WWYD? - Student DD and flatmates dilemma

[NigellaAwesome]

DD is first year at university in our home town. She is currently in halls, and plans to move into a 4 bed flat that we own from this September. She is planning on sharing with 3 friends.

The issue is that one of them is lovely, but a bit problematic in a variety of ways. DD has told me that she keeps blocking the sink in halls by putting food down it, and has been asked several times to stop doing it but she still does. She leaves the oven on for hours at a time and goes away and forgets about it. I hesitate to post this, but her personal life is also a bit turbulent and I can foresee that this could become an issue if sharing with others.

I have met DD's friends, and this individual is really sweet and outgoing, but I am very worried about potentially having her as a tenant. The oven issue is the most concerning - clearly a fire risk which has the potential to endanger life and property. The kitchen drain is likely to cause ongoing maintenance issues and expense. The personal life aspect - I tend to think is primarily her business, but part of the terms of our HMO licence is that we have a plan for dealing with anti-social behaviour, which includes inter-tenant issues. The only time we have ever had to ask a tenant to leave was when a woman was bringing random blokes back on a regular basis and the other tenants felt unsafe that they had no idea who they might be meeting on the way to the bathroom in the morning.

If she wasn't DD's friend, I would have no hesitation in saying no. But DD feels that she can't really single out this friend and tell her she can't share. I also have more general concerns about renting to students - we have only ever rented to groups of young professionals before, and also that DD is planning to share with friends. If it all goes pear-shaped then she potentially loses friendships.

I'm aware of strongly held opinions by some on MN about landlords etc - this post isn't really designed to debate this. We are ethical landlords and take our responsibilities seriously.

So, can anyone help with advice on how to deal with this?

Can you 'check the terms of your mortgage' and suddenly discover that you can't let to students?

I think I would say to your daughter to leave it this year and if her friend improves then maybe they can do it in the third year. I think your daughter has too much to lose and you certainly have too much to lose. That friend sounds nuts! It's a wonder she is still alive.

Or family members? Careless flatmate aside, rentals with people you met in term 1 can often go awry, and if they know that dd's parents are the landlords they're likely to think it won't matter so much if they're late with rent, a bit more careless etc. Much easier for you to maintain a professional relationship if your own offspring isn't your tenant.

Let them rent somewhere else and see how it goes

you can reconsider for year three

Let them all share a flat where you are not the landlord. Say you only rent to young professionals and as pp said make something up about it if necessary.

I don’t think you can single her out not to move in and I agree that this might damage friendships. She might actually me more responsible knowing that you are the landlords and just an anonymous university housing block. Worse case is that after a year she has to move out.
Make sure you have additional smoke alarms fitted, fire blankets etc. if you haven’t already get fire doors. That might sound a bit scary but see how it goes in the first instance and deal with the issues from her as they arise.

I think this is ‘mixing business with pleasure’ - so much potential for it to go wrong. Don’t do it!

I'm torn because if you were letting to someone you didn't know none of what you're saying is any of your business and is all hearsay. I also think unless these kids are getting an incredible deal rent-wise they are insane to share with the landlord's daughter. That said, obviously you're going to listen to her.

I think you need to decide now what your approach will be - professional or parental. If the former I might write a very detailed guidebook along with the tenancy agreement which details tenants' exact responsibilities when it comes to the house and what they will pay for from their deposit. Social lives are none if your business.

If parental I would just make your daughter manager so she is ultimately responsible for whatever happens in the house. She might decide not to rent you the friend on that basis and will certainly learn a lot. What I absolutely wouldn't do is step in on her behalf every time something goes wrong as she needs to learn how to deal with stuff (and if you're making money from people they have a right to quiet enjoyment).

I will say also that having had dealings with a lot of students residences that the sinks are ALWAYS blocking and it is always blamed on people putting food in them - it probably isn't that. Plus even if it is, one person putting food down a well maintained house sink is not the same as a block of flats with loads of potential blocker uppers.

Of course you can single her out not to move in. She's a danger to the property and anyone in it. Her history of blocking drains and leaving the oven on for hours shows that. If she ends the friendship with your daughter because her behaviour stops her moving into a shared house with her she wouldn't be much of a friend either way. Your daughter can tell her landlord says no because of drains and oven and there's nothing she can do about it as it's your property, not hers.

To be perfectly honest I wouldn't want my daughter sharing a house, any house, never mind my own property, with someone who could potentially kill her in a housefire.

Yep, this. I also wouldn't want to be responsible for knowingly putting neighbours in danger of a fire risk.

I don't think you should rent to any of them.

Let them stay in student accommodation with a landlord that isn't related to one of them. It'll be so much easier for everyone involved.

Thanks everyone for your replies. It has given clarity to my thinking - I will speak to DH but I think those who are saying don't rent to DD & friends at all are right. I have been having doubts for a while. I think as a group, they are just too inexperienced and so much potential for things to go wrong - better to have an experienced student landlord for the first year of proper independent living.

My niece (also a student) was telling us a few months ago how her flatmate had set fire to the house by accident, and was so panicked that she locked the front door behind her as she left so the fire brigade took longer to gain entry. The story was related as an amusing anecdote, full of giggles. The flat was gutted, although thankfully no-one was hurt. Me & DH were horrified listening to it.

So she sometimes leaves the oven on and is careless with what goes down the sink? Hardly nuts and not exactly a risk to life.

Buy a plughole strainer and, after the first blockage, make clear that they have to pay to sort it in future.

I don't think a modern oven is a big fire risk; they have thermostats and are designed to be left on for several hours at a time.

I wouldn't believe that young professional tenants are any better / more sensible or considerate than your daughter's friends who know they are living in their friend's parents' house.

If she wasn't DD's friend, I would have no hesitation in saying no. But DD feels that she can't really single out this friend and tell her she can't share. I also have more general concerns about renting to students - we have only ever rented to groups of young professionals before, and also that DD is planning to share with friends. If it all goes pear-shaped then she potentially loses friendships.

I think you may have to become the "nasty landlady" here, and veto this particular tenant.

I'm assuming that if you have a flat licensed as an HMO, that you have tenancy agreements with each tenant individually? If so, you are wholly within your rights not to offer her a tenancy.

I am an "accidental" landlord, and my first foray was renting to 2 students I knew very well (not requiring an HMO licence at that point) and they found a 3rd. That 3rd tenant was endless trouble to them & me ... I only rent the house to families now.

I was in your DDs position, stuck between my friends and parents as a landlord. In hindsight, I wish we had rented somewhere totally separate and not linked to my parents at all. The small hassle in not having to flat search was nothing compared to the pressure I felt to manage my housemates and parents.

Get an airfryer? Would stop the oven problem although I don't see it as a fire risk, more just an expensive electricity bill risk. Blocked drains are probably par for the course in rentals- get a sieve drainer thing