Wanting to go to university but predicted CCU at A level

[elliejjtiny]

The C's are actually merits because he is doing diplomas or btecs, i can never remember which but they are equivalent to 1 a level each. The U is his a level. He really wants to go to university and do music production but the course he wants to do requires CCC. I went to university with CCU grades and ended up with a 2:1 but that was a long time ago and i think they expect much higher grades now. Also worried that if he gets in to university he won't be able to keep up as he is struggling with his a level now.

@StrongandNorthern
It is true and it is going to get worse as student numbers drop. It is hard for them to cope without overseas students bringing in the money The following is from AI
UK universities are struggling to recruit students due to a combination of factors, including a significant drop in international student numbers following changes to visa rules and increased government scrutiny on migration. This has exacerbated long-term financial pressures, caused by stagnant domestic tuition fees and a decrease in per-student funding. The resulting budget constraints force universities to cut recruitment spending, such as marketing and scholarships, further hindering their ability to attract students.

Thank you. He is year 13. His highest gcse grade was in maths which is why he was encouraged to do it at a level. I have no idea what he would do if he had to change his a level. He didn't want to do the extended diploma in music because that would mean performing and he wasn't interested in any other extended diplomas his college offers, not that there are many. We were restricted on which college he could attend because he can't use public transport and we have younger dc at school as well so we would have struggled enormously to get him to a different college on time. He wanted to go to this college where most of his friends from secondary go anyway. Not sure whether it qualifies as a home studio but we have a mac computer with logic, speakers, pedals, various instruments etc. He's got grade 3 piano which he took 3 years ago.

Lots of concern about the future recruitment of students in the UK
https://www.universityworldnews.com/post.php?story=20250819042313473

More students in the UK are choosing local universities to cut down on living costs. As school numbers drop (primary schools affected so far but it will soon affect secondary). The numbers applying to universities will inevitably drop. There is plenty of evidence out there concerning Higher Education and falling numbers of student applications

Why on earth was he allowed to take A level maths?

it sounds like he’d have done much better on the extended Btec. At my son’s college they offered either a performance or production option but I acknowledge that smaller colleges can only offer the more popular performance option.

There will be universities that will accept him potentially with foundation year but they are not necessarily the ones whose students get graduate jobs. My son is currently in his 3rd year of a performance degree (though he half wishes he’d done production) & he has found the academic content challenging at times. However, he is already working in the industry alongside his studies at some fairly prestigious places.

Friends who just graduated from the less competitive colleges are struggling. My son find a very niche area, became very good at it, started offering it to amateurs (eg college bands & amdram companies) then started being approached by professional organisations.

I am making the assumption (but stop me here if I'm wrong) that the Maths A level is just 'an' A level, taken because he had to do a third level 3 qualification, and to contribute to giving him the wherewithal to apply to university, rather than being a required subject for his intended university course? (I am thinking of the stage crew's response to a certain Ms L Allen's opinion on the usefulness or otherwise of trigonometry as an element in the school curriculum here).

If Im right, and he basically just needs the 'point' from a maths grade and if, with a U prediction, he is actually going to be entered for the A level, then this is one instance of where some decent face to face tuition may be of value (if you can afford it). If not, has he investigated e.g. YouTubers who demonstrate worked examples of maths questions?

I am pretty surprised he was even allowed to do maths. Round her you have to have a minimum of 7 in maths GCSE and an average score of 7 to apply for the maths A level

I would definitely look at sorting him a tutor, you should be able to bump him up a couple of grades that way. And he can then always take a gap year to think about whether university is the right route and at least then if he does go he will be applying with actual grades rather than predicted.

I agree that it was poor advice from the school to let him take A level.maths if he only got a 6.

My dd really enjoyed GCSE maths and got a 9 but struggled with A level maths and wished she had chosen a different subject.

If there is any opportunity to improve the maths get a tutor. If not, or he is not motivated to so so, drop it. A U is no good on a cv and he was misled by thinking a 6 was making it worthwhile.

If he hadn't been allowed to do the Maths A level - which would have been the right decision - what would he have done, post 16?

There seems to be a lot of restrictions/wants and maybe he needs to be more realistic. Have high ambitions but be realistic as he will be competing with students who have much better grades and can perform. Uni is tough, it's meant to be academic and the harsh reality is that his GCSE grades suggest he would struggle, which will lead him to him being miserable.

