Clearing?

[mrsconradfisher]

I posted last week about DS getting rejected from Loughborough so won’t bore everyone again about it. He has asked if he Firms one of his rather limited choices and then gets the grades he is hoping for then can he just reject that on results day and go into clearing? I suspect he is hoping that if he ends up with 2 A stars and an A he can call up Loughborough and they will magically offer him a place. His reasoning is that not everyone will get the grades predicted so there should still be places…honestly for an intelligent boy he is very naive sometimes! I’ve tried explaining that most of the courses on Clearing won’t be where he wants to go but clearly my words are falling on deaf ears! So someone please tell me I’m correct, there is little chance of Sports Science at Loughborough, Bath or Exeter being on clearing and there isn’t likely to be anything better than Birmingham which he has already got a good offer from?

To get an idea of what may be in Clearing in August you can search on UCAS for courses still available through Extra - it's not definitive but can give you a picture of what may be available where. It is unlikely that Loughborough/Bath etc will have places as they are all very highly over-subscribed.

Yes thank you, that’s exactly what we have already done. The only one on there is Newcastle but he is convinced on results day all these courses will magically just open up when people don’t get the grades. Just wanted to check there was nothing obvious I was missing before I try to convince him otherwise.

Best wishes to him and you. It's not an easy time for either of you!

My child tried to go through clearing a couple of years ago. They missed the grades , just , for their choices and started ringing around. There were plenty of places willing to give them a place with their very good grades, but no where they wanted to go or no course they wanted to do. You have to be officially rejected before you can enter clearing , but they started to ring around to see what there was on the day of results. A few places offered to keep a place open for a day or two.
As it was their second choice offered them a place on. B eng course instead of M eng and they transferred to M eng after excellent results in uni so no loss.

If it's a competitive course, or uni , you will not get through in clearing .

I have mentored 6th form students and too often they are desperate to take a place, any place and end up miserable after accepting a clearing place when they would be better off redoing A s , reapplying and spending the extra year doing interesting stuff.

Thank you, I imagine is a very stressful time. DS’s issue is that he is hopeful he will get better grades than what he had been predicted. He got rejected from Loughborough as predicted based on October Mocks 3 A’s. He is now predicted A star A A. He has been offered Birmingham ABB so he should hopefully get that but he is questioning whether if he gets the higher grades he could contact Loughborough/Bath etc through clearing and see if they’d accept him. Firstly I don’t think they’d be on clearing and secondly if he firms Birmingham, if he gets those grades then surely he’ll have to go there (well obviously he won’t have to but he won’t just be able to pick and choose like he thinks he will)

He could reapply next year with his known grades

Unlikely that Loughborough will accept him if they rejected him, they always over offer as they know people won’t hit the grades needed.

Not likely for those Unis at all, highly oversubscribed.
If he wants it that bad get the needed grades this year do a gap yr doing a relevant job and reapply next year with grades in hand.

Yep that’s option 2 but he really wants to go this year if possible. I’m just really frustrated with the whole thing tbh. He is utterly fixated on Loughborough. We asked at the open day if they offered on 3 A’s as his 6th Form don’t predict A stars on UCAS (very low achieving 6th form) and they said yes obviously subject to you getting the A star in the exams then rejected him as he wasn’t predicted an A star.
Nothing he can do just feel very disillusioned with the whole thing tbh.

The problem is that universities significantly over offer. So if they have 50 places and they know that their offer/take up rate is 4:1 they will make 200 people offers knowing that they will then get the 50 people they need. If they only get 45 meeting the conditions of their offer they are far more likely to allow those who held offers but were near misses to take up their place despite not quite meeting the offer conditions than to put the course into clearing since they already liked that application enough to make an offer.

So the best way to see what might be in clearing is to look at the courses in Extra. These are that courses which are already undersubscribed. Be aware that this doesn't mean that the 50 people needed haven't applied yet, it means that they haven't yet reached the 200 offers they need to convert to 50 places taken up. So in the event it may well be that a course which appears in Extra is not in clearing because all places are filled on results day. This is particularly the case with a course in Extra since you only get one shot at a time with Extra so anyone who applies for an extra course and gets an offer is then converted to a taken place (unless they miss their grades)

Thank you, that’s pretty much what I thought. Now just need to convince him of that. The only one currently on Extra is Newcastle, he just needs to decide whether to reject Birmingham and apply there through Extra. He has already contacted them and they’ve offered dependent on AAB grades. His idea is definitely not going to work on results day.

