Difference between studying Law at uni and law conversion after first degree?

[possiblelime]

Hi all,

Eldest DC is off to uni in the autumn which is prompting a fair amount of chat among her younger siblings and what they want to study!

My DS thinks he might be interested in becoming a lawyer. Aware that one can study Law at uni, or do a different degree and then do a law conversion course.

Am I right in thinking that Law graduates hope to start employment/official training in a firm following graduation (aware there would be a difference depending on if you want to become a solicitor or a barrister), but those who do law conversions study for a year, and then do the same?

A number of my friends are lawyers and did conversions, but that was a long time ago! What happens with finance for conversion courses? Is it just another year of student loans? Thanks

@onwards2025 oh I apologise then! I didn't realise how out of the loop I am 🙈

@FrodoBiggins A high quality English Lit degree isn’t a bad start. DDs Chambers wants intellectual ability and strong analytical skills. English lit does provide this. It’s an A level often taken by those wanting law at university so it’s a respected degree if dc carry on with it at university. I think the reason it’s not seen so much is due to what English lit grads choose for careers. Not so many actually choosing law maybe?

Yeah could be that. As I said, I don't see any reason why it would be seen as less than many other arts subjects, and we certainly wouldn't "mark down" an applicant for having an English degree. I'm just saying from my experience I don't think I know any English grads.

Wow actually scrap my message above. I'm a terrible friend as I just remembered that my very good friend, an excellent barrister, has an English lit degree and masters (both Cambridge). Oops.

@FrodoBiggins First degree becomes less important fairly quickly!

I know you've corrected it now, but I'm a solicitor with an Eng. Lit. degree as my first degree.

I've definitely come across a few others. Not as many as I did who studied history or PPE first, mind you!

You probably get more variety on your side as well, not least because you'll have way more colleagues than me! Agree that it doesn't mean much after a while anyway (if it ever did). I can imagine that reading through lots of dense text at speed and trying to pull out themes and analysis is pretty bloody useful!
But at the end of the day I'm a firm believer in study what you love, it's probably your only chance to learn for the love of it.

Yes, being able to read fast is definitely useful!

I definitely agree with the sentiment in your last sentence. Studying what you love makes uni far more enjoyable.

It's funny, as I lived with 4 law students in my second year. I'm the only one who's a solicitor!

Yes I’ve instructed a recently called barrister with a 1st English Lit from Durham and lots of drama extra curricular.
Whatever undergrad degree they choose it’s important to have very high A level grades and go to a high ranking university.
Yes they can use SFE postgraduate loan for conversion as long as it’s a masters (they offer a masters conversion plus a dissertation) but only 12,000 so just about covers fees nothing to live on.
And only one postgraduate loan so if they don’t secure funding from a firm or scholarship for the professional postgraduate training they need to self fund if they have already used their postgraduate loan on a conversion.

I have only read the first post (I am a solicitor with 4 solicitor children 2 of whom qualified last year). As I am sure others have mentioned if you do a law degree you do ONE post grad year (SQE). If you don't do a law degree you generally do 2 post grad years as law firms prefer that (and those becoming barristers must do that).
As someone else posted above there is only one masters loan - I was about to write the following so will leave it but it is the same point

If do not do law first and if you are not sponsored post grad by a law firm (most people are not sponsored) then you have a financial issue as you only have rights to one masters loan of about £12k so that does not cover 2 post grad years. Therefore financially it tends to be better to do law first. I did an LLB which I very much enjoyed.

if people want to see how those who are trainee solicitors did at university etc and where they went try a few google searches of "linkedin trainee solicitor" and then add the name of law firm where that person may want to work to see where current trainees went to university etc. for barristers pick a chambers eg Brick Court is one I have used and look at the CVs on the website for those who are the younger ones there.

About half of solicitors do a degree other than law first.

Brick Court is a £80,000 pupillage award so pretty top drawer. At most “average” chambers you find a mixture of first degrees in law and barristers who have converted. The ones who get huge scholarships and prizes as well as first class degrees m, distinctions etc will stand out. Barristers need this type of cv more than solicitors. I do think conversions cost more but if it’s the best way for you, it is!

I always find it strange that people will think a law degree is dry but then want to practice law, if you find it boring why would you want to do it for the rest of your career? Anyway, DS is literally about to finish his llb in the next week, he's really enjoyed it (other than one topic - can't remember which).

Who said it was dry and boring? I cannot see anyone who said that. You don’t often do all aspects of your law degree for the whole of your career. Most specialise at some point.

The PGDL is obviously less in depth but a broadly educated set of lawyers is good as they bring a variety of strengths.

It’s true that some might find another subject slightly more appealing at 18 and subjects dc have been studying for years might also be favoured. As long as they understand how to convert and the possible costs of doing so, a broader educated workforce is actually better in many ways, particularly for some specialist roles.

