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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

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Original poster

York or Durham for Chemistry?

44 replies

BeatriceLacey · 19/04/2023 19:13

DS is undecided. I'm inclined to think that York might be the less stressful option (and that's important, ASD and ADHD). I'm a bit worried that the workload at Durham might be a bit much. Also York clearly want him as he has a very low offer and the admissions tutor recognised his name and chatted at the offer holder day. I'm aware that Durham is more prestigious though and we both prefer the city. But York is closer to home and one of his friends will be on his course.

I'm very aware that it's not my decision to make but if anyone has any suggestions/ information to help him decide I'll be very grateful. Thanks

OP posts:

neverwakeasleepingbaby · 19/04/2023 19:19

I'd say go with whatever his gut feeling is! I did chemistry at Bath (and stayed on to do a PhD). I fell in love with the campus on an open day and the department had a nice feeling to it. I also applied to York and felt similarly but Bath was much closer to home for me. Occasionally I wonder whether I should have tried harder to get into Oxbridge but I'm convinced I would have had a better time at Bath, and I've still got the career I wanted at the end of it all. I also don't think prestige matters a huge amount. They're both excellent universities and if he does well, he should get the career he wants out of it at the end regardless. Hope it all goes well for him!

Stringbean70 · 19/04/2023 19:52

York is actually ranked more highly for Chemistry in the Sunday Times guide (7th); Durham ranked 10=. Student experience slightly higher at York too.

Both excellent unis though - well done to your DS!

cptartapp · 19/04/2023 20:00

DS2 has firmed York for Chemistry.

Curlysusie · 19/04/2023 20:05

York 😊

KingFisherSalmon · 19/04/2023 20:13

I was at Durham (a long time ago) and read Natural Sciences. The pastoral care is very good, as is support for students with additional needs. You are in colleges . Students with disabilities can live in all 3(or 4)years.

PerpetualOptimist · 19/04/2023 20:16

You may well find that lots of (particularly SE located) Mumsnetters will pile on to say Durham is 'obviously' more prestigious but, as a PP has indicated, York has a very highly regarded Chemistry department and, for MChem students, has excellent links with major pharma and industrial chemical companies for placements (which are done in the 4th year at York, as they are at Durham).

It does not surprise me that the staff took the trouble to look up and memorise the details of visiting prospective students. York won't necessarily be an easier ride academically but the dedication amongst staff to getting to know the students is definitely there.

bguthb90 · 19/04/2023 20:53

I did Chemistry at Durham 30 years ago.

Whilst my 3 years there were some of the best years of my life, I can safely say the undergraduate teaching was pretty poor - it definitely seemed to be an unwanted distraction to most of the staff, who just wanted to get back to their research.

Obviously, you would hope it has changed over time, but it's probably best to do some research of the Uni comparison sites to find out which of York and Durham has the best feedback for teaching

samsonthecat · 19/04/2023 21:05

I studied chemistry at York many years ago and I loved it.

EwwSprouts · 19/04/2023 21:24

I think he has to go with his gut feeling. DS attended a York offer holder day for biology last year but preferred Durham (and put Sheffield as his insurance over York). He's there and happy. He has quite a full workload with lab sessions etc but fits in plenty of sport and socialising and chilling. In the first term his tutor explicitly said to him 'don't bust a gut this year, find your feet'. The college system does make it an easier transition in my opinion.

notveryspeedy · 19/04/2023 21:31

I'm biased as I'm an ex-York student but it is a wonderful university. When I was a student 30yrs ago the chemistry department had an excellent reputation and it sounds like it still does.
The league tables are showing York as better than Durham for the subject, and it's a very highly thought of institution overall, so I really don't think you need to worry if he chooses to go there.

Stringbean70 · 19/04/2023 23:12

“You may well find that lots of (particularly SE located) Mumsnetters will pile on to say Durham is 'obviously' more prestigious”

yep, so true. I would add that those with private school DC constantly (and boringly) recommend Durham (and Exeter etc) above York (even though York better/as good as both of those unis in some subjects). They still recommend Bristol too but that will tail off as they catch up to the fact that Bristol has made great strides in being more inclusive (loads of contextual offers in recent years).

Mumsnet HE topic is wonderful and can be so helpful but not it is not representative of the full gamut of students/backgrounds. Witness disproportionate amount of posts about Oxbridge and Russell Group unis.

KittyMcKitty · 19/04/2023 23:35

Where does he prefer? My dd has firmed Durham and insured York (not for chemistry). They are both amazing cities and universities. Dd preferred the feel of Durham (both Uni or city) but if she ends up at either I think she’ll be very happy.

I would say go with whichever he likes the most and either would be fantastic!

carriedout · 19/04/2023 23:39

They have very different cultures. Both are excellent. Not true that Durham is more prestigious, both are great for Chemistry.

What's his view of the different cities? And does he like the Durham-style formal dinners etc?

