College or sixth form

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How do you decide which is best for your child's future? I never went into higher education and really want to support my DS.

He is currently at a grammar school and doing well but he is thinking about not going to the sixth form (He loves the school but I think he just wants to follow his friend). and going to college instead, he is planning on studying the same subjects.

It's really hard to know if there is a difference in the courses ( Computer science / maths etc) and whether there is more benefit to going to one over the other.

I like the sixth form as its alot smaller and I feel as a grammar school they focus on getting the grades, they also have enrichment activities but the college is more modern.

I have looked at the results and for level 3, only 52% go on to university from the college vs 87% from the sixth form.

Any advice on where you get your qualification from or the negatives/ pros would be much appreciated.

If he is planning on doing a levels at both then the courses will be the same.

A college will have many fewer people going from level 3 qualifications to uni as they will offer a whole range of bro 3 qualifications - a levels, BTECs, etc not all of which naturally lead in to uni.

A grammar school will generally only offer a levels which do usually lead on to uni,

Colleges are more of a halfway house to uni - they are much bigger and more impersonal. The students have more freedom.

The teaching quality can vary so it is worth asking around about the reputation of the college.

We were in exactly the same situation last year. My DS wanted to go to college with his friends rather than stay in sixth form.

It was decided for us when the college cancelled the local bus and I couldn't get him there, so he has stayed at school. He seems to have settled down and is happy, the class sizes are smaller and last year 100% went on to higher education.

DS is not sure yet whether he wants to do a degree so we'll see what happens but he'll definitely get better grades.

The 52% was for students who took level 3 A levels and not as a whole ( t levels etc)

Thanks @Meadowfinch glad things have worked out. I'm hoping he sees my reasoning and makes the choice naturally but hoping others know any other pros/cons to each.

Sixth form at his grammar. Definitely

If your son wants to go to university, 6th form at his grammar will put him in a better position. If he isn’t that fussed about higher education or may not be going to university, then college.

Less structure/more freedom at college - my preference would be for 6th form for this very reason - not everyone has self motivation at that age.

Yes, he very much wants to go to university to study computer science. Thank you.

I wouldn’t presume to weigh in on the decision, OP. However given that DS is highly motivated to study CS I would suggest that he research the standards and the competition. The good CS degree programmes have become very competitive indeed.

You can read old threads on this board concerning top students who didn’t get any offers from the top programmes, even though they had the PGs. I suggest DS join The Student Room, an online forum for undergraduates, where he can read about admissions experiences and ask questions.

The truth is that a bright YP who makes the most of their opportunities at any good School of CS should land on their feet. However, most have dreams. DS might benefit from learning about the experiences of others and thinking about which pathway is more likely to lead towards his dreams. Best wishes to him

Thank you, very good advice. He was having a wobble about CS as he doesn't feel he's good enough - though his CS teacher says otherwise and predicted a 9.

Thanks all for your opinions so far.

6th form at grammar if he wants to go to uni.

DGD is at a 6th form college. It is outstanding and oversubscribed. Quite a lot of students come from private education. Surely much depends on the specific school/college?

I want to respect his privacy, but it is fairly unusual, and therefore interesting, that someone predicted straight 9s worry whether he is good enough.

CS degree programmes exist on a spectrum. Only at the very top is the competition brutal. It is early days, but it sounds like DS will be at a level to have excellent chances of admission to some wonderful programmes. Is DS worried about whether he is good enough for certain universities, or good enough for the discipline?

Writing as a former (Russell Group) STEM admissions tutor, I would really hate to see someone so talented worry about the latter. If this is the case perhaps there is a teacher he could talk with?

In the former case, he should know that the brutal competition is really at the very top. Someone with his abilities who works hard and applies sensibly has a high likelihood of admission to an excellent CS programme

PS Apology for the repetition, msg written on a wild train journey

Just think it's a self confidence issue - when he has got the highest score in the class for some exams, he will say he still could do better. Teachers are always complimentary about his politeness / work ethic but do say he's quiet. I think he's always been introverted - another reason why I think 6th form is the better option as its more family like.

Also his CS has just made him an ambassador for the subject, so i hope that reinforces to him that he's doing a good job.

No, I appreciate the comments. Hope the train ride wasn't too wild haha!

Advice given to us by a friend who was deputy head of a well regarded academic school, was to think carefully before moving. If you move, teachers only effectively have three terms toget to know you. Less if a student takes a while to find their feet and become noticed. Whereas the complimentary teachers you mention will have no problem writing a detailed a nd enthusiastic recommendation. It all helps when applying for a competitive course. He too loses no time adapting and can remain focussed on his academic and extracurricular engagement.

