Financial support through university

[Plumpretty]

I am a bit confused about university finance and wondered if anyone can clarify. My children will only get the minimum loan when they go to university and I thought we, as parents, would have to make up the difference between minimum and maximum loan. We will just about be able to do this I think. However, on a Facebook group I am on, some people do not make up the difference at all and expect their children to get jobs. Are parents obliged to help or not? Is it a grey area? I am reading quite upsetting comments saying things like it is the student’s uni experience and not up to parents to support them by topping up their loan. But I thought it was?

They are adults and you are not obliged to financially support them. This is why I think it's criminal that parents income is taken into account (and not expenses so you could have two or even three children and uni or very young children still needing childcare).

Of course it's great if parents ts can help but it isn't unreason to expect most students to get a job (I know medicine they can't).

As adults they are making a decision to go to uni and it is their future earnings they are improving, not their patents.

the government can't make parents pay the money, especially as the students are adults. I agree though that it's a bit unfair as some parents just won't help their children.

You said you felt that parents 'refused' to pay. I was explaining that is not always the case.

Surprisingly the published data does not evidence your final point. It has remained remarkably consistent over the past ten years, at around 20% living at home after year 1.

it would be interesting to look at the variability by university, which I admit I have not yet done. All published at www.hesa.ac.uk

but as I say the data shows a perhaps surprising picture as with cost of living challenges an upward shift in that percentage might have been expected. The next data set will be interesting to see once published.

I haven’t read the whole thread but to my mind, the YP is penalised by how much the parents earn if over the minimum threshold. For this reason for me, if the parents can afford it, then it’s up to them to make up the difference.

No, it isn’t right but you would be surprised how many parents are either uninformed or couldn’t care less and YP end up dropping out, failing course, or doing goodness only knows what to scrape by.

OP check out Martin Lewis or look up parental contributions. We have two years overlapping with two at Uni and we are topping both up to max loan and they both work over summer.

The loan system is flawed as it takes into account income but not expenditure.

It's why my daughter accepted Liverpool, not Brighton and why my sons friend applied to Sheffield, not Brighton.

Halls of residence vary hugely in cost. We went to the Bangor open day and the cheapest accommodation there was I think £99 a week for a decent sized room with a basin. Not sure how it compares to others because week let seems to vary between all the Unis/halls of residences. House rentals also seemed very cheap.

Plum even in the 1980s when I went it was not a "grey" area. The parent is morally obliged to make it up but not then nor now obliged legally to make it up to the maximum. My parents did for me and I have funded my children without any loans at all so they were in the same position as I was - which is going above and beyond and I am lucky to be able to afford it. Most parents will make minimum up to maximum but it is not grey, it is not unclear. They are 100% allowed to say no if they want.

In some cases it can be based on student's income. However many work part time and during vacations to supplement the loan. The loan is weighted for London but not other expensive cities,

And for those on lower incomes there are also bursaries and scholarships available at many institutions,

I do the "pay rent and live on loan" thing with DD - she handily chose one of the cheapest unis in the country (Aberystwyth) and rather sweetly said she would opt for the cheaper option in the Halls as she felt guilty about making me pay for the most expensive!

I'm happy to pay this (lucky enough to be able to afford it plus she's an only) - the only thing I'm not sure of getting right is balancing this with not encouraging her to be too irresponsible! I told her I wouldn't nag her to get a part time job in term time but would definitely be seriously nagging about summer jobs. She agreed that this was fair so we will see.

It really is worth looking carefully at Welsh universities - although English students don't benefit from the Welsh loans/grants system they do qualify for the Welsh government's third off bus travel scheme and all (except Swansea for some reason) offer some cheap accommodation options.

Some can't afford to top up. I also assume some refuse to even though they can.

If you did it on expenditure you could have a family on £100K who lives beyond their means receive more assistance than a family on £50K who lives frugally. Which would not be fair. There's an argument that £60K household income is merely two people on below average salaries and the min and max household incomes should be increased to actually reflect incomes that can afford to support their kids, but there will still be people who choose to live in expensive areas and have high expenditure who will find it harder than those who have planned ahead and live well within their means.

Realistically the max £5-7Kpa parents are currently expected to top up the maintenance payment by will be less than the amount those same parents will have spent on childcare when their university bound child was a preschooler. So if they could afford the cost of young children they can afford the cost of older children. Some just choose not to.

My ds worked in his gap year and will work holidays. We will pay rent but we do feel it financially. Youngest likely to start university as soon as eldest leaves.
I think the resident parent responsibility can be unfair. I have friends who are divorced where resident parent is lower earner and so loan based on them. Their offspring do very well as ex partners do top up and earn well. I believe unfair as we struggle. My Mum offered to let my dh live with them and us split up! Only half joking!

