Daughter about to start Uni, having a wobble and thinking she should have gone to a higher Ranked Russell Group Uni!

[WhatsTheStoryRory]

My daughter did her A levels in the summer and got all A*s in 4 STEM subjects.
She accepted an offer to study a STEM subject in a non Russell group uni because that's the one she liked the best when we visited.
The Uni she liked is very well rated and is a couple of hours drive from the city we live in.
She's gone through the whole process of applying for Student loan and choosing accomodation.

She's now having a wobble and thinking she should have accepted an offer she had from a Russell Group Uni in the city we live in.
The main reason seems to be, that she thinks future employers will give preference to those who went to higher ranked Uni's.

She's even mentioned taking a year out and re-applying for next year.
We've said we'll support her whatever she decides.

Is it even possible to change Uni's at this late stage?

Bath is a top class uni. Russell group is just a self selected group based on research at the uni...Bath students are pretty much all A/A* students!

Is it bad that I went to Bath and assumed it was RG?!

it’s a fantastic university with a stellar reputation for STEM. The sandwich year, if that’s what she’s chosen, is a real benefit. All of people I’m still in touch with are doing very well in life and I think spending a year in industry really helped us get ahead post graduation.

I knew when you posted that it would be somewhere like Bath or Loughborough. People still can get hung up on RG despite the fact there are pitfalls of focusing excessively on RG as the main criteria for university study when being part of this group only really testifies to research. These days, other factors such as graduate prospects and student satisfaction are now very important in determining rankings, and besides in the Complete University Guide league table there are three universities which aren't part of the group in the top 10 - four if you count Lancaster as joint 10th.

Bath is excellent - it's 6th overall in the UK for graduate prospects (higher than Durham, Bristol and Edinburgh), while its research quality is also excellent and again higher than a number of universities whose selling point in being part of RG is their research!

Have you sat down with DD and talked her through this kind of information?

The main reason seems to be, that she thinks future employers will give preference to those who went to higher ranked Uni's.

@WhatsTheStoryRory Bath is ranked at number 8 in the Complete University Guide, and has been a top 10 university for years. It is more highly ranked than 16 Russel Group Universities and is very competitive to get into.

Your daughter has been sold the idea by her school that RG universities are better than non RG universities. This is simply not true. Bath, Loughborough, Lancaster and St Andrews are consistently in the top 10 in the CUG and are not RG.

I mean it kindly, but your daughter needs to give her head a wobble.

Russel Group holds a lot more weight that non Russell group. Whilst yes you can be successful in life even without a degree, employers absolutely do pay attention to things like this

Pease ignore this ^^ outdated "advice"

Most emplyers don't care @LadyGabriella . They are more interested in degree classification and often recruit blind these days. I believe that stuffy law firms still believe in RG universities producing the best employees, but other employers are more open minded and realistic.

Bristol is ranked 16th in the CUG BTW.

Bath is ranked way higher than Bristol!

Science at LSE?

And Bath is certainly equivalent to your other non-Oxbridge suggestions avoid Durham

Bath is an excellent uni; highly ranked and very well regarded. It’s as good as, if not better than, lots of RG unis. It’s a very popular choice and has an excellent reputation for STEM - your dd has nothing to worry about if she were to go there.

The only reason to give up her place at Bath would be if she wanted to take a gap year and reapply to Oxbridge - with grades in hand probably has a better chance of getting in (along with having already been through the interview process once before)

I work in this field and if it is just about the academics (ie she has no personal reasons for the change of heart) she should go to Bath. If she wants to have a shot at Oxbridge she can reapply once at Bath (but she needs to act quick as the registration deadlines are soon). But there are few other places better than Bath for STEM.

No. Some of these universities do not look favourably on gap years for certain subjects due to lack of practice affecting competence. They would also expect a personal statement to cover motivation for applying in a gap year and what the applicant was doing in it. A year off with no real plans or motivation for taking one is unlikely to be sold well in a personal statement.

Not bad at all - Russell Group is pretty meaningless to an undergrad.

An awful lot of grad recruitment is now indeed institution blind but Bath has great industry links as mentioned already so that is a huge advantage. And if it reassures anyone, I have been involved in grad scheme recruitment in both private and public sector and doubt many of the people in the process (including myself) could categorically tell you which unis are RG. Certainly Bath has a great reputation.

