Insurance higher grades than firm?

[Grassgarden]

We're nearly at the deadline and DS is really struggling with this.

DS has his heart set on a course with entry requirements BBB.

He is predicted AAB and has applied to some AAB courses but is struggling at the moment.

For his final choice he could put a uni with ABB requirement, but that takes much lower.

If he ended up putting his choices as university 1 firm (BBB) and university 2 insurance (ABB), would university 2 still consider him if he slips grades?

I know it's unpredictable what they do year on year, so my question is about the process really.

BBB sounds quite reasonable for foundation at Sheffield. The AAB does seem a stretch so maybe go for the foundation as first choice?

Thanks all that's what I'm thinking. Sheffield is streets ahead and unlikely to drop it's BBB requirement. (The admissions tutor advised to apply for Beng and Foundation separately)

So we need a lower tariff back up and it's really hard because it's not that common a subject and tbh beyond a certain point I'm not sure how good some of those courses are.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Ideally close to or in London. (I know Sheffield isn't, but DS has his heart set on it)

I can only find Kingston and Middlesex and of those Kingston looks far better.

@Grassgarden Have you considered Loughborough? ABB seems reasonable too. Another decent uni for this which could be a great insurance is UWE at Bristol. Again a decent engineering uni with low tariff entry. Loughborough would be more competitive but looks within reach.

Thanks so much. Would we not hit the original problem, that his firm (BBB) would be higher than his insurance (ABB)?

Sorry! Just read your update. Uwe is definitely lower tariff, and whst about the Uni of Herts BEng at BBB? Maybe do Sheffield x 2, Herts and Uwe? Just because uni ssys BBB, the former polys might have more wriggle room? Essex is also worth a look at BBB-BBC.

Another advantage of the former polys such as UWE is that they tend to offer using points rather than grades. So unless they specify a certain subject must have a certain grade, you have flexibility eg a BBB outcome has the same points as ABC.

Thank you! These are great suggestions. Can I ask about Kingston, just because it is close and he may need support. Is it any good at all?

Is he eligible for contextual offers?

I think their Aerospace Eng has a decent reputation, but not an expert.

Unfortunately not

Yes I'd clocked that, that would be really useful. I actually think a former poly would be a really good fit for DS, even looking at their websites this morning I can see that they really foreground their support offer

Kingston is not much different to any of the others that are ex polys. 128 UCAS points needed so that’s BBB isn’t it? Again there’s wriggle room for ABC I would guess. You need to work out whether a better uni (Sheffield) foundation course trumps all others?It’s then 4 years away from home, not 3. How much does London matter or is being within travelling distance of London ok? Do you envisage he will need your involvement at uni? Is he ok to live away from home @Grassgarden If you think not, evaluate very carefully what’s best. Sheffield is quite a lively uni and students like a good time. So I’d also check out living arrangements if he needs more support.

He will need some support for sure, we have close family in Sheffield, he loves climbing and it's an excellent course, so that's definitely no 1.

It feels late to be looking for back up options but I think I had my head in the same and hadn't considered that he might not get BBB. He was struggling at the time of his summer mocks hence ABC but could easily be struggling in A levels. It's sad because he is very bright, but there it is.

In London would be ideal. I've looked at QMUL which is also BBB for foundation year.

Close to London also ok.

Tariff points

Apologies.

Tariff points offer a lot more flexibility that grade-based offers. A tariff based offer sounds a good idea

Just to echo others - Sheffield excellent for engineering.

And Yy unis like UWE will take UCAS points so ABC = BBB whereas Sheffield may well not accept ABC for the foundation offer if BBB (they might tho).

I would also be wary about the gap year - it’s not advisable for mathsy courses. Would the foundation year not be a way to give breathing space (if that’s what’s needed)? If he is an AAB candidate he would find the F year a gentle intro I think. But also useful. Engineering at uni is pretty full on.

When my children were applying for uni , their guidance teacher advised them to pick 4 courses they wanted and 1 course that they would like to do and definitely had the grades for and that way they had a backup plan if the original plan didn’t go they way they wanted it to.

@clary I would not recommend a gap year either. He could try Sheffield foundation and points ones for other choices.

QMUL isn’t really known for engineering but I don’t know how good it is for robotics. Sheffield is definitely a better shout at BBB but it’s away from home. @Grassgarden Csn you ascertain how flexible QMUL is on grades? The tariff ones for BEng are probably more flexible as others are saying. So not sure QMUL would be better than Kingston in your circumstances.

That's really interesting, DS had been really keen on qmul from early on and I hadn't realised it didn't have a strong reputation. It doesn't look super flexible on grades which is surprising if it isn't that strong

This really isn't my area at all, I have a social science background so I can't tell you how helpful it is

Great advice!!

Uni of Herts is worth a look! Very easy access to London. They have several robotics courses

I would keep in mind that when universities are considering taking people with dropped grades, they are doing this to fill spaces on their courses this year. They may not show the same leniency to someone who has missed the required grades and who is intending to take a gap year as they will not yet know whether and to what extent they need to accept dropped grades to fill their course next year.

Thanks, that's a really good point

@Grassgarden I think there is something useful in having a strong engineering reputation. QMUL isn’t really this. When they want BBB for foundation, and so do Sheffield, Sheffield is the stronger choice. However if being in London is a criteria, then obviously think twice about Sheffield. There are other options you can look at as have been suggested but for BEng, not foundation,

No I know. Sheffield is 100% top choice. For a London back up, which do you think is better between Kingston and QMUL?