PPE Oxford any tips?!

[Createausernameargh]

Hi there, my second son has set his sights on PPE at Oxford. We’ve looked at the stats and it looks like one of the most competitive subjects 😵‍💫, he’s also not doing history AL but is passionate about it and reads a lot on the subject.

He has an amazing memory for historical events. He’s started practising the tar (I think it’s called that!) questions.

He’s at a state sixth form and doing FM, Maths, Economics & Geography. He’s in yr 12 - I’m obviously hoping the school will help with his dream but would love to hear any stories of successful applicants or current students on the course.

I don’t want to necessarily put him off but he clearly needs to be realistic! His GCSEs are very good: 8 9s, 2 8s. But he’s also dyslexic & ASC. Thanks so much in advance 🙏🏻

Hi

My DS has just started PPE at Oxford. He is loving it so far
He comes from a state comprehensive, with v. little guidance from his school and only one in his school to make it to Oxbridge.

A key factor in admissions is TSA performance. It is weighed much more than the PS with their reading and supracurricular activities, etc (he had done none except for debating). From my experience, practice helps to bring scores up a bit, although not massively. The test is designed to test mostly ability but practice helps with speed, with is crucial. We bought a couple of TSA practice books and printed out past papers and started practicing in the summer, although not very intensively. At the open day one tutor said you had to be in the top third of scores to be considered for an interview.

The Oxford PPE webpage has stats for TSA scores, A levels etc. and that will give you an idea of what matters most.

My DS did not get any questions during his interviews about his PS, they were all "thinking" questions and did not require prior knowledge.

Best of luck!

His GCSEs are good. My advice is get into his supercurriculars. Do an essay competition, John Locke do ones. Do the IEA one. Try and get commended . Read books. If he like PPE, read books about each case and do something about how they interlink.

Where else will he apply?

You don't need to explicitly do History to do PPE (Philosophy Politics and Economics). His current selection is a bit maths heavy but I personally think that's a good thing because it is the foundation of economics. Therefore here he need to demonstrate he can write, form long thought out arguments which is very different skillset to being good at maths. He need to demonstrate this somehow. I think he can try to relate the love of Geography to link towards Geo-politics and how geography dictates the ebb and flow of international politics for example.

Most do have history AL that get in so I did wonder if this would be a negative @MissLucyLiu
wow you must be so proud @Otherunichoices ! Is he finding the cohort friendly?
That’s it - TSA - writing on the commute! I’ll buy some practise books, that’s a good idea!
At the moment he’s not given much thought on where else to apply. I don’t think most unis release their open day info until Jan?

I know my colleague that didn't do History. That's what make you stand out. Which is why I think @BillieJeanIsNotMyLover's is true. You need to demonstrate via other extracurricular activities such 'essay competition, John Locke' .. student newspaper chief editor.. join poetry clubs etc to demonstrate you are good at writing etc. Not doing history can be actually be flagged as advantage and difference.. i.e. he can have a very mathematical view / logic driven view of the world economies etc.

Hi. Some of the cohort don't have history and have done politics or other subjects. At the open day they said they liked one essay-based subject and economics counted. I think it is great to do FM.

Another piece of advice from the tutors was not to just list lots of books you have read in your PS but say why you found them interesting, what they made you think about. My DS mentioned 2 only, as somebody said using them to draw out themes and make links. He does not read a lot tbh and did not ahead of the application, a couple of the typical ones ahead of the interview (undercover economist etc. He did not enter any essay competitions either.

Part B of the TSA they have to do for PPE is an essay and that counts toward the TSA overall score for shifting. That is how they assess writing skills.

He is finding everybody very friendly, they study together sometimes and they go out a lot, he is having a ball. He was worried it would all be studying and, although the pace is fast, he seems to have plenty of time to do other stuff (it is early days, let's see later in the year). He also likes the tutors, very approachable and encouraging.

Good luck, the PSE/TSA/Interview prep thing during the first term felt like a lot of extra work and pressure, going back to just 4 A levels afterwards was easy!

@MissLucyLiu I don't think extracurriculars. I think you should do supercurriculars. Student newspaper won't be relevant unless you relate the articles to PPE topics.

Oxford admissions won't care about poetry if he wants to do PPE.

The book you need is "So You Think You Can Think". I passed our copy onto a 2024 applicant a couple of months ago.

DD graduated this summer. Maths, English Language and History at A level plus an EPQ. Her GCSE results were a mix of 9s, 8s, 7s and a 6 along with a grade D. She was in the Gavin Williamson farce 2020 intake which didn't take their A levels. She did extremely well in the TSA, but had never entered an essay competition, been to a debating society or similar.

We spoke to one of the tutors who interviewed her at graduation. He firmly believed that they should not discriminate against those who had no idea that such things as essay competitions existed. DD was taught history in mixed ability classes to GCSE where many students were expecting grades 2 - 4. They deliberately ask questions designed to show potential rather than things they had either formally or informally been prepped to handle from age 13.

I would also ensure that your DS is aware that getting the offer is the easy bit. From the first week DD was writing 2 essays and submitting 2 econ & stats worksheets each week. Her work was pulled apart in one to one or one to two tutorials week in, week out.

First year exams get you through to year 2, there are no second year exams. Your entire degree is determined by 8 papers at the end of year 3. In DD's case she had 8 papers in 15 days, with her final 3 sat on Monday afternoon, Tuesday morning & Tuesday afternoon. It was tough.

Would he qualify for UNIQ? Take a look at the Oxford programme for widening participation for state school applicants.

Yes, absolutely. Supracurriculars like essay competitions favour those whose parents or schools are aware they exist and can encourage students to enter. And entering only proves you entered, not the quality of the entry.

By contrast, an objective test levels the playing field to some extent (not completely as you can also prepare for it).

With interviews, questions like why you want to study x or about the PS can be rehearsed, but unexpected questions less so.

My impression is that admissions tutors make an effort to make the process prep-proof as much as possible.

Thank you @HewasH2O - have ordered the book you recommended! Congrats to your daughter. What are her plans now?!

re ds’ asc and what with there being the first (openly) autistic professor at Cambridge would it be worth disclosing? Surely they wouldn’t discriminate anyway..? Or I wonder if there are any special measures? He will already be allowed extra time on the tsa with the dyslexia.

@Createausernameargh How would needing extra time work with the fast pace at Oxford? Would he worry about this? Obviously he should apply but the pace expected might give me concern.

DS sat the TSA (for a Cambridge course not Oxford PPE) and it's a good idea to do at least a couple of past papers to know what to expect in the test. DS did the available past papers over a period of about three weeks leading up to the TSA but didn't use any other books.

Dd had undiagnosed Additional Learning Needs before she went to Oxford. The support she received from her college once we realised was excellent. They made appropriate adjustments, but it did mean that her final final didn't finish until after 7pm as each exam was over 4 hours long. That was tough.

Adjustments were also made to deadlines eg. Never 2 submissions on the same day. They definitely didn't drop expectations for her in tutorials or written work.

We jokingly used to say that you were probably in a minority if you didn't have either a diagnosed or undiagnosed ALN.

Maths is more useful than history for economics and philosophy.

A mathematical brain is useful for passing Logic, but the professor who wrote the study text admits himself that most people don't understand much of it. It's not relevant for the vast majority of philosophy options.

BTW op, most drop one of the 3 disciplines at the end of year 1. DD was slightly unusual as she kept a single economics paper, but graduated with philosophy and politics. The current trend is that graduating with all 3 is less popular these days as you have to take so many compulsory modules only leaving 2 optional papers.