Critique this Road Trip California/Nevada/Utah road trip

[GettingPast]

Trip to be done in July with 2 adults & 2 kids 12 + 16.
22 nights total. It's very fully packed....

San Francisco – arrival afternoon - 3 nts
PETALUMA (Muir Woods + Wine region) 1 nt
BRIDGEPORT (Bodie State) 1 nt
MAMMOTH LAKES (Yosemite/Lakes) 3 nt
SPRINGDALE – via Death Valley (Zion) 2 nt
MOAB (Canyonlands/Arches) 3 nt
BRYCE (Bryce Canyon) 2 nt
LAS VEGAS (Casinos) - 1 nt
PALM SPRINGS (Joshua Tree) – 1 nt
Losa Angeles (Warner Bros + Universal) – 2 nts
PASO ROBLES (Hearst Castle) – 1 nt
CARMEL (Beach) – 2 nt
San Francisco – depart afternoon

Availability of accommodation and weather conditions are also a factor re the National parks particularly in high summer. Some places may be fully booked already particularly in Springdale.

I would not personally spend more than one night in SF. It’s not what it was.

the Warner bros studio tour needs to be booked in advance.

Would purchase a good scale map and look at driving distances, you are seeing an awful lot of road here. I appreciate it is a road trip but you would be better off spending more days in far fewer places. Do you really for instance need to go to Hearst Castle or even Carmel?.

I feel you will see more of the steering wheel than anything else and your kids will get tired of the almost constant moving about from place to place. Again you are trying to squeeze in too much and across a number of states even though you have three weeks. California itself is about the size of the UK from top to bottom. You will also have petrol cost to factor in and you will be filling the car a lot. Many of these drives are a minimum of 4-5 hours in duration, are you habitually accustomed to driving such long distances almost daily?. Mammoth lakes to Springdale is an 8 hour drive.

Thank you! Appreciate the honest feedback. And also tips about advance bookings .

Yes, it is a LOT of driving. DH want absolutely to do a lot of desert -type parks, but also see Alcatraz in SF (night tour) plus we will need a day to recover from long flight. So the 3rd night there is for that, but appreciate that the city has taken a dive.

We don't need to do all of it (eg Heart Castle/Carmel) but we do need to come up the coast from LA back to SF somehow. So the idea is for this to take us 3 nights. Kids want to do the Warner Bros/Universal otherwise I would not stop in LA. But they also have simpler wishes like 'breakfast a Dennys' and 'a trip to Target' LOL.

Mammoth Lakes to Springdale is an epic journey. Agreed. I could not see a way round it easily as not an easy way to cut this without adding in a destination like Death Valley which seems too hot for an overnight in July.

Hard to fit it all in. Maybe we should reduce the SF time, but was assuming there was enough to fill a day and half.

Have you considered flying back from LA rather than San Francisco? May save some driving?

I think you're covering too much distance in parts of your trip and will pretty much be spending all day in the car, stopping somewhere to tick a box saying you've been, sleep and then move on. If that's what you want to achieve, that's your choice but I think it won't be much fun once the novelty wears off and the constant living out of a bag gets tiresome. Why are you doing 1 night in Vegas then a 5 hour drive for 1 night in Palm Springs then driving to LA the next day? This just seems silly to me. I really think you need to prioritise what you want to see rather than trying to do everything.

Why don't you fly back from LA instead of SF if you're not bothered about seeing the Cali coast and want to do Vegas and Palm Springs? Or drop Vegas and Palm Springs and have time to enjoy the Cali coast. I imagine your DC would enjoy Monterey Bay Aquarium if you decide to drive the coast instead. Carmel is ok but nothing to get excited about. A couple of hours there is fine.

I was in SF in Nov and it was fab! Much improved compared to when I was there just after Covid. Muir Woods and Napa/Sonoma are within easy driving distance from SF so you really don't need to stop overnight there unless you're heading towards Yosemite direct from there.

I used to live in Silicon Valley and have done many road trips around here. I wouldn't do 3 nights in SF, it's really not that exciting

• I would look at Sonoma or Napa rather than Petaluma
• If you haven't already booked Yosemite it might be too late for July, so get booking quick
• I would then do Vegas for 2 nights, so that you have time to see everything
• Then onto Zion, etc - not sure you need that many nights there, it will be very hot
• You could then drive down to Grand Canyon, through Flagstaff and down to Phoenix, then across to the Joshua Tree National Park, then LA

On your way back to SFO, Highway 1 is beautiful (though usually better to go down than up as you are then on the coast side)

Carmel is lovely, stop and see the Elephant Seals at San Simeon, you could also stop at Santa Cruz (if you are Lost Boys fans, this is where it was filmed)

For kids Monterey is probably more interesting than Carmel - check out Fishermans Wharf

Then up via Half Moon Bay, where all the surfers are on your way back to the city

I’d stay in Yosemite itself for that amount of time rather than Mammoth Lakes, which I didn’t really rate (but we only passed through). So go San Fran > Petaluma > Yosemite and skip Mammoth Lakes and Bridgeport / do them as trips from Yosemite - but mainly because I don’t like to have too many one night stays on a road trip.

