Is work experience ever a disadvantage?

[kriminal]

DS (year 12) wants to study civil engineering. He is in line for high grades in his A levels (maths, further maths, physics) and will apply to Cambridge, Imperial and some others to be confirmed. In the meantime, he has some in-person work experience lined up with a civil engineering company. He was very lucky to get that. However, a school friend was dismissive of it, saying its not what universities are looking for. I think what he meant was that it's not necessary - that other experiences such as reading books, watching videos etc are sufficient, but my DS has taken his friend literally and is saying he won't mention it on his personal statement for uni. That's nonsense, isn't it?

Yes, nonsense. It’s exactly the type of experience that will mean he stands out from other applicants.

Yes, total bollocks. He should include it - it's good evidence of how interested he is in his subject. Good for him! And it will stand him in very good stead after uni too, and may mean he can get summer intern roles in civil engineering firms during his studies. Well done your DS.

all work experience is good on a UCAS form and relevant work experience is great, especially if the applicant can say what they learnt.

I used to read the forms and even be pleased if an applicant said they'd worked at Tesco - it shows they are responsible & organized and can get to a shift on time & follow a manager's directions. Same with a proper week of work experience, which is much more meaningful than reading a book.

As someone who recruits (although not in engineering) work experience is always beneficial. Well done your ds.

Yes, total bollocks.
Any experience of any job is better than none.

Yeah, please do not listen to that bullshit. Friend sound jealous if anything!

Not only will it help with a personal statement, but it will also help with future placement roles and postgraduate opportunities!

It’s bloody nonsense, both DH and I have been involved with admitting students in two different universities. Work experience and actual paid work are very helpful. He had a lad once who had worked as a trolley pusher at the weekend in sixth form, not related to the science subject of DH dept at all. But it showed he had worked and studied science and maths A levels all at the same time and thats grit and determination.

By the time our DS applied for his degree apprenticeship he had worked three jobs by age 20 plus had done two really decent work experience placements.

Work experience in the area is fantastic for the universities you mention, and definitely to be included but only in as much as how much he learned and how much it inspired him - they don't want a list, they want to know what he got out if it.

I think universities are very aware that work exp usually requires a student having professional contacts, and are careful not to discriminate against those from backgrounds where the parents don't.
That is not a reason not to put it on the PS

The issue with work experience is it is now more understood that 'who you know' can play a big part in securing the opportunities, so universities are starting to look past them.

However it can still go on the form as a useful part of 'why I know this is the course for me'.

Did he get the placement through a family contact? If not, then how he secured the work experience could be a useful example of his initiative.

DC1 10 years ago got the work experience job easily through his school. DC2 can't find any if not paying agency last year. Sure, there a place to fill in the work exp in the UCAS. It's no longer that important now as I understand that a few I know got offer from Oxbridge without work exp. The performance in the aptitude exam and interview play more important role maybe.

No, he applied online. It's seems to be one of the few big companies that has a programme for in-person work experience for his age group, so he was lucky to spot it (and get it). Most seem to aim their early careers programme at undergraduates, or else only provide online experiences to school students.

"The issue with work experience is it is now more understood that 'who you know' can play a big part in securing the opportunities, so universities are starting to look past them."

I think this is what the friend was trying to convey, but the message somehow got muddled. (Unfortunately this friend is regarded as more of an expert than me). 🙂

All the key points have been covered above. It strikes me that this presents a really useful opportunity for you to coach your DS on what critical evaluation looks like in practice. Rather than just take his friend's word for it, encourage him to 'go to the source' and google what the likes of Cambridge and Imperial say on the matter and then interpret what that means in his specific situation. Even if you check out the info first, walk him through the process; that way something useful is gained from DS's friend's distracting misinterpretation.

@parietal "I used to read the forms and even be pleased if an applicant said they'd worked at Tesco - it shows they are responsible & organized and can get to a shift on time & follow a manager's directions"

It also means they live somewhere where they can get themselves to the Tesco or have parents who can take them, they don't have caring responsibilities, and there are actually jobs for teenagers available.Discrimination takes many forms.

His friend is jealous.

Are there really places where teenagers really can't find jobs? A lot of dd's friends live quite rurally, but most of them got jobs in local corner shops, village pubs etc. Some walked or cycled to the next village, got a bus to the nearest town etc. The ones who "couldn't find a job" were generally the ones who didn't try that hard.

Of course, if a kid has caring responsibilities, that's different, but this could also be reflected in the personal statement and/or the teacher reference.

If DC want to earn some pocket money, they can always find some work to do. My DC1 did the paper rounding for it. It was not mentioned at all as DC applied theoretical physics course.

I'm amazed at how many Mumsnetters appear to live in the 1950s....

@kriminal My DH is CEng FICE FIStructE FCIHT and until recently owned an Engineering Consultancy. They regularly go to careers events at local schools and young people come for taster sessions with them. I don’t know where you live, but just looking up consultancies in your area might also elicit work experience. DH’s company does a lot of environmental engineering, plus they are structural engineers too. Young people are unlikely to understand the difference between consultancies and design and build contractors so it’s always worth looking for consultants in your area. They will exist and hopefully they will be helpful.

As others have (mostly) said, work experience is beneficial.so say what he learnt on his PS. Work experience in uni vacations even more so. It can enhance interests and definitely brings the real world of engineering and problem solving into focus. Civil Engineers often have to decide between whether they want to work for giant companies or do much more varied work with smaller consultancies.

Just a small comment about universities. Cambridge is not a particularly great choice for civil engineering. Universities such as Sheffield or Bristol are better in many ways and no grad from those unis cannot compete with a Cambridge grad. Our first class engineering departments have great depth in the courses they offer. Oxbridge engineering grads often go into non engineering jobs too. Imperial is a matter of taste in many ways. Clearly world class but for Civils, others are great choices too. We have fantastic engineering departments in the UK.

Of course it’s beneficial and he should definitely mention it. Will help once he graduates too. He should keep working in the holidays / whilst at uni as well. I recruit a lot and strongly favour graduates who have worked since their teens.

He needs to be clear in his statement that he proactively sought out the experience, applied via the normal process, and didn’t use family connections. Then it’s a positive.

Agree with others that it's an advantage and your son should mention it.

Only time I can think would be a disadvantage would be in firms like my DHs where they get quality points (for bidding on government contracts) for offering work experience so take kids on but don't have time to spend with them. I dread to think the numbers my DH has put off a career.

Many smaller consultancies like to see enthusiastic young people. Many contracts have hoops to go through, but it doesn’t mean the young person doesn’t get a decent experience. It’s very difficult to give real knowledge to a 16/17 year old but just learning about design from start to finish is worthwhile and an explanation of problems solved.

My background is in careers and employability support. I also used to work in a college, delivering careers education and helping with UCAS statements. Work experience is incredibly valuable and even if not related to the subject, just the fact that the student has other strings to their bow, is developing soft / employability skills and confidence, has a work ethic beyond the books, can all be valuable. Never underestimate work experience for references in the future, contacts for university placements, or finding part-time work whilst at university. I once worked for an employer that interviewed every graduate that applied for a role, who had worked in a fast food establishment for at least 6 months. He said he'd done that as a student and believed these graduates were always worth interviewing. His view, but he did employ some great candidates!