A level choice advice

[ProfessorLayton1]

Dd 2 is choosing A level subjects and she does not know what she wants to do.
She is thinking of doing law or history in university.
She is one of the youngest in her class and I think it is so much of pressure to decide regarding these things so young. These are the combinations she is considering.

History, Politics, Maths and biology
Or
History, English, Maths and Economics

Do you need two essay subjects to do law? As far as I have seen in the university admission requirements this is not the case but that doesn't mean that she won't be disadvantaged if she takes only one easy subject.

Well she has two essay subjects in both those combos.

Does her school insist on four A levels? Can she drop one? There is no benefit to doing four (except maybe FM).

Both of those combos open a lot of doors - maths and biology would enable a science degree as well as history or law.

Which subject would she most likely drop?

Look at uni websites but AFAIK (and there are plenty on MN who know more about law degrees than I do) most subject combos will work. Certainly history is a good start.

Has she any thoughts about what uni - or even what kind of uni?

You don’t actually need any particular subjects to do law, but an essay subject certainly does help. 2 isn’t necessary and is a huge amount of work.

DD did A level politics and really enjoyed it. As long as you have a solid set of arguments and counter-arguments prepared (which any good teacher will give) it’s not a particularly hard subject to do well in

Any of DD’s friends who did English literature really regretted it. A huge amount of work and reading + a massive jump from GCSE level. The high flyers at GCSE really struggled at A level!

Watch out for coursework. My son only had to do History and that was painful enough, but one of his poor friends had three!

She is going to start with 4 subjects and drop one she does not enjoy.

Her sister is in London and she wants to go to uni in London.

I have looked at few MN threads and understand that it is difficult to get into a really good university for Law. Law conversion is another option she can look into. Getting pupillage ( work experience) is really really difficult.

DC cousin did 3 science A-levels & got into Durham Uni for law. But that's not a "really good Uni" I guess.

A level selection is about balancing and weighing up several factors at once. Yes, subject mix is one and is essentially about understanding whether certain doors are closed and whether that matters. For example, biology would keep some science doors open but does that matter to your DC?

Another factor is likely performance. How well is your DC doing in those subjects in the run up to GCSE? A levels are a material jump up. For example, is Maths in the mix because your DC enjoys it and has an aptitude for it? The strongest possible grades keep doors open just as much as trying to finesse the subject mix.

Finally, it is worth investigating what each A level course will actually involve. Economics and Politics will be new subjects; look online at the syllabus and past exam papers to make sure what your DC thinks they are is the reality. History and English often include an NEA component; how does your DC feel about? What period of history will be covered at your DC's school? The detail can make a difference.

I know that it is a massive jump from GCSE and A levels. She is good academically and has already finished her maths paper a year early and had A star. Biology - she enjoys it. History is her favourite subject and does well in it. Really don't know how she will enjoy or perform in Government and politics / economics.

Any A levels are fine for law. In fact, with the drop off in popularity of MFL and English , the 'traditional' law combo is becoming a thing of the past.

Most people would recommend an essay subject but otherwise, anything goes.

When I talk to students who have chosen a law degree they are often surprised by how dry it is. Perhaps the drier rote learning type A levels are better prep for this rather than the more creative or imaginative ones but I really think it doesn't matter. You'd be hard pushed now to find a university asking for certain A levels for law (they might exclude a few qualification types but I don't think your DD's choices get anywhere near that issue).

The 'very best' unis will simply be looking for very high results (and results from the entrance exams, where applicable).

History, maths and biology plus one of the other 3 makes the most sense, keeps doors open

One essay subject is absolutely fine. I’d choose the ones she enjoys most and does best in. Realistically it’s about securing top grade predictions to be applying for top universities for law.

My daughter was going to do biology because she enjoyed it too. It she's glad now she didn't after seeing the bio students - she is happy she did History and Psychology and Art. All heavy workload (she found Psychology by far the easiest but that's just her).
I think either is great combo. I'd lean to Politics rather than English but that's personal. Last year the History and English A levels were on top of each other!

