Maths & Physics

[Fiddlesticksand]

DS has three offers, Maths at Bath, Maths & Physics at Warwick and Maths & Physics at Edinburgh. He’s predicted 4 A* and is interested in careers in the Quant or actuarial field. We’re in Edinburgh right now for the offer holders day tomorrow. Can any STEM experts help - he’s going round in circles.

I know it’s hard to say what career he might want but I would say:

Quant - Warwick - Very good uni and looked for in top firms. Has good financial routes. These job are very competitive and pay well for a reason. If he’s a quieter nature there’s a possibility of being eaten alive.

I would pick Warwick over Edinburgh however if he likes Edinburgh this is key. He has to spend 3-4 years in this city. So distance from
home and gut feel are important.

Actuarial - Bath - good relevant course. More job stability slightly less paid. Less likely to be dog eat dog.

Top thing I would ask for any course now days is if a 3rd year placement is available. Getting hands on 1 year paid placement is ideal for getting your foot in the door.

I would also ask him, if all three universities where the same for course / job prospects…which city does he get a better feel in. If he’s happier he will florish better.

If looking for a career in quant/actuarial, how about a Financial Maths degree rather than Maths/Physics? More relevant as the degree would normally include accounting, finance and economics as well as the Maths elements of Proability, statistics, quantitative analysis, etc.

My son was about to go with Maths/Physics as he didn't realise there was such a course as Financial Maths. When it was presented as an option at an Open Day, he became a lot more interested and less confused, and then concentrated on which Unis offered Fin Maths.

He ended up with a First in Fin Maths and got on the graduate scheme of the UK's biggest insurance/pensions firm, now half way through his actuarial professional exams.

The fin maths degree leaves the door open to more "Mathsy" occupations if your DS chooses not to go down the actuarial route after Uni, as it's also brilliant for economist/accountancy/quants/business professions etc.

Physics not particularly helpful for quant/actuarial jobs.

maths better as you can specialise and some og physics really isn’t relevant - solid state, quantum etc.
what’s the overlap in maths and physics?

He’s a bit of a polymath, although had to focus on STEM for A levels. Edinburgh appeals because of its flexibility but then the focus and rigour of Warwick looks great and Bath was lovely and great for placement year. He’s very sociable and independent.

Hi, OP -

Congrats to DS as these are all excellent offers.

Please take a look at the thread ‘Choosing between Maths and Stats….’ a little ways below. The option not mentioned in the title is Warwick Maths and Physics, and some posters specifically said this had led to great Quants careers. One of my posts referred to a similar situation in my family.

I am in STEM in the tier below COWI. I agree that COWI STEM graduates have extra cachet when it comes to quants careers, no doubt about it. But our top students do well, and so well those from Edinburgh and Bath.

So I think it largely comes down to where DS feels best. He needs to attend all Offer Holder Days to make an informed choice.

BTW I agree with PP that regardless of his degree programme (all of these qualify) he may want to investigate an actuarial career, if only to make an educated rejection. Actuaries are consistently amongst the top 3 most satisfied professionals, decade after decade. It’s about pay, job progression, day to day satisfaction, etc. The whole package.

Best wishes to DS.

Hard disagree with the comment on physics. Many actuaries have physics backgrounds. It’s basically hard applied maths.

Where do you live? Ease of travel between uni and home should also play a part in the decision. He might not want Edinburgh if you lived in Penzance for example.

And are the fees for Edinburgh higher than the other two if DS is living in England so technically an “overseas” student in Scotland.

We’re in Essex. I am scottish though and went to Edinburgh so I’m trying really hard to be objective. He will have easy access to London for interships if he’s lucky enough to get one. Fees will be the same each year but obvs there’s he extra year at Edinburgh..

The reality is that times are hard and that extra year might be a step too far for many families. That’s completely understandable.

If your family has the good luck not to be in this situation, I think DS’s confidence that he made the best choice is the most important thing. Many, many decisions that really add up flow from this sense, or its absence. A bigger loan seems to me worthwhile in this context. This comment is based on considering the aggregate experience of my personal tutees and other UGs I have got to know.

Yes, I know, my son who is half way through his actuarial professional exams agrees that there are several Physics graduates on the same graduate scheme as he is. Most "popular" at his firm is Maths, followed by Physics, then economics. But he says the Physics and Economics graduates struggle more in the actuarial professional exams, as they've not had the same depth of probability/statistics/quants as the Maths graduates. So, of course, it's "possible" for a Physics graduate to go into Actuarial work - just like lots of other degree subjects, but my point was that a Maths degree (or better still a Financial Maths degree) makes it easier to study for the actuarial professional exams. So if the OP's DS is set on becoming an actuary, then a Maths/FinMaths degree is probably the better option, but if they're undecided and what to keep their options open, then a Maths/Physics degree is still a good option, but would mean it being more challenging if they then went on to train to be an actuary.

Thanks everyone, super helpful, especially @poetryandwine. The Edinburgh offer holder day was hugely helpful and we met others with exactly the same Warwick/Edinburgh question. His Edinburgh offer is higher than Warwick so he may lean to Edinburgh with Warwick as insurance (seems funny to be writing that), but let’s see after Warwick offer holders day on 29th. Then it’s only a week to decision day. He’s still waiting for UCL but that was already blown out of the water after Bath.

Just in case anyone’s interested, he’s gone with Bath with Warwick as insurance and will aim for Masters at Edinburgh, maybe. It was the placement year at Bath that swung it.

Great programmes. Best wishes to DS

Been on the news that Edinburgh lecturers are on strike and that this could go on for the longer term so I would factor that in.

Any and all universities may have strikes during a given degree.

I've heard very good things about Bath's maths degrees that offer placement years (if you can get a placement.)

Your son should do a bit more research into quant if he's thinking of that as a future career. Typical roles are a quant trader, quant researcher or quant developer and they need different sets of skills. There are also roles in risk management.

Quant firms look for a very maths and stats heavy degree, they generally are not interested if you have done economics, finance etc as they will teach you the finance part.

Unsurprisingly, Oxbridge and Imperial are the top feeder unis in the UK. The likes of Edinburgh and Warwick are some way below in terms of numbers.