Someone upthread commented that people find it dry, similar comments are made on almost all threads about taking a law degree and we had MANY people say it when he was applying. Not sure why you're reacting to my comment so defensively.

In terms of specialising, at least the law degree allows you to see which areas of the law interest you and make choices about any preferred areas when applying for jobs.

People can take whichever route they prefer, I understand that people may not have decided on law at 18, my post was referring to people who think the degree is boring.

@JustHereWithMyPopcorn Not defensive and DD didn’t study law but others we know who did were happy. I think a handful of posters might think it dry and boring but it’s not a majority view as the courses at the elite level are very competitive. People say things that are not well informed and then they get repeated to put people off. Anyone not aiming for a top solicitor firm should look very closely at the cost and implications of the routes to qualification. I’m not pro one way or another but telling young people law courses are dry and boring is frankly foolish.

I didn't find it boring at all. How could any one? Topics like what are rights or what activity is needed for particular criminal offences are fascinating as are all the main subjects and so relevant to people's lives, even to your student tenancy agreement.

Probably Land Law! 😁

I don't know why people still trot out doing a non-law degree and a conversion as being a good idea. This is particularly the case if you are not from a wealthy background.

If you do a law conversion course there is very limited post graduate funding (1 year only) and no post graduate maintenance loan which makes it difficult if your parents don't live in a city with a law school). The cost of doing two years at law school plus SQE is roughly £25k IF you pass SQE1 and SQE the first time around. There is about a 60% pass rate I believe and so clearly lots don't pass the first time around. It's a really intensive exam and, unlike back in my day 30 odd years ago, it's now a standardised and centralised exam with every entrant sitting the same exam at the same time regardless of where they have studied.

There are lots of people who might not even think about a career in law until they are already at university but if you know from the outset that you want to do law then by far the cheapest option is to do a law degree.

I speak as a lawyer who didn't do a law degree and so I'm not biased against non-law graduates in the slightest. I don't however believe that law firms prefer non-law graduates. We don't sit around in the coffee room chatting about history dissertations or someone's knowledge of physics. We just want people who know the law, are confident, are hard working, are very intelligent and articulate, can get to grips with issues very quickly and who will get on with clients and thus generate work. Given how hard it is to secure training nowadays it's financially sensible to just do law from the outset.

The apprenticeship route after university will also not be valid from January. L7 apprenticeships will not be available if you already hold a degree, but are being pushed for school leavers.

user, I agree. There is a huge financial issue if you don't do an LLB first (although not for the very few candidates who find a law firm to sponsor their post grad but that is terribly competitive) and I write that as someone who did an LLB and has funded some of my children post grad (very expensive).

On apprenticeships - there are hardly any of them for potential solicitors, which seems to have been the main problem both for age 18 ones and for post grad ones.

@user760if you want the Bar, there are scholarships for fees from the Inns of Court if you qualify via low income. It’s one year. Then you have 1 year barristers course then hopefully pupillage. There are scholarships for the bar course too and residential scholarships at the Inns. So the less well off can participate.

It’s also good to have a variety of talents. It’s not good for the profession to have identikit lawyers. DD did MFLs, as did some friends, and other friends of hers have done music, history, classics and no doubt many others. Often having other skills and attributes is useful. Many barristers go into law as a second career. They might be experts in their first one and convert to law. Most talented people find a way and get money via scholarships.

@user760 I always see the advice to oh just do a conversion and think how they are funding it. Unless wealthy parents willing to pay it’s not an easy route. The SQE exam fees alone are £5000. From 2026 there’s no level 7 apprenticeship funding for solicitor postgraduate training. So it’s limited to the small number of firms who will fund eg magic circle and self funding.
I also think there will be a shift with SQE. You don’t need a training contract anymore just 2 years qualifying work experience. Paralegal positions are very in demand as they count as 2 years qualifying work experience. Law graduates can get these roles, none law graduates less likely.

The reality is that now that the system has changed. anyone who is thinking of law should be doing a law degree. There is no benefit whatsoever to having done a non-law degree. There is no advantage gained when looking for a job. Yes if you’ve worked for years in a different field and had a career change then that could give you an advantage (medic doing pi for example) but these situations are few and far between. In general, studying a subject at undergraduate level will not give you any advantage whatsoever. It will just cost you a lot more - particularly if you factor in a year of lost income too.

A law conversion is a bad idea unless you’re wealthy and money isn’t an issue. It’s a lovely extravagance.

Rule of thumb - a law degree is for students who get in at 18 / are new to work & who might not know what they want to do. A conversion course is for people who want to practice law in their current field.

Personally found a law degree invaluable have had a varied career in numerous different areas of law so the concepts I learned in depth during my law degree I still use on a daily basis.

If you are a super brain barrister type who picks things up extremely fast yes a law conversion but that’s definitely not me!