Would be consider getting into another career and use music production as a hobby and see where it goes? There are lots of things that 17 year olds want but realism has to kick in.

I am astounded that he was encouraged to take A level maths. He would have been better off with something like Business Studies, if he had to take an A level at all. I’m not saying Business studies is easy, but I do think you need an innate ‘maths brain’ to be good at A Level.

If he’s not fussy on the uni, or the exact course he could get in with a DM in his BTEC- so there is time for him to work hard for it. It depends how much he wants to go to uni (BTECs seem to be more about the amount of work you put in, and talent you demonstrate rather than the ability to understand, remember, and regurgitate information for an exam).
Do you want him to go because you’re not sure he’s ready to work?

It sounds like there is some level of SN, would I be correct?

most students with a 6 in GCSE maths would not be permitted to do a level maths as the expectation would be that they would get a U and it woild
be a waste of their time.

music production can be studied at various places and if your concern is to keep him in education you might find somewhere to take him although the good places want decent qualifications and ideally physics a level.

my DS is musician and has a home studio set up which cost him several thousands.

Him wanting to stay at a particular college with his mate and his inability/unwillingness to find a college with a more suitable course for him despite transport issues is actually a problem. He is going to be competing with others who are dedicated to music whether as he's already demonstrating that not the centre of his world. That together with incredibly poor guidance from the school puts him into a position where I would be saying, you really need to start having some very difficult conversations with him.

He either gets his head down and gets that Maths to a low grade rather than a U to demonstrate he's really committed to uni to have a chance of getting something, he finds local experience of music production and he does that as work experience over the next year, finds a suitable bridging course like a foundation course or he starts to have a reality check about his chances in this field and considers what other options may be available to him. If he's prioritising his mates and he (and you) are not trying to over come practical barriers like transport, this isn't the gig for him as honestly it's just so competitive and his heart isn't going to be in it enough. That's the bluntest reality there is.

When you get to 17/18 you have to start looking past a future with your friends and beyond that being your whole world. You need to be looking past your mum and dad giving you lifts everywhere. Those friends probably won't be seen for dust come next September and he doesn't want to be the one being left behind. He needs to start making some choices about what is best for his future without clinging on to mates who won't be there much longer. Is he learning to drive? Is he working part time to save to learn to drive or to get a car? This stuff matters.

Why?

I'm detecting an element of a lack of maturity showing. Even the decision to do maths has a bit of that thrown in because he didn't want to do the performance element of music. It's an abdication issue where he doesn't want to put himself out of his comfort zone. The music industry is rough and requires an element of being almost slightly pushy at times. The kids who are super confident and super determined are the ones that will succeed in this field.

If that's really not his personality it's time to start being a little more honest about this and to start looking at other long term pathways or shorter term things that he's interested in and will at least give his a job chance so he can develop his skills in music as an additional thing rather than his primary career choice, in order to give him more confidence and more time. (See my previous comments about the lad who dropped out and worked his arse off in bars - this gave him opportunities to do the music production at those venues on the side and also allow him to learn to drive and having money coming in and not looking like a bit of a lazy waste of time). You can't be continuing to be doing all the leg work to find out what options and alternatives are out there. He needs to be proactive and participating in FINDING what he can do. He needs to be getting on Google and asking advice on music forums about how to get ahead.

It is better he recognises this, this year, rather than you get stuck with a disappointed lump at home who doesn't want to do anything and doesn't have a job or a course to go to when he doesn't get the grades he needs in August. That's the worst possible outcome. Something is better than nothing and not doing his dream job.

This is crunch time now - I know kids who have been in similar situations where it's actually been a real blessing to be in this position now and they've been able to get their heads around it and actually ended up in a better position than some of their friends who were predicted much better grades but then flunked. So don't think this is an absolute disaster. You have a little time to help him make some sensible proactive choices - but you need to be realistic. Be ahead of the game on this, rather than letting this fester for the next 9 months or you are going to have a disaster on your hands.

I wouldn't be quite so harsh or negative about every career path - but anything to do with performing arts, music or media really is like this and you need to know when you set out what you are going to need to do.

There are various different paths - he needs to find the one that's the best fit for him.

