to deal with it just because they're children! IT makes no sense.

Sorry, no practical help. BUt just that since learning about HE on MN I really subscribe to the idea that schools are unnatural environments. Some kids love them, but that's the luck of their constitution more than anything lese.

OH sorry, year 8!

"I know I could make it work but I just feel we'd be taking a huge great jump off a cliff. It's like ..... everyone's walking one way and we'd be daring to walk against the flow. Is everyone else right and we're mad, or are we the sane ones? Don't suppose there's a right or wrong answer to that one."

There is a right and wrong answer, but only someone who knows and loves your children can figure it out. That would be you. Look to your children, and you will have the answer.

I know you're right Saracen. I know in my heart of hearts that learning outside school is best for them and guess we shall take the plunge again. I guess I'm waiting for the right moment to give us that shove.

Schools are generally very unnatural and hostile environments for children - or as you say, for anyone, let alone children to deal with. Out of the whole weekly timetable my eldest enjoys one subject, and my youngest enjoys one subject and the rest they hate. They hate the behaviour of many of the children, the swearing, the fighing, the teachers screaming, kids setting of the fire alarms for a laugh, kids throwing yoghurt pots at others just to see them get their sweatshirts covered. Older kids (old enough to know better) shouting names at kids such as mine who use the special needs building. My boys hate the endless tests on subjects they find boring, and my eldest doesn't get enough chance to just read, which is what he loves to do and is the one thing he shines at.

When in school they don't smile as much, and follow all the other kids into school with their heads bowed low. Every day we say "three days 'till the weekend, two days to the weekend" etc. etc. That really isn't right is it? Life is far, far too short!

Crikey, Montymoocow, what kind of shove do you need to wait for? I think an ordinary monday morning would do it for me, in your shoes.

xx