Having read the A level specifications and the workload for English and history A levels, think politics is a better option.

I understand that she has to do what she enjoys the most, but felt Biology is an outlier as she does not want to do any science based degree in university.

So, History, Politics, Maths and Economics - drop Economics if she doesn't enjoy the subject .

I would also look at past resultss and teacher rep if the is really neutral between her choices. I know on my son’s school History, Politics and Chemistry are all taught brilliantly, English it very much depends on the teacher and Economics have had problems with teacher rentention.

Does she want to become a barrister? Pupilage is only relevant to barristers. I'm a solicitor and there are now many routes into the profession without the need for the traditional training contract (pupilage equivalent for solicitors). The SQE or ILEX routes have made it easier to qualify.

As an English teacher , I feel I can say that I don't think the workload for Eng Lit is very onerous. I teach 3 A levels and English is the least workload heavy.

Is she into politics and confident speaking up? My dd loves politics A level but the class is small as lots dropped it as not what they thought and those left are definitely into politics with post intending to study something political or related at University.

Is she absolutely certain that she doesn’t want to do a science based degree? DD went in to A levels set on doing a politics degree, now we’ve got a Physiotherapy applicant! She’s very glad that she kept biology on, despite it not ‘fitting’ with her other subjects as it’s kept far more doors open for her

This is my concern, I have a medic who told all along that she would never do medicine!
Seems to enjoy her career choice now.
They are so young in deciding these things.

You've answered it yourself here. She enjoys Biology, is good at Maths and History is her favourite. These should be her 3 core choices and will keep almost every option open (even medicine in some unis).

Does she absolutely have to choose a fourth? There's little benefit when it comes to uni admissions.

Are you in Wales OP or why did she get a letter grade for maths? Also having done it early, has she continued with maths in the interim- I would think this would be important for maths A level.

I agree that history, biology and maths are good choices and offer many degree options, but it's obviously not reasonable to say they "keep almost every option open". More options than economics, politics and law A levels, for sure.

But among the uni options these A levels shut off are Eng lit, eng language, MFL, geography, physics, chemistry, most engineering, many maths courses, art, DT, drama...

And that's fine of course. It's called specialising and it's a great idea for many 16yos, who know what they like and don't want to continue with what they don't like.

I've never really understood this idea of keeping all doors open post 16. It's impossible, as taking multiple subjects would overnighter the focus. At 16 I knew full well I had no interest in keeping open the door to a degree in chemistry or biology or history. All good.

But history, maths and biology does keep almost every option open. There isn't anything unreasonable about saying that.

There are Russell Group universities that allow you into engineering with just maths. You can take MFL ab initio with another subject. You could study literature via a liberal arts degree...

But history, maths and biology does keep almost every option open. There isn't anything unreasonable about saying that.

I don't want to go on but I have to say again that this just isn't true. How can it be true?

They keep more options than open than some other combos of subjects, yes for sure. Not disputing that. With that combo you could do a degree in history, biology, maths at some lower-ranked unis, medicine at some unis, as well as the many degrees that require no specific subject (marketing or criminology or politics).

But you must see that there are many options that are closed. My DD took Eng lit, geography and French - so none of those subjects. By doing so she also kept a good number of options open. Geography, French and Eng lit for example (all of which are closed if you take history, biology and maths). You cannot take a degree in French without French A level (or at very least another MFL). Which uni will accept you to an Eng Lit degree without Eng lit?

Tbh tho that was never her motivation as she always wanted to take Eng Lit.

Any A level selection will close options off. That's fine. It's in the nature of the course. The key is not to close of options you may be interested in (as far as you can) and, if unsure, to take subjects that keep more doors open, like the ones above.

I think we're not as far apart as you think. When I say an option is open, it just means that you'd have to be creative about how you'd take the next step.

E.G. if you had history, biology and maths A levels, you could actually choose to study geography at university. You'd just have to enter via Natural Sciences (which your biology and maths A-level would allow you to do). Similarly, you could also study English literature, but you'd have to enter via Liberal Arts.

Yes, she is doing further maths.