We top up to cover accommodation, buy 60% of clothes, pay for phone and gym and send the occasional food parcel. DS cashed in trust fund and savings and works in the holidays. Just about ok.

My friend has twins. One is at Newcastle and living quite well on her minimum loan topped up to the maximum loan by her parents. Her rent is under £5000 in halls including bills (not catered). She walks as she lives on campus so no transport costs either. The university is in the city centre.

The other one got a place in London and has deferred for a year and is working because London is so much more expensive.

Her accommodation costs are going to be more than the other twin's entire loan and top up.

One of the reasons that people say 4 kids are expensive is 4 lots of university support, surely you were expecting that it would cost you more than most? It's up to you what you do and how much you support them. That decision may or may impact on their success at uni.

@HPFA sorry for the hijack but how is your dd finding Aberystwyth?

Mine is looking at it and we went at the weekend and she really liked it but is worried about the small town (no H&M). She wanted to find out about athletics as that's her hobby and there's a track of sorts but she couldn't find anything out about that.

Two DC I can cover.

A combination of CTF supporting their first year (small monthly savings since they were born adds up)

Their own savings from part time jobs since they were 16. Has this impacted their studies? Possibly. Has it given them confidence and an understanding of how badly retail workers are treated? Definitely. Do they have jobs to return to in holidays? Yes.

Savings I will make on food, travel etc when I have one or two less children at home. I eat a lot less and simpler without the kids, I turn the heating on less, use less hot water etc.

Supporting four DC through uni would drown me. Their individual CTFs would be smaller (or non-existent), I would have spent more time out of the workforce and earning less income, they probably would have had to use more of their part time wages for day-to-day expenditures, if one DC was at uni, I'd still have 3 at home using utilities and eating food, etc.

But (aside from multiple births) the number of DC you have is a choice and it's pretty obvious that the more you have the more the cost.

I hope people with young DC are reading these types of threads and beginning Uni savings early, and also considering the cost of uni when deciding whether to have the third or fourth child.

It's very expensive, the system for support isn't the fairest, though it's hard to think of one which would be fair to all, and the financial side takes approximately two decades to prepare for 🤷‍♀️

One of the factors of choosing a uni is cost of living. My dd gets £4,700 loan and her accommodation costs £7,000. She keeps the loan to live on and we pay the accommodation. Quite a few of her friends have opted for local unis, so they don't have accommodation expenses.
A term time job for my dd is unrealistic, as her lecturers are every weekday and don't end until 6pm. Weekends she is studying, living and occasionally visiting us, so her job is on a holiday time contract, but we do give her additional pocket money.
I reckon she costs us about £12k a year in all (allowance, car insurance, phone contract) , but we did save hard.
I agree with @buttonsB4 , cutting your cloth includes working out how many children you can afford to potentially put through uni when you start your family.

@RitzyMcFee messaged you, although since I'm tech illiterate I cut myself off short :-)

She seems to be enjoying it at the moment - it can be a little difficult with DD as she's rather averse to expressing great enthusiasm about anything! But she's made friends, her accommodation in Pentre Jane Morgan is really nice for the very cheap price and she's trying out lots of activities.

She's doing French and InterPol - has five classes per week for the French and two seminars for the Interpol so it feels pretty busy. The French is supposed to be from beginner level but they seem very keen to get them up to speed! I'm sure the workload isn't at Oxbridge levels but I don't feel like the students will be allowed to just drift along.

It must be one of the cheapest unis to live - the Welsh government also lets you have one third off bus travel.

She's actually thinking about joining the running club as apparently she's enjoying running on the treadmill at the gym.

We're visiting her next week so if you don't mind waiting I can update after that - I'll get a much better impression from seeing her than I do from What's Apping!

The oft repeated "they are adults" and therefore shouldn't be reliant on parents, is ridiculous. Parents are parents forever. Throughout your childs life, you have expenses for them. Then you have uni, then you have house deposits, weddings, help with grandchildren. Many kids boomerang back at certain times, do you not support them then?

The difference with a child is I am responsible for the decision making.

With university, if we are sticking with a parent child relationship I would send him to our local university as its good enough, he doesn't need to pay accommodation and he can keep his very good Saturday job.

If I am paying for his wedding. He can have a registry office, tent in the garden and a bbq, as I think the rest is a total con.

With house deposits, I think he should live near me in the two bed terrace, not over there in the one bed flat.

If I am no longer the decision maker it seems unfair I just have to pay up whatever.

I fully intend to support my son in lots of ways but it's not the same once they make the choices.