I’d stop in Big Sur or even Cambria if Big Sur is too far / too close to Carmel rather than Paso Robles - but I genuinely didn’t see the attraction of Hearst Castle, so if you want to go then Paso Robles might work.

I’d do an extra night in Vegas and then drive straight through to LA (we’ve flown Vegas to LA and then drove back to Vegas all in one day before and it wasn’t horrendous). I’d also lose a night from Carmel and stay in Santa Monica for your LA portion and do the beach there instead.

The main drawback for me would be the number of desert national parks which for me get a bit same-y - but that may be non negotiable for your DH. I’d want more beach/forest/mountain/city to break it up a bit, and there’s a lot of choice for that in the region but it’s not my holiday!

I also agree with PP that I’d stay in Monterey not Carmel and San Simeon seals is a must see. As is driving PCH (we went North and it was fine).

We did 3 nights SF and have been back for 2 nights since, so I don’t think that’s too much - but we did do one day trip out to Muir Woods and to San Jose.

We did Route 66 from Vegas to San Diego one year, which sounds cooler than it was. As a pp mentioned the deserts can look all the same after a while, I did say after that particular journey, that if I never saw another cactus again it would be too soon🌵

We loved Carmel. Best beach and a lazy few days. Should be whales at Monterey.

To me, that itinerary is horrible. Just driving for the sake of it. There’s plenty to see in SF too. We would never go back to Vegas (full of very hot people trying to walk on a sidewalk)and you are driving for miles and miles and rushing the best bits. You’ll need 22 days to get over it when you get back. You will be in an air conditioned car though. So make the most of that because Utah will be unbearable. I would stick to California which can easily be 3 weeks. Actually do some research on things to see and do as opposed to driving all day. LA has the Getty Centre, Malibu, Santa Monica and drive Mulholland Drive.

Do Utah separately after flying to Vegas. Then you can add in all the sights there and come home from Phoenix. Go at Easter for a pleasant trip. You then get the Grand Canyon, Bryce. Zion, Sedona, Mesa Verde and Monument Valley. There’s a lot of driving just doing that.

I have been to Las Vegas once & honestly I would never go back - except you you can see the Grand Canyon and the Hoover Dam from there - otherwise I think Las Vegas is unremittingly dreadful - but this is one opinion @GettingPast I enjoyed the trip round Alcatraz . BUT I did it by flight and taxi and helicopter - not a road trip .

I’m in Palm Desert right now. It’s a 90 minute drive into the centre of Joshua Tree from here, so it’s madness to think of it as a place to stay for one night. If you must travel from LV (also madness IMO) you should stay at Twentynine Palms which is nearer, and also nearer to LV.

Which of the things on your list are a must-do?

Have you thought about the heat? We used to do road trips like this as a kid but never past April and even then the heat was insane at times. I’d do this trip at Easter but not in July.

I agree with others it's far too much, either stay north California and see Yosemite and the coastal routes or stay south San Diego/LA. I wouldn't go to Palm Springs or Death Valley in July either. Las Vegas is relentlessly hot in summer too, but lots is inside so it is manageable. Prepare for 40+ days and get out early. I would either open jaw SFO/LAS or LAS/LAX or vice versa would be your better bet, slightly higher car hire rates but worth it to avoid a complete day of driving.
For kids that age, I would fly into Vegas, go to Moab, Bryce, Zion, then to San Diego (Zoo and Midway and La Jolla beaches with a much more coastal climate) Then go up to LA and see Universal maybe via Legoland, my kids were a little younger when we went but it's still great. Vegas is a bit marmite, my kids hated it but it's a great hub if you want to see the southwest USA which is just incredibly beautiful. Don't forget the Hoover Dam!

We drove LA to San Francisco a few years ago so can only comment on that section (though the whole thing as you’ve planned it sounds a LOT).
I loved Hearst Castle (unlike PPs!) but the absolute highlight - actually a highlight of my life - was seeing the blue whales off Santa Barbara. Totally mind blowing and you are the right time of year. Your kids would love it (I also loved the Alcatraz tour)

That's a long time in Bryce/Zion/Moab.
I'd also recommend open jaw return tickets. We flew in to Vegas and back from San Fran.
I'd also add Yosemite, and a warning that it will really, really hot in July/Aug.

Forget what I said above about staying in Twentynine Palms to visit Joshua Tree. We drove through yesterday and it’s a bit of a dump - has changed since we were last there.

Yucca Valley looks better, and probably only about 25 mins drive into the main park area. It’s about 3.5 hours from Las Vegas.

@BasiliskStare Totally agree about Las Vegas. Totally horrible. We flew in, stayed one night (thank God) picked up
the car and got out. Car hire was adjacent to our non casino hotel but it’s a grubby place.

@TizerorFizz I went once and it was a work trip ( So I did not pay myself ) . I had some time to look at some sights but Oh my goodness , ( just a personal opinion ) I found it depressing. BUT I am glad I saw it once , not on my own dollar - I would not go back. I'm glad I have seen it , but not somewhere I would revisit. I was booked into a casino hotel ( the one with the Eiffel Tower. ) could not wait to leave.