PinkBallgown · 19/04/2023 23:47

I used to work in the Chemistry Dept at York and the teaching staff were of excellent calibre. It was unnerving to go into the kitchen after 5pm on Fridays, though, when the research students had filled the sink full of dry ice pellets to chill the beers. That probably isn’t allowed now.

poetryandwine · 20/04/2023 00:08

Hi, OP -

Why are you concerned about the workload at Durham, but not at York?

Writing as a former (Russell Group STEM) admissions tutor, what I read suggests that the admissions team at York is very good. That could be significant.

Is your DS eligible for a contextual offer? Chemistry is not a hugely popular subject, for reasons that escape me, but universities of this calibre don’t generally make idiosyncratic low offers as a way of courting students. I can see that having his good mate at York could be helpful.

Both unis have good reputations with students who have special needs. The collegiate structure at Durham may offer extra supports: this is worth investigating.

You can’t judge any place, positively or negatively, on the teaching from 30 years ago. Teaching and academic support have gotten much better just about everywhere!

I agree that these are both excellent choices and your DS is likely to thrive best if he goes with his preference.

cptartapp · 20/04/2023 06:39

Worth noting OP, York has a collegiate system too.

dumpydiva · 20/04/2023 07:01

*Whilst my 3 years there were some of the best years of my life, I can safely say the undergraduate teaching was pretty poor - it definitely seemed to be an unwanted distraction to most of the staff, who just wanted to get back to their research
*
This. A child of one of my closest friends and in their final year doing chemistry at Durham and says the same.

There is a snobbery that gets cultivated amongst students at Durham - an elitism which is not nice. I've seen this young person change from being a pleasant and engaging teenager into someone who looks down their noses at those not having studied there or of a different social class bracket. It's pretty obnoxious - as is their bragging of mixing with rich students whose parents fork out for extravagant parties for their offspring/have second mansions in the countryside/lavish dinner parties, etc etc.

bguthb90 · 20/04/2023 07:55

@dumpydiva I think that young person you know is the exception rather than the norm.

Your comment is also unrelated to the teaching quality of Chemistry at Durham vs York.

Let's not sidetrack this thread into a Durham/Elitism discussion. There are plenty of those already.

Mamapiggywig · 20/04/2023 07:56

York is lovely ! The campus is nice and the university really look after their kids

EwwSprouts · 20/04/2023 08:20

*bguthb90 · Yesterday 20:53
I did Chemistry at Durham 30 years ago.

This is the feeling DS got from the York biology dept last year & so did I on the separate parents tour. Obviously it's a different dept but there was a clear division. Other universities were keen to say these are our current key areas of research, let's show you some of the facilities now and if you show interest there will be opportunities to work alongside us. York was 'research is in the next building and only masters students enter the hallowed corridors'.

There is a snobbery that gets cultivated amongst students at Durham - an elitism which is not nice. What a crass generalisation, seemingly based on knowing one student there. DS has not changed, we do not have lavish means and from what he has mentioned about friends (eg one friend got a contextual offer) neither do most of them. I know two other students there very well and both of them are lovely, empathetic and grounded in common sense. All northerners 😉

LockInAtTheFeathers · 20/04/2023 08:54

I’m another one who has to say that @dumpydiva’s post is ridiculously unfair on Durham. I went to Durham from a working class background and had a fantastic time, and didn’t come across any prejudice or elitism.

I studied Natural Sciences, including some Chemistry modules, and I would say that I found the Chemistry department to be stricter and more formal than the other science departments. This is more than 10 years ago though so things may have changed.

bguthb90 · 20/04/2023 09:10

@LockInAtTheFeathers - maybe not.

I just took a quick look at the Durham Chemistry Staff webpage and there are 6 Professors still listed who taught me in the mid 90s (some of them still using the same photo from 30 years ago also 🙂)

If you were only there 10 years ago, I'm guessing you'll recognise a lot more

beeskipa · 20/04/2023 09:21

My DH did a year doing chemistry at Durham and moved to Leeds - he said it was snobby and elitist. He graduated 16 years ago, though.

York is a lovely uni, although I don't know what their chemistry dept is like! So my vote is York.

SpamhappyTootsie · 20/04/2023 09:31

DS is studying Chemistry at Durham. He had York as his second choice. We did joke about how friendly York seemed as they were always emailing him, sending him water bottles and postcards etc . Whereas Durham were like “Here’s your offer, see you if you meet it” <shrug>
He chose on the basis of slightly preferring both the course and the city at Durham.
As far as Durham Snobbery goes, he hasn’t come across that, although he does say it can be an issue in some Colleges and on some courses. He’s in a Hill College and his friends are from both state and private education. He’s the sort to brush off any snobbery anyway, or just not notice it.
He’s loving the course, particularly the Practicals.

SpamhappyTootsie · 20/04/2023 09:36

Just to add, accommodation is proving to be a big problem at Durham. DS currently has nowhere to live for his 3rd year and the University accommodation office is being no help whatsoever. They’ve taken on so many students that only 1st years seem to ‘count’ in their eyes, which has taken the shine off it a little. Private accommodation is ridiculously expensive, even if you can get it.
I don’t know how that compares to York though, maybe it’s a University problem rather than just a Durham problem.

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