Make an appointment with the college and see if there is an option to switch the Maths A level to Core Maths. This is a level 3 qualification that is much more accessible to many students that A level Maths. It's worth up to 20 UCAS points, which might be just enough to get him to Uni, especially if he can now push one of his BTECs up to distinction.

IMO degrees are definitely easier than A-levels! That's certainly what I found and DS is finding. They do require you to put in the effort though, but they're much more like BTECs IMO. DS (ASD) did maths A-level and found it very hard even after getting a 9 at GCSE.

Is your DS autistic OP? I just wondered because of not using public transport. If that's the case I'd really recommend working on it with him in small steps as it is such a useful skill - especially if like DS he tries driving and doesn't like it. We did the same with DS.

Would he still want to go to uni to do production knowing that it may be very difficult to get a job afterwards? My recommendation for him would be comp sci, but it doesn't sound like he's interested in that? It would keep his options open much more but still be relevant to music production which he could do his own learning/projects in. It's a good sector to work in IME if he does have ASD.

@elliejjtiny I agree that A level maths from a 6 at GCSE was not a good idea. Tho despite what some posters have experienced, it is not unheard of for a school or college to allow it (Noblegiraffe, a maths teacher who posts here, faces this issue every year).

It is what it is tho – he is doing it and it would be best if he could increase the grade up to E or D. Can you afford some private tuition? That might be a good way forward.

I don’t know about the career path he wants to follow but it doesn't surprise me it is hard to get a role in it – like so many creative options. If I were him I would look at it in more detail. A gap year to consider and maybe earn some money doing something else might be a good idea. I infer he has some SEN, which will not stop him going to uni if he wants to in the end, but some greater maturity and confidence for him would be a plus if possible.

Thank you. Yes, he is autistic. We keep working on him with public transport but it's not going well. The maths teacher at parents evening suggested switching to core maths could be an option for him but she wants to see how he gets on in his mocks in November first.

To those saying he shouldn’t do alevel maths with a 6, it’s not black and white, it does depend why he got a 6. For example if he performed his absolute best, revised really hard, the exam went perfect for him, and he got the the end of the paper, then yes, his ‘level’ of maths isn’t going to be high enough. But if he got a 6 because he ran out of time due to ND, or was poorly on the day, or didn’t revise as he wasn’t ready to at 15, or etc etc

there are many many children who are capable of 9s but don’t get them for a whole host of reasons.

I’ll be blunt. The SEN support at the smaller, specialist music universities is often very poor even though a lot of ND students study at these places.

we have very good experience of SEN support at LCon, but that’s not the case elsewhere.

does he have a particular institution in mind? I acknowledge that sometimes it’s about keeping them in education until they mature that but to cope with life/work but these colleges are full of kids for whom music is their whole life.

you need 64 ucas points for foundation year at LCon, I think BIMM, Waterbear etc have similar ish requirements.

It would seem that he is being badly advised at school/college and, basically being set up to fail for fear of upsetting him. He really needs some realistic targets and management of his expectations. Whilst this will not be easy within his autism it will be kinder in the long term.

Core maths has a completely different content to maths a level. He could switch - it is easier - but there will be almost no overlap.

it would be like switching between two history courses - but one is world war 2 and the other is the tudors.

if he is autistic and cannot cope with public transport then uni is probably a push. However I do know students with that sort of profile who have got work at local theatres etc behind the scenes - lighting and sound tech and such like.

Doesn’t sound like he is applying himself or has the ability if he is getting those low grades at BETEC as they are much more aligned with uni courses than A’Levels. A talk with him about whether it’s actually something they are capable of.

Thankyou. My eldest is home from university for a week so I will ask him to have a chat with my younger one.

It won’t be a problem. He should apply but potentially expect to go through clearing. There is a space for anyone who wants to go to uni, not enough students and too many universities

Thank you. I think a gap year is a good idea because I think he would struggle with the uncertainty of not knowing if he got a place on his preferred course until the last minute. Ds1 had a gap year and it worked really well for him.

It's difficult as all through his life we were told ds2's disabilities were minor. He got turned down for dla at renewal when he was 10, after being on it since he was 5 months old. He was only diagnosed with autism a few months ago. Then we had an assessment for PIP a couple of weeks ago as i thought we would give it another try now he has been diagnosed with autism. The lady who came round said to me to make sure i applied for universal credit for him when he finishes college which makes me wonder if ds2 isn't as capable as we've been told all these years.