High predicated A-levels but average GCSE's- where to apply?

[BinBagFlipFlop]

DD wants to read economics at university, which I know is highly competitive. She got good but not brilliant GCSE results (888,777,66,5- in English language) but has high predicted A-level grades (AAA- A* in maths and economics) and these do seem not to be too far off as she's performed really well for over a year now, as well as gaining really good super curricular and work experience. She was quite unhappy for a couple of years at a highly competitive grammar school for GCSE, and I think that this (as well as being dyslexic) affected her final grades. She is now much, much happier in a standard sixth form college and seems to be much more confident academically and in herself.

She has just been to a meeting to discuss university applications this week and is now being advised by the college that she should go for more ambitious university options than she had lined up- maybe UCL or Kings, rather than ones that she felt were achievable (UEA, RHUL.) However, we are both concerned that her lower performance at GCSE will mean that these are not realistic options and she might end up with very few offers, or worse still, none at all given how competitive economics is.

Anyone's child been in a similar situation and what might be the best course of action?

My dd did humanities at degree, now on a highly highly competitive grad scheme (40000 applicants for less than 200 places) at a top 4 finance employer in the City. Her bff at work went to a non RG uni, think similar to Oxford Brookes (it wasn’t but it was the ‘minor’ uni in the town to a major RG uni). He got into the scheme

To get on the scheme they did a load of physcometric (spelling!) tests, a video interview, an assessment centre then in person interview. Lots don’t get through the test stage to video interview (it just asks you set questions, no interviewer as such). I can’t speak for other employers but the ‘top’ uni’s aren’t necessarily a gateway to a job in Finance. Most employers do however want a 2i or 1st (I think it’s PwC that take 2ii but wouldn’t put money on that)

what she needs to do is extra curricular things to make her stand out. DD was Chair of a Society for two years and was able to demonstrate lots of skills from that. She was on the Uni quiz team. She worked p/t. She did an internship. She represented her School (eg School of English) at Uni Open Days. She mentored local kids wanting to go to Uni. She took up a new sport. She expanded her cv beyond academia

what I’m saying is go where she’s going to thrive! That will be more important than getting into the top uni’sfor her subject xxx

Great point. I'm old but the difference between Maths and Further Maths is night and day. I got an A in Maths quite easily but struggled compared to other students who had taken Further Maths.

Has she thought about retaking her English? My ds got his up from a 5 to a 6, which you need for LSE and some others. And would she consider an apprenticeship? My DS is doing one to be a professional economist. He has just started and loving it. Its not for the faint hearted though, the application process is tough and it is working and studying at the same time.

Should add its an undergraduate apprenticeship with the civil service leading to a BSc.

Where does she want to go?
KCL/LSE are great, but I know people who went to UEA and RHUL and had a brilliant time. It's not all about the 'kudos', it's where you fit.

Technically it is a campus uni? All the buildings are together. One central campus in Holborn. Always expanding. The estates team love buying new buildings and developing the university.

My eldest is a recent-ish LSE economics grad. He occasionally goes back. The "experience" is fine. What's so different/bad about it?

@Thjs It's a great school and I feel very lucky to have obtained my Master's there. Also being in the middle of London was an unique experience. I am just saying it is very different from being at a uni with a large campus almost like a park which is the case with UEA.

If the third A level isn't FM I would be careful about the very top heavy maths based courses as the vast majority will have FM and its not uncommon for people without to struggle. Its similar to the maths in a maths degree. I would check out if you can the percentage of students with FM if that's not her third on the heavy maths courses especially as she struggled with competition before.

Also I would investigate how much essay writing is involved if this is an issue - I did 3 essays a week in my economics degree, my DD does 2.

I would go for where she thinks she will be happiest though do as much research on each place as you can and have a plan B as it is very competitive and there have been cases when students have 4 A stars and no offers (I would guess they put top 5 down). Plan B could be clearing (Cardiff was in clearing for example) or a year out. And if she is anxious consider the type of university that would be better for her - look at where she and others would live, the social scene, opportunities for her interests, whether she would find a big city overwhelming or an attraction and pastoral care / SN support.

DD does not need to retake English. She has just excluded 2 unis out of a very long list of possibilities. FM or lack of might be the biggest sticking point here. But again that might just exclude a few more. Still plenty of brilliant ones to chose from.

