Any BioMed Scientists around please

[IbizaToTheNorfolkBroads]

I was hoping someone could give me some advice on BioMedical Science degrees. DS is Y12, and planning to apply next term. We are begining to go to open days. He is predicted AAA for Biology, Chem and History A Levels. He just took Level 3 Functional Skills Maths.

DS has been advised to look for degrees which are accredited by the Institute of Biomedical Science . Looking at the IBMS website, a lot of Russell Group/more established Unis eg: Sheffield, Liverpool, Newcastle are not accredited, even though they offer this degree?

Why is this? Is it because these unis have medical schools and are more focused on producing doctors than standalone BioMed scientists?

DS has a good selection of open days booked, all at “accredited” unis, but I was wondering if we were missing something here. DS aspires to a career in a lab rather than at a bedside!

Editing to say it is the Clinical Scientist route I went down (of which Clinical Biochemist is one type). With your son's grades that would be more suitable I think vs Biomedical Scientist. Clinical Scientists enter essentially a graduate scheme and aim eventually for Consultant level, analysing patient results and dealing with specialist tests. Biomedical Scientists are lab-based. I left because there are very few roles for Clinical Scientists and I wasnt prepared to move, but some of my old friends/colleagues stayed and are mostly happy. I was very employable due to my experience and degrees, they are very transferable to big pharma so that option is always there.

your ds is showing his bias. Whilst he may be right about Solent, he’s very wrong about NT for example.

As others have said, an accredited degree means you can work in the NHS as a Biomedical scientist as you’re HCPC registered. Obvs there’s other routes and roles into the NHS.

These are so hard to get into, I think less than 50 jobs a year come up, I've seen PhD students not get passed the first stage. Competition ridiculously high. Not saying don't go for it but it's so hard.

Yes, you’re right @kshaw, it is very competitive - I suspect I’m very qualified relative to my actual salary (Band 7), and the next step (Band 8 manager) isn’t exactly attractive. That said, I do enjoy my job and getting to help NHS patients every day.

A first degree from NTU isn't going to be career-limiting in any way, it's absolute nonsense to suggest that it is, it's a perfectly respectable mid-range university.

Bearing in mind that anyone wanting to get into medical research is going to need further degree(s) anyway, a student can always 'upgrade' later. DD2 loved her time at NTU and did well enough to gain a place on a highly prestigious Control of Infectious Diseases Masters at LSHTM, which will be known to anyone in that field. @Sparkles29 your last sentences are completely without foundation.

Many of the people I know who have a biomedical science/s degree don’t even work as biomedical scientist . A friend of mine did a masters after her degree and now works as a HR Manager
Dd2’s friend works in one of the investment banks in Canary Wharf . She just chose the degree because she found it interesting
Dh’s niece did a biomedical science degree and now works in NHS management ( fantastic salary btw)
A couple of dd2’s friends went on to study medicine

I think the accredited Biomedical science is beneficial if you want to work for the NHS

I’m a scientist, but not bio, chem or med!
And it’s 37 years since I applied to uni, and 26 years since I graduated for the last time.

There are Consultant Biomedical Scientist roles as well so people can progress into more clinical roles without doing solely management for band 8.
The roles are generally within Cellular Pathology including histological and cytological reporting.

As previously mentioned an accredited Biomedical Science degree is required to work as a Biomedical Scientist in the NHS, it's a specific specialist role title, it doesn't just mean a scientist generically and it covers the sample analysis done across the NHS (haematology, histology, microbiology etc.). BMS' start at Band 4 and can progress quite high on the NHS scale. For us the accredited degree is often taught by people who were biomedical scientists, many of them will therefore not have PhDs and will have more limited experience of research. Other "bioscience" degrees (this can be a specific degree name but can be a catch-all for the various other bioscience degrees) will be less focussed on those specific requirements, they will be taught by more typical academics with PhDs who may also be research active depending on their University. I expect the non-accredited route to be more like this - check module descriptors specifically for the courses you're interested in.

Lab roles for BMS' in the NHS are relatively common although active research roles are not, Clinical Scientist spots are very rare. Higher academic roles (permanent lecturer posts) are increasingly rare and difficult to get to and would require substantial further training, pay is OK but certainly not good for the level of education and experience required. Generally, in the current climate industry is a probably a better option and is easier to get into at the bottom, although pay is still generally rubbish. If you're wanting to maximise career prospects regulatory affairs is a good option but will take you out of lab work; but then, so will most roles at a higher level.

As others have said the "accredited route" is considered training to be an NHS lab Biomed. You need the accreditation for an NHS diagnostic lab. The pay isn't great and the work can be repetitive. The unaccredited courses at more redbrick unis are more academic, often lectures are conjoined with neuroscience and biochem students. There are a lot of lectures and lab work. Many students go on to funded PhD's, postdoc posts and then lecturing/running a uni lab. Some students segue into graduate medicine or allied health roles or lab based medical research. Many of my eldest child's friends went into Med Comms or Medical writing and editing. Some went onto regular business or law graduate scheme routes such as accountancy, business consultancy, logistics, project management, NHS management, medical patent law, civil service fast stream etc. The course provides a lot of transferable skills.

If you do an unaccredited course, many of the ex Poly's offer a 1 year course to do the project work to get accredited if you want to work in an NHS lab.

The degree at Newcastle is accredited by the Royal Biological Society and nearly all of DD's course mates went on to post grad degrees and more research - immunology, PhD, post grad medicine and, in DD's case, a masters in diagnostic radiography.

The Newcastle degree is more for students who want to continue into research or post grad medical related degrees.

I would say that neither type of degree opens more doors. They just open different doors.

Just to note, an accredited degree does not qualify you to work as a BMS in the NHS but it does meet the requirements to complete the IBMS registration portfolio required for state registration.
Trainee BMS posts are very few and far between, but there are also other routes into the profession such as placement years or some integrated degrees.
i think very highly of the Lancaster accredited degree, both from experience and as it covers both bases if you are unsure of which route you want to take.