Built Environment Uni Offers - Which to Firm?

[Persephone2816]

Hi,
Desperate for some advice on this one, please. DS has been interested in a career in the built environment sector for years. Initially, he was convinced that Architecture was the way forward and did work experience, etc, but when it came to visiting uni open days in Y12, he was a little thrown by the overwhelming emphasis on 'creativity' and started to question whether he'd be better suited to other roles within the industry. To clarify, he obviously realised there would be a huge focus on 'design' - and he does A Level Art so he's creative enough - but I think he considers himself more logical/practical and something about the presentations obviously convinced him this area of the sector, perhaps, wasn't really for him.

Anyway, he did a 'Careers in Construction' placement with one of the huge London-based construction companies and loved it and was introduced to quantity surveying as an alternative pathway. As such, he applied for QS at Loughborough, Reading and Oxford Brookes, but also the MSci in Construction Project Management at UCL. He's received offers from them all but is struggling to choose which to firm. I can tell he's flattered by the UCL offer (and there's a lot of encouragement from his friends and teachers to go with that option - from a 'prestige' angle, I suspect.) However, the cost of London is eye-watering, plus it's proving very difficult to gather that much information about the course other than from the outline on the website - no department open days or offer holder events to attend, for example. By contrast, we recently attended the Loughborough offer holder day and came away with a sense that it would be 'money well spent' and that he'd be doing a RICS accredited degree with good employment/sponsorship/internship opportunities. Added to which, the affordability of Loughborough, as compared to London, would enable me to help out financially and reduce the amount of loan required. With London, however, that 'help' won't be all that significant.

I don't want to burst his bubble if he's desperately keen to go to UCL but would like him to really consider the pros and cons of the decision he makes. Firstly, I wonder how much difference the 'prestige' of the uni makes in this type of industry? Also, whether a QS degree would stand him in better stead, and possibly still allow for a move into project management, than a CM degree? His teacher said that being based in London would be highly beneficial, given most of the big companies are based there and have links with the Bartlett at UCL, where he'd be based. I wonder how significant that is?

Any insight, especially from those 'in the know' in the industry, would be so gratefully received. Thank you.

Caveat – I know nothing about the subject, and which of the courses would be a better option; but the comments of his teachers about the advantages of being in London should certainly be a factor.

Is he desperately keen to go to UCL? It’s not clear from your post, sorry. I would try to get more clarification on the UCL course – can he email someone at the uni?

Why am I even posting haha? well really to offer experience from the ££ PoV. DS is at Loughborough and we have found it a great uni and a cost-effective one. Yes there are expensive halls but there are also more basic ones that are a lot cheaper (like, fees of around £5k – compare that to London). If the money is a concern for you that's not to be sneezed at, esp if the course if a four-year one. DS has been at uni forever (! long story) but even this year his rent in a lovely room, just as an example is only about £7k for the whole year. So it is worth thinking about.

Otoh the social offer in London compared to Lboro (depending on his interests obvs) is so superior.

Thank you! That's good to hear about Loughborough. The UCL offer was later to appear than the others and now he doesn't know what to think. He'd been busy deciding between the QS course at Loughborough and Reading till then. We've decided to go to London for a walk around 'campus' tomorrow to get a general feel and he's going to contact them to ask a few questions and whether there's anything planned for offer holders.

Is there much difference in modules? I work in the industry and the graduates either leave university ready to work or they have no clue!

Some of the "no clue" grads come from decent unis!

There's a definite crossover but the UCL course looks as though it could be more applicable to business management in general, and therefore possibly useful if he decides to go for employment in a slightly different direction in the end, whereas the other courses are accredited and the first step towards chartered surveyor status - and Loughborough factors in a year in industry which sounds like a very good plan. In any case, he's hoping to get summer internships to get more know-how about the job in practice.

Reading and Oxford Brookes are the top two for surveying, real estate, built environment courses. They have really good links to industry.