You've already had some great advice here and you are so right to think about your DD's well-being as well as uni reputation.

People say that the cost of a uni degree makes it even more important to ensure it's a "valuable" degree but I'm almost close to thinking the opposite. It might be that the degree won't be "worth it" in financial terms and that makes it even more important that you're in a place where you feel happy and have the confidence to develop yourself and take advantage of all the opportunities.

If you're going to be paying out a lot of money for the rest of your life you want to be able to say "It was worth it because I had an amazing three years and learnt so much and did so much".

If two places look equally great and one is more highly regarded by all means choose that one. But rankings should never be the only factor.

I known nothing about GCSES etc and UEA from a student perspective. From a perspective of Norfolk resident I can tell you that Norwich is a shit hole and I wouldn't send a lone young woman there. I can imagine this was a lot different 25 years ago. I work in Norwich but can't imagine living there. Admittedly I'm not a city person and I get the fuck out in 10 seconds flat. Also, locals strongly dislike students. I can imagine this is the case for many cities today but maybe OPs daughter should take the environment under consideration as much as the uni. This is going to be a few years of her life, better she's safe and happy.

what an enormous pile of horse shit

Norwich is a fabulous city and UEA a fabulous university.

but thanks for your data point of one

My DD is in her fourth year at UEA and loves it. She loves the city too, has never had an issue with safety or locals.
I've visited many times and never experienced any problems either.

I don’t understand why her college didn’t tell her about FM. Or has she only recently decided on economics?

Would she be keen enough to be prepared to do FM on her year off? That would give her more choice.

Retracted. Read more, understand better

@labradorservant You forgot St Andrews but everyone knows these universities might as well be RG snd are now referred to as RG plus. The real non RGs are Surrey, Reading, Oxford Brooks and Sussex to name just a few. However Surrey is creeping upwards and is always worth a look.

@QuickPeachPoet And others - she’s not mentioned lse. DD will really need FM for there. So a somewhat pointless discussion about the “campus”. Yes, she should check where FM is really important but it’s not a barrier if dd doesn’t have it for many good courses.

As for the Norwich comments - utterly bizarre NFN comment! UEA is like any other new university attached to a city! It’s integrated into the community and the community benefits from it. DD can do better though.

The comments about London - if she’s looking at several London universities I assume cost isn’t a problem! She also wants a city job so hardly averse to London. Not sure DD has considered the competitiveness of very clever people though. Grammar school with knobs on.

Yes the FM is merely a small point to factor in. Nottingham and Loughborough and many others don’t even need maths. DS at Bath has a maths module (think that’s normal) and a computer programming module. Think that’s why FM might be favourable.

Sorry, this should have said son was predicted all A stars (not A’s) and already had one A star and still turned down from Bristol (all 8’s and 9’s at gcse) so some unis and courses are extremely competitive.

DS had average GCSEs - mainly 7s. But he's come into his own in A-levels and is consistently getting As and A stars in his essays and tests. Has been predicted 3 A stars. He put together a strong personal statement with good extra curriculars and has just applied to Cambridge. Maybe his GCSEs will rule him out of even being called for an interview - but you don't know til you try. We'll find out soon!

If really shouldn't have been a surprise that Bristol look at gcses though. Every degree course has its own admissions statement as a PDF on their website entry criteria page which specifically sets out the weighting between gcse grades and predicted A level grades as they are scored. It tends to be 20/80 or 30/70 weighting and then in tie break situations the personal statement is considered.

Good luck. Cambridge does put less emphasis on gcses than many other unis and indeed the other place

That's your opinion, which weirdly enough, you are entitled to and I don't agree with. Funny that, 2 people can have completely different experience, who would've thought.

Data point of one 🤔 Pot... Kettle...?

Locals are not openly hostile but they are complaining about the housing situation connected with the amount of students etc.
They just prefer houses were not turned into student accommodation as it's drives prices and demands up in a very weird market.
If you are up to date with the local affairs there have been some issues, especially lately, it's getting less and less safe.
I personally wouldn't walk around after dark, I've seen things going on midday, never mind at night, in a very centre of Norwich.
I would say visiting and living here is not exactly the same but I'm glad your daughter and you only had positive experiences.
I wouldn't want to live in Norwich if they paid me.

Anyway... Not to hijack OPs post I will bow out. Wishing OPs daughter all the best for the future.