But there are those who love it . ( Dpils used to go because if you stay in a casino hotel you can very much reduced rates - and if you don't spend all your money on gambling it is a relatively cheap way to get hotels)

I wasn't interested in some of the big shows - which some would love - so that is a different thing.

Bryce Canyon to Palm Springs via Vegas is 530 miles in 2 days, you won't get any time in Vegas, and so much driving. I love the National Parks but also Vegas, you need some time there if you do go. I thought Palm Springs was very boring, and LA is a big sprawl with so much traffic, I agree on Santa Monica or Barbara instead, or just skip the whole conurbation. Zion needs time as you need to bus in. Bryce is small, driveable and stunning. Yosemite is fab, but huge, miles to drive in, much better to stay I the park if not booked up.

I would recommend a night in Death Valley at furnace ranch, less time in SF. Zion was lovely but I think they had terrible floods, check what is open.

HI Everyone,
Thanks for all the great feedback.
I did some modifications: It's still very busy and the daily average road miles are 125 / day (this is a road trip! Kids know that too) but I think I added more time to cool down. Plus, we can skip stuff if we want (eg Japanese Garden)

1 SFO - arrive 3 pm - Sleep SF
2 SF - Embarcardero - Chinatown - Tram - Sleep SF
3 SF - Japanese Garden - ALCATRAZ (night tour booked) - Sleep SF
4 Pick Up Car - Sausalito (lunch) - Muir Woods (Redwoods) - Sleep near Bollinas
5 DRIVE - Yosemite drive through - Sleep Lee Vining
6 Bodie State Park (morning) - Mono Lake - Sleep Lee Vining
7 DRIVE -DEATH VALLEY - Dante's view - Sleep Las Vegas
8 Las Vegas - relax at Swimming Pool - Sleep Las Vegas
9 DRIVE - Sleep Cannonville (near Bryce)
10 BRYCE - Sleep Cannonville
11 DRIVE - Highway 12/24 (Capitol Reef) - Sleep Moab
12 ARCHES - Devil's Garden Trailhead - Sleep Moab
13 CANYONLANDS - Sleep Moab
14 DRIVE - I70 + MOUNT CARMEL HWY 9 - Sleep Springdale
15 ZION / Narrows - Sleep Springdale
16 DRIVE - I15 - Sleep Burbank (north LA, close to Warner Bros)
17 Warner Brothers (afternoon) + Hollywood- Sleep Burbank LA,
18 Universal studios - Sleep Burbank LA
19 DRIVE coast road (shortish) - Solvang - Sleep Cambria
20 Hearst Castle? - San Simeon Seals - Sleep Cambria
21 DRIVE coast road (shortish) - Sleep Carmel
22 Whales / Aquarium at Monterey? - Sleep Carmel
22 DRIVE 1 h 30 back to SFO - flight at 3 pm

Any better?

Just want to say that I realise SF, LV & LA can be very grubby.

I have limited time but they are necessary stopping points (flight, or a good halfway stop to Utah, or just needed to do the stuff the kids want).

In SF, we are just getting over jetlag and Alcatraz is the only stuff booked, otherwise, we will maybe just take it a bit easy. We have an airbnb in a quieter part of town, not near Union Square but north of the Golden Gate Park

In LV, we plan just to stay at the pool that day and recover from the previous day. Looking on Google Streetview I can see the Strip is an absolute monstrosity but I think will fascinate my teens. I was there in 1994 and remember well the atmosphere - fascinating (particularly inside the hotels/casinos) but grimy.

LA is just a necessary evil to see Warner Bros & Universal - not my choice but for the kids since we are subjecting them to so many 'boring' desert parks!

Finally as it's July the plan is just to do early morning / late afternoon in the parks near Moab - the hotel has a pool which we plan to cool off in from 11-4 ish. In Zion, the Narrows (if not flooded) should be cool, if busy. And Bryce is a cooler park as it's at altitude. As for Las Vegas / Death Valley / and LA, these will be very hot and we will just have to tolerate it (air con in car & room!)

We do Cali coast every few years ( mix work with holiday) and I love the nice bits of LA and Santa Monica/venice,

Last time - 5 months ago we did 3 days Laguna beach ( lovely) , ( you can easily do Disney from there) - 4 days LA and 3 days Santa Barbara ( always lovely). - mix in with a few days at Palm Springs and that's my ideal holiday!! I think even more driving than that would be really wearing- it's not all wide roads, sun top down and relaxed!

The revised itinerary needs further sharp pruning.

You are still trying to fit way too much in with an awful lot of driving about and otherwise ticking boxes. I would stick to CA itself rather than also travel into Nevada and Utah, particularly in July.

Your kids will only see the back of your head in the car when in it, not much fun for them. The cost of refuelling is going to be high.

Parts of Death Valley National park remain closed until 2025 due to residual storm damage to roads as a result of Hurricane Hillary.

July is peak season for Zion, if you do go there use one of their shuttle buses early in the day.

Springdale to Burbank is about 430 miles distance, that is further than London to Edinburgh. Are you readily accustomed to driving such distances?.

There are hotels close to Universal studios, would consider staying in one of those rather than over in Burbank.