Chemistry Bath v UCL

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My child has an offer for MSci Chemistry for UCL (just plain four year course, dropping to three if not making 60% in Y1 or Y2) and for same for Bath (with year in industry, 4 years either way as year in industry also possible with BSc). Doesn't really want to go to the other three options and would risk clearing if not accepted by those two on results day as chemistry was in clearing at lots of unis last year. Does anyone have any advice or a child on any of those courses which course to firm of those two (we know about costs which are an issue but not putting us off London entirely)?

That sounds very encouraging, my son is a German speaker. Will bear that in mind. Do you target chemistry students or only chemical engineering?

Good point....do you know how good the support is at UCL for getting summer internship?

No

About 9 months.

Why do PPs think UCL is more prestigious or offers better employment prospects? Not sure those beliefs are backed up by the data...

I’d be inclined to go with Bath (but we live within an hour so might be biased). I love London but the placement year would sway me alongside safer place to live.

I think globally UCL is more well known and it's ranked higher.

I think it's seen as "Tier 1".

Interesting. I wonder what league table that is? London universities tend to do better on international rankings because of the city as much as the university itself,. and because international students tend to think (sometimes wrongly) that universities based in england's capital city are de facto better.

Certainly on the British tables, for chemistry, there is nothing between them. In fact, Bath is marginally ahead on the basis of better employment prospects.

None of which is to say that UCL is not a fantastic university. But so is Bath, especially for chemistry.

Bath's star is very much in the ascendant for STEM at the moment. And also think about the issues of studying in central London - the first year is OK (if a bit expensive) but then students scatter to all four corners in a search for affordable accommodation, meaning it can be quite lonely unless your social life revolves around your housemates.

In my experience the difference between a graduate who will get up to speed very quickly in the lab vs one who will still need a lot of handholding. Plus summer placements can be tricky to find as less value for the employer (a year in industry allows enough time to get a decent chunk of work done, 3 months they've barely got on their feet before they are off)

I have some experience of both Unis . I was a student at UCL ( long ago )& then taught there . Loved it but accommodation was pretty nightmarish… My dc loved Bath & found the year in industry really useful . I haven’t yet met a young person who hasn’t really enjoyed Bath . The thing about it not being Russell group isn’t important . It is rated v highly with employers
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The main reason my child wants to go to UCL that he has a few friends also studying at London unis so they may live together from second year. Probably not good enough reason but it's understandable for a 17 year old.

If you want info about a Uni course my top tip is to contact the department itself - often the secretary of the department Head can be brilliant- rather than admissions

Pre screening criteria for hiring at "The Boston Consulting Group". Note it's only from 2017 though. So things might have changed

As someone who has worked in a senior scientific role in the pharmaceutical industry, when hiring we do consider the calibre of the university but I’d always be far more interested in the experience gained in a placement year as this is a far better indicator of how they’ll function in the workplace.

I'm also in a senior scientific role in the pharmaceutical industry. We don't consider the calibre of a University because we find it just reflects the class of the applicant rather than their abilities (having said that we generally find Manchester and Durham graduates are very good). We are very interested in a student's ability to talk about their year in industry though. We used to offer summer placements decades ago but stopped doing them because it wasn't a sufficient amount of time to train them, but we still do year in industry.

Who did you contact in the Chemistry Dept at UCL?
I would go for either departmental manager or EA to Head of department.

Consultancy businesses have different priorities to pharmaceutical companies. They want bullshitters, we want brains.

That's what we did but the UCL chemistry department is totally unresponsive. We went to offer holder day at Bath so know enough about that.

He and I contacted the admissions officer, chased them too. If they are not bothering to give any info, there are plenty if other unis out there...but again I see the reputation of UCL and that's why I am asking

I don’t know much about UCL apart from it does have a good reputation. Just commenting to say I did the MChem Chemistry for Drug Discovery degree with a placement year, followed by a PhD at Bath. I had a really great time. The department was very nurturing and very supportive. However, that was quite a few years ago and the world is a bit different now. Your son will get a decent degree from either university which he will likely be able to do whatever career he puts his mind to.
If I was your son, my top question to answer would be whether I wanted to live in London or in a smaller, quieter place. That will give him his answer. Also, summer placements, work experience etc. are brilliant for getting experience of different careers and he might decide he doesn’t want to work in a lab after all!
For what it’s worth, I now work in a professional services type job.
Congratulations on his offers!

Dd did Pharmacology at Bath, started as MSc with year in industry... but decided she didn't want to do lab work/research after her first year. So she dropped the placement year and got her BSc instead. Pastoral support at Bath is excellent. Accomodation after first year is bloomin expensive.

That's very helpful

They are both excellent universities with great reputations. I would think about the student life your DC wants to have. Bath is a fantastic, safe campus, so easy to make friends in first year, and a beautiful city. It's on the small side but students always say they have a great time. UCL - great if you love London, can afford the lifestyle, don't mind making friends only to find they live an hour away by bus or tube! You can probably tell which way my vote would go but it depends on your DC's priorities. I think increasingly though, a year in industry is a huge advantage.

If it means anything. Cambridge, Oxford, Imperial and UCL are always in the QS Top 10 Global Universities, alongside MIT, Harvard, Stanford and ETH Zurich.

For comparison, I don't think Bath is in the top 100 internationally.

Having said this, for some years, Bath has been in the top 10 U.K. unis on QS or Complete University Guide, ahead of most Russell Group unis.

Industry placement years are a feature at Bath. I don't know how helpful the unis is with this though - eg. a friend's son studying CS couldn't find a placement and was given no help.

Don't forget, they can do summer internships anyway. And are you sure UCL doesn't have an industry placement option they can apply for once students are actually there (because they do for many courses).

I know some unis don't have an official placement year but you can do it just be taking a year out and working

Anecdotally, the 2 students I know who were at UCL both had a miserable time there for all the negative reasons that posters have already mentioned - expense, loneliness, no community feel, lack of support.

The technical support in the labs (this was for immunology) was woefully absent.

In reality just how important is it to go to a university in the top 10 QS rankings? Bath has a fantastic reputation, and a year in industry will make a graduate far more attractive to future employers.

Interestingly, the UK university that is the most targeted by employers is a tier 2 university - Manchester.