Fine art degree: employment prospects

[EpsomSalted]

My child is predicted A in Art, A in history and A in Spanish at A-level. She is leaning towards doing a Fine Art degree but her other option is History with Spanish. Her heart is with the art option.

How employable is someone with a Fine Art degree nowadays? What can you do other than be an artist, an art teacher, an art therapist or a designer? I know nothing of the creative industries.

Also, do you wed to do an Art Foundation before the degree? Her school says she does but uni requirements seem mixed.

and finally where is good for fine art that’s NOT in London?

all advice very gratefully received.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/higher_education/4795276-art-and-design-at-university-for-past-present-and-future-students-and-parents?page=15&reply=147312738

This is a good thread to look at.

In a nut shell:
Fine Art degree students are as employable as the next graduate... there are many creative jobs outside of making it as a pro artist. Similarly generic grad jobs can be applied for with a Fine Art degree
Many transferable skills are learned.
There is no need to do a Foundation. It can help students decide between Art disciplines and gives an extra year to get used to the very independent nature of Fine Art degrees. Often Art degrees now have integral foundations (ie they are 4 year programs)..these are NOT free. Standalone foundations are. So take care there.
There are loads of options outside of London. Look at Man Met, UWE, Bournemouth Arts, Newcastle Uni, Leeds Uni, Loughborough, Leicester DMU and many many others.
Don't be put off that many of the art schools are in 'modern' universities. Many like Man Met started as stand alone art schools. Traditional universities don't tend to have the best facilities for art.
My DS is in 3rd year of a Fine Art degree in UWE. He did a Foundation year at Leicester DMU. He has a grad job lined up starting next Sept..
He has loved the course. And is dreading losing access to all the facilities.

Got there before me, @Lottsbiffandsmudge !

I think designe rather than fine art has a clearer career path.

I worked as an art teacher for a period of time. I had a degree in design and worked in industry for a long period of time before teaching.

All our technicians had fine art degrees and some MA’s. Getting paid 17k a year. All the DT dept including myself had spent time in industry. The fine art graduates had gone straight into teaching as they couldn’t get a job.

My son has also been in the same position - first choice fine art, second choice history, similar a levels and predictions. He visited lots of unis and was really excited about applying, particularly for Loughborough.

But after only getting rejections when looking for relevant work experience and after chatting to lots of fabulous artists at an open studio event over a weekend in our city and hearing how hard it is to make a living as an artist (and not seeing a huge difference in the work of those with fine art degrees and without - but probably his ignorance!), he's decided to go with history.

Also he might be interested in doing a masters in art conservation. Fine art is not accepted for that course at the European unis he looked at, but history is.

I did a Fine Art degree years ago and to be brutually honest it left me not qualified to do anything. I had to retrain in business and build my own art career, which has been a real struggle from the start. To make it work you need a very strong personality and a wide range of other skills, and the truth is the arts in the UK are not really valued. Fine Art degrees can work for wealthy people that have a financial safety net, but for working class people it is an extremely difficult path. These days, with Instagram and other platforms, anyone can present themselves as an artist without a degree and many are doing just as well with no qualifications at all. If I had my time again, I would not choose to do it. It’s made me sad to write this but that is my experience

I did a fine art degree as a mature student at Central saint martins and also studied for a BTEC HNC part time in multimedia design (Web design, graphic design, 3d animation).

This led me to be able to have my own art practice while also working part-time in marketing, communications and digital media roles.

I think that unless your parents are genuinely loaded and can support you in the lean early years of launching a career as an independent artist, you're stuffed basically.

I know a fine artist who did make a success of her paintings, but she also spent some time working in a frame shop and doing pictures for a fashion designer (pictures to be used on clothes, scarves etc). So that was related and lucrative. She didn't have particularly wealthy parents but they supported her beyond what you'd normally expect, in your 20s/30s.

I was always an A* student in Art throughout school and A-Levels. I was naturally talented and probably one of the best in my school. However I decided to go into humanities because I didn't see any real career prospects for art. I now just do it in my spare time and working towards an art-based side business. Part of me wishes I had done the art degree, but I also do believe in making sensible logical decisions so I don't regret it.

Could go into teaching - whether that be art or generally. There will definitely be more choices for the other option, does she know the career she would like to head towards? Sometimes it’s more practical to pick a degree with a wider range of options to be honest.