I wonder if this is the issue? Bath is a brilliant university, out ranks most of the Russell Group unis (it’s in the top 10, so fi you take ox ford and Cambridge out, it is better than 10 of the RG unis). Employers tend to do blind selection now - ie those interviewing outside HR do not know which uni you attended, only A Level and degree grade.

Ie, the university is not the issue - but maybe DD is having a wobble about leaving home (several of my friend’s kids are having the same wobble this week. It’s pretty normal.)

When people talk about Russrll group Vs non-Russel group they are not talking about St Andrews, Bath and Lancaster.

Fgs ignore anyone wittering about law or medicine

The main reason seems to be, that she thinks future employers will give preference to those who went to higher ranked Uni's.

In STEM if it's engineering Bath is great, if it's sciences then while I don't know the rankings for the different field, afaik bath is absolutely fine and high fliers are likely to do PhDs and then it's more about what research you do.

(Anecdotes about Law, and hiring practices in non stem fields are pretty irrelevant)

DC about to start Y2 at Bath. STEM subject with 4 A Stars at A level.

Turns out her whole Y1 house had more or less the same results, and all were Oxbridge 'rejects' i.e. interviewed and pooled but not picked out of the pool - so not a bad bunch!

They all resoundingly agreed that going to Bath was the best decision they'd made (mixture of Maths, Comp Science, Architecture, Mech Engineering and various STEM courses).

All are having a ball, involved in the sport to varying levels, love the uni and the city, did extremely well in Y1 exams and are starting to apply for their Y3 placements now.

Bath is a great university. A lot of the time I think terms like Russell Group or Red Brick are just used by people to mean 'very well regarded university' which Bath is. As PP have said, RG membership is based on academic research and realistically that isn't going to hugely impact the quality of your DD's experience or degree.

It's also one of the universities with the highest grad employment rates in the country - I don't know what degree your DD is doing but a very large proportion - particularly in technical STEM type subjects - offer placements in industry etc. I also don't know what your home city Russell Group uni is but I'd pick Bath over quite a lot of those for many subjects, particularly STEM.

I have friends who went to Bath while I went to Bristol (which is RG) and while it was some time ago now I don't think there was any discernable difference in our experiences - and we were all employed in great jobs or in further education upon graduation! If anything I felt like the actual teaching sounded better at Bath - not STEM but I had four contact hours per WEEK in my last year at Bristol and two of those were just sitting in a lecture hall watching the lecturer run through a PowerPoint!

Also Bath is a lovely place with loads to do, and Bristol is close for gigs and slightlier 'grittier' nights out if she wants (lived there for a few years as a kid and my siblings were mid teens to early 20s).

Employers are desperate for people with STEM degrees, especially women.
It’s still a very good uni and she’s really overthinking this.
I know a lot of people stay at home to go to uni, but I think moving away can give a young person so much more confidence in themselves and their capabilities beyond just the academic side of university life.
Perhaps this is actually more about the fear of the unknown than doubts about the uni itself.

Maybe 30 years ago 🤔

This is total rubbish. My husband has just been through the process and hasn't even had to say where he did his degree!

I would stick with Bath as it's very well regarded, on par with Russell Group.
I think it's a mistake going to university in your own town, especially if it's London. The experience is really not the same.

Also here to confirm that judge story is absolute bollocks.

Bath is great OP. Very much seen as a high quality academic institution at the moment.

It’s Bath!!
Where was her RG option?
Bath is ranked higher than so many RGs. DD’s first choice was Bath but didn’t get the grades so took 2nd choice (RG). Bath is definitely a top choice. Hope she has a fab time!

I'm a PhD student and it's well known that Bath is well-regarded academically. Its also a lovely city in which to study. It's likely that there are just a few nerves given that she's about to start, it's normal to feel a bit homesick given that it's a huge life change. I would focus on the positives with her and offer reassurance.

It’s perfectly ok for her to want to take to reassess her decision. She’s got to be comfortable with her choice.

This

I work in recruitment. We don't let
Hiring Managers see which university applicants went to. This gives all candidates a fair chance to be shortlisted for interview. Lots of other industries do the same. The days of 'jobs for the boys' are seriously numbered.

She should stick with her first choice. She loved it when she visited. She's probably just got cold feet due to nerves.