@Needmoresleep excellent point, thank you. I didn't think of that, will add it to my list of pros.

Round here it is all colleges, no school 6th forms.

Colleges treat you as more grown up, more freedoms (eg only have to be present for actual lessons), better stepping stone to independence at uni.
Grammar may well have higher entry requirements (and hence better results and more going on to uni).
Maths & Computing is only going to have pretty motivated students either way, they aren't known as doss subjects.
Look at both, apply to both, but I think at 16 it has to be your DS's decision.

I would go to open days at both and get all the information, but let your DS make his own decision.

My DD has just started at college and is absolutely loving it- she is so much more independent and self motivated than she ever was at school. She has made new friends and is brimming with confidence. At college you are treated much more like an adult, it seems like a halfway house to university. Her friends who stayed at sixth form say it’s basically the same people as before but in much smaller classes and they are a bit bored.

DS chose the local sixth form as he could walk there and it had a great reputation.

We're lucky in that both the sixth form and the local college have excellent reputations so for DS it was a case of which was easier, a 15 minute walk home or up to an hour sat in a bus twice a day.

As well as the earlier point about school references, being established in a school gives you a better chance of being considered for leadership positions such as prefect or sports captain.

DD did move, but to a school her DB had attended and one which cut her commute from 40 minutes to 10 minutes and where she settled quickly. Not all new starters did. Equally others who had been determined to move at 16, believing that they had outgrown their school, or wanting to follow mates, ended up being pleased they stayed. Sixth form in most schools is different. There will be new people and you find that you get to know those studying the same subject better. The relationship with teachers changes and the content of the A level syllabus is usually far more interesting.

There is a thread running in, I think, Further Education, re how kids staying for 6th form in some schools are being treated. e.g. detention for not having the set book that isn't even being started until after half term!!

Page 5 | Year 12 - 2024/25 - Support, Discussion and Looking After Each Other | Mumsnet

This is the bit of the thread.

It depends on the two settings and the preference of the child. I have two DC - one stayed at school sixth form in our town and the other went to a huge FE college in nearby city.

Both good decisions as DS wanted familiarity and more structure, DD wanted new experiences and more independence. DD at college did better at A level but DS at school also did fine.

Comparing the two:

• school sixth form 'easier' in that everything is familiar, lower stress is helpful in these two v important years
• college perhaps more interesting with lots of new experiences, DD still saw a lot of her friends from school so best of both worlds for her
• college definitely fostered more independence and skills of independent learning compared to school
• college much bigger and more diverse, a pro for DD but a con for DS
• colleges have specialist A level teachers, for what that's worth
• college definitely requires more self motivation, it's not for everyone
• this college was much more demanding academically, DD did 4 x A levels and only escaped an EPQ because she was busy with Oxbridge entry
• college has fewer rules, no uniform etc, and no younger kids around, it's a much more adult environment which again may or may not suit a DC
• I'd say college is a good halfway house for DC who are planning on going to uni, but not everyone is ready for that at 16

It's really horses for courses.

I'd always say college. It prepares you better for the next stage whether that is work or uni or a gap year.

No one will chase you for homework. No detentions. No uniform (mostly).

My guess is that the DS already has pretty good internal work habits, though it is no more than that.

Is he more intellectually inclined than his mates? That can be a tricky path to navigate.

Insofar as he doesn’t always get perfect marks, this is the perfect time to learn a constructive attitude towards doing his best. If he wants to aim for a strong CS programme, and I very much hope he does, he needs to develop a more robust stance towards assessments.

At university, the work is much harder and 70% is the cutoff for First Class marks. 85% is a very strong mark in my STEM School, and that still leaves a lot of room for improvement. At a higher level, the discipline of CS is full of open questions that great minds have been grappling with for decades. Everyone needs to be comfortable with imperfection. DS sounds modest, but I would ask him why he should be any different, and tell him that he will learn most effectively if he can relax and learn from his mistakes. (Also, that no one makes more mistakes than researchers in pursuit of a breakthrough, and no one is more relaxed about it).

Of course one does need a certain level of ability and it is assessed one step at a time, but all signs so far are positive to say the least. Oxbridge and Imperial are a crap shoot even for the best; I would refer him to The Student Room on this. (But remember to take negative experiences with a grain of salt as there may be bias in the retelling) Warwick CS is having problems with student satisfaction now; again, TSR.

Beyond this there are 10 excellent schools of CS and another 15 very good ones where DS can get what he needs to launch a great career (including preparation for PG study).

I really hope he can relax and do his best.