I'll reiterate again that Fine Art students are employable. Its about selling the skills learnt on the course in a different way.
So for instance my DS landed his internship (and subsequently the grad job he starts next Sept) as a result of his unique skill set after 2 years of his degree....
Creativity (v sought after in many careers), team work (putting on shows), leadership (running an installation at a public event), independent working, presenting, being able to connect with a lot of very different sorts of people, practical skills, communication and constructive criticism, networking, etc etc. He has been exposed to many more opportunities than the average traditional undergrad has . The nature of Fine Art means getting out of your comfort zone and putting yourself out there. Its not all about the technical art skills. Not in my DS degree anyway. I guess not all of them are the same though.
Like any degree, if you grab all the opportunities available, run with them and sell them to employers, you are employable.

could you be more specific?

I was an art student. Fine art is notorious for its awful employment rates.

Yoir ss was lucky. A lot of employers look at fine art and think it’s not the sort of degree l want.

From my experience the majority end up in teaching.

Well I wouldn't say his success is down to luck, rather his hard work, effort and the personal qualities and skills he has developed on his course.
But anyway. Its just our current experience of fine art. Which is worth saying for balance. And he hasn't had any adverse comments about his degree from the employer, nor other applications he has made. In fact many people he came across thought it was a strength. Hence why he secured a job.

It sounds like you're connected and trying to avoid saying so.

It wouldn't matter if he'd studied play doh at college, if you're connected, it makes a world of difference.

Err no!

@EpsomSalted art students have the lowest average starting salaries, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're not employable, just that they don't get paid very much.
https://www.suttontrust.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Earnings-by-Degrees-REPORT-1.pdf

It’s all about who you know and whether your parents are loaded.

my niece did fine art at St Martins. All her year are now working in hospitality or doing work experience for peanuts.

I’m sorry, but l know no one with a fine art degree who secured a prestigious job. Employers are really sniffy about it.

Most of them end up in bar/cafe work, or low paid admin work. Some paint on the side. No one makes any money. They do craft fairs and the such.

I know some cinematographers and other camera crew in film and tv who did fine art degrees and then post grads to specialise. Likewise with some HoDs from production design/art department and costume. It’s not and industry awash with jobs but just mentioning as you say you’re unaware of opportunities in the arts and this is one area where fine art is a good basis if she can then do a masters with more applicable skills.

Prospects.ac.uk produce an annual digest of employment stats by degree type (see link below). This may be of use.

I think it is helpful to think about three possible routes:

Do a degree other than Art and accept, at the outset, that art is a passion pursued as an interest outside paid work.

Do Fine Art at a mainstream/broad uni and so get exposure to students with a broad range of career ambitions, tap into a wider ranging careers service (like the PP with the DC at L'boro).

Do Fine Art at a specialist institution and draw on the benefits that can bring.

One of my DC earned decent money in their secondary school years with their niche digital art, winning commissions from overseas commercial businesses. They learnt that, in art, barriers to entry are low, producing creative output for others is not the same as hobby art and that you have to have good business sense, understand contracts, have systems for invoices and chasing payments etc

They choose to go down the 'art as a hobby' route, alongside a well paid career in another sector. They would say it was the right choice for them and, probably, gave them more freedom to explore other creative strands. So a realistic understanding of economic prospects, how art can sit in your life in different ways and how the uni experience (or otherwise) can be used to leverage career options is important.

luminate.prospects.ac.uk/what-do-graduates-do

Only worth doing art if you're really obsessed by it. Then it has a way of working out.

There is a good article in The Times today (Saturday) showing the earnings of graduates by subject and university. I know several ‘artists’ and they all supplement their income by teaching adults.

That report is really interesting.

Design ( which l did) has higher employment rates than English and History.’
I always think it should be classed seperately to creative arts. Design is a STEM subjects in schools. I used to teach lots of science as part of it.

The IFS has run a lot of data on which grads earn the most. Art - it’s near the bottom. As is performing arts. It’s not as employable because there’s no regular long essays, no Quantitive elements or critical thinking. So they might be set up for art jobs but other careers are difficult to access.

History is a much better choice and if she could do History and Spanish, even better. A year abroad is a great experience. My DD used her time abroad to study history of art. She could do an art course before starting her degree but I would say look at a career. What does she want to do with art and is it attainable? The ifs study suggests £25,000 a year is a struggle. History grads from a very good university do much better.

Being a mature student isn’t quite the same as an 18 year old with no contacts and not enough experience to be self employed. They simply would not get clients.

@Lottsbiffandsmudge Very very few get what your DS has. What degree has he got and from where? What is his starting salary? He’s managed to forge connections but internships are frequently unpaid (fashion notorious for this) and only for the better off. DD has one - it cost us! No research indicates fine art degrees are leading to great careers or starting salaries but some get lucky. Of course there are some jobs but we also have design degrees and all are competing for jobs. It’s very hard for fine art grads to make money.