Not in the industry but know a fair bit about HE.. I think for a pretty vocational course like this, the links to employers/industrial placements opportunities outweigh the “prestige” of the University massively. Almost more than course content, links with employers, practical experience, and industrial placements are probably the deciding points for these sorts of programmes.

DH is a QS. We are in Scotland and QS degrees not offered by the ancient unis. He thinks all providers reasonably similar but has limited experience of those studying outside Scotland/NI. Personally he prefers degree apprenticeship trainees (his own route ages ago) and then undergraduate with work experience and then one year postgraduate conversion degrees. Passing professional exam quickly when in job more important to him than uni attended.

DH says construction PM although having overlaps is quite different from QS. So worth looking at the modules to see what interests your DS more. Early in his career DH was offered a construction PM job but says switches from QS not so common now (at least where he works).

For what it’s worth he sometimes works from the kitchen table and I overhear meetings. Construction PM seems more interesting to me (but I would never considered accounting like jobs as a career and my DH clearly loves it).

DS 1 did construction management at Loughborough, DS2 QS at Loughborough.

both liked the Uni and both working in the industry via grad schemes with global firms (1 working abroad at the moment).

I know someone who did the Loughborough course and loved it . He decided to go into teaching after though.
I know nothing about the other course.

The thing that stands out about Loughborough to me is that they call their computer room a "computer laboratory" 🤣

I recently did a QS course because our QS team were made redundant and I wanted another string to my bow. It's been really interesting!

Something like Construction Management sounds like it would provide a better overall skillset.

I know this isn't the point of the thread but if any other parents are looking - our strongest candidates are always degree level apprentices!

Thank you so much, Everyone. Such interesting insights and lots of food for thought!

What part of built environment did he like? QS is making the project work .. financially and from a Project Management side (arse kicking and nagging people to pick up their socks ) Planning and master planning are more the real life Sims side of things mixed with a forensic accountants eye for detail. Architecture is civils meets creativeness - a life of what ifs and broken promises.

DS us a constructuon managment graduate from LJMU, he and his course mates walked unto jobs 2 years ago, the QS grads of whom there are 4 times as many didnt. He currenlty works as a n assitant site manager for a big housing firm, frends work for other big industrial builders. He gets to go round site, check thing s out plan works and be the boss . He unfortnalty calls the qs staff bbean counters and they are rairly on site now. QS is more admin and maths costing bricks etc. than you may think. Get your son to look very closly at the modules. I had encouraged qs but im glad i didnt now as ds would not have enjoyed it. Look for RICs and COB accedited coursed for both btw

@Persephone2816 My DH is a Chartered civil and structural engineer. He made a fortune (consultancy business) by sorting out mistakes made on site. Builders and construction companies don’t want to pay for engineers who designed the schemes to oversee work on site, so they pay less to Construction Project Management folk who have never designed or built anything in their lives. They are really the bean counters and kick ass merchants who produce nothing in terms of design. Lack of engineering skills is a real issue so be very careful. So that’s why there’s no accreditation to anything on the course. It’s not a chartered profession such as engineering or architecture.

Of the others, Reading is excellent for land based careers like surveying. I cannot imagine Loughborough is a back number either. Regarding UCL, I really would want to know about what grads do afterwards. DH now does expert witness work and project management just isn’t the same as being a chartered engineer.

I work in the in the same field. Most of out grads are from Reading or UWE. I am at WSP but across my career it’s always been Reading or UWE. The QS’s are now called cost managers but that’s just fyi.

Again, thank you. This is all very helpful. On reflection, the 'costing' side of things perhaps isn't him so much. He'd probably much rather be out on site more. The Reading course definitely appeals as it's RICS accredited and offers the opportunity to switch between Construction Management/QS/Building Surveying as they all start with the same modules. It's encouraging to hear it's well-regarded within the industry.

I did a RICS degree at Aberdeen, so not much help other than to say that I believe Reading is held in very high regard within the industry. RICS offers a variety of pathways and may be the best way of leaving options open.

@Persephone2816 I’d certainly agree Reading should be a front runner. Our friends have a land buyer DS who went to UWE.