In theory yes but it will depend on remaining availability of places. Not all unis/courses will appear in Clearing. Some might offer joint degrees including the subject he applied for which he could look into.

You have to be officially rejected before you can enter clearing

No, you don't - if you no longer want to go to the university which becomes your unconditional firm offer on results day (either your original firm, or your insurance, however things pan out), you can just self-release. This has been the system for a few years now.

www.ucas.com/undergraduate/results-confirmation-and-clearing/what-clearing/declining-your-firm-place#:~:text=If%20you%20no%20longer%20want,place'%20button%20in%20your%20application.

I'd be very surprised if sports science at Lboro were in clearing tbh. It's like economics at LSE being offered. It's much more likely that a student with an offer who misses by a grade will still be offered a place (if lboro liked them enough to offer) - and unis traditionally over offer anyway so need some to slip.

He doesn't have to go to hus firm choice tjo. Mate of dd's got her grades for Warwick, changed her mind and spent results day on the phone sorting out a Cardiff offer instead.

Clearing is so so stressful tho. Can he not come round to the idea of Brum? It's a great uni.

Meant to add, he shouldn't fixate on the now-preducted A star. He might still not have got an offer even with his updated production. I know that's unhelpful in a way but perhaps he can see that it is not only about grades? I imagine SS at lboro really can be picky so they may focus heavily on the PS for example.

Plus he mustn’t fall into the common trap of thinking his predictions are his grades. Just because he’s now predicted an A star doesn’t mean he will get it. It’s dependent on how others do as well as how he himself does and nobody knows where the grade boundaries will be. He could have a disaster on exam day. You just don’t know. It’s why it’s always sensible to have a more secure offer than be banking on an aspirational stretch.

Birmingham really is a good solid Russell Group university. It’s a great option. I seem to recall his issue was their links with clubs for the work placement year. With respect work placement years have become a bit of a gimmick. You’re not guaranteed to get a job and when it comes to it lots of students don’t want to go when their mates are all staying and going into their third year.

Sorry , you are right , but in most cases people will hang on until they are rejected (or not) which may take days. You can ring around before then to see who has space .
In my child's case it took a few days before the uni accepted their slightly lower grades for a B eng instead of M eng. They had a couple of unis that were going to save a space for a couple of days .

You might also warn him to be cautious because
a) Loughborough may not have places available in Clearing
b) they may still not take him, whatever his A levels

I don't think they will take him. Loughborough has courses in Extra at the moment (indicating they might go into clearing). The sports courses are not included. They are incredibly over subscribed for their sports courses and until recently really sold themselves as being for the ultra sporty and not for kids who don't engage in sport (they're now trying to move away from that image). As a result the standard is extremely high and there are kids with straight A stars who get rejected simply because there aren't places on those courses.

Apparently if Loughborough university was a country it would have won more medals at the last olympics than any other country. You can see sports stars just by wandering around campus.

This also has its downsides. Getting onto sports teams is not at all easy.

Loughborough town itself is small, run down and a bit crap.

No I completely agree and would have said the same thing if he had been rejected straight off when he applied however he must have been quite close to getting an offer because he emailed them 4 weeks ago and they said most of the rejections had gone out already and they were carefully considering the last few applications. His PS was excellent (I know everyone says that but it really was). He was mentored by a Durham Sports Science Masters student through a programme called Zero Gravity and she really helped him finesse it so to speak.

He has always said if he didn’t get the grades on the day then so be it…think it’s just annoyed him that they didn’t even give him a chance! And he’s annoyed with himself for applying so bloody early as with his updated grades after Christmas he might been able to convince 6th Form to put an A star.

I totally agree with everything you have said, it’s been one of my concerns all alone. He definitely won’t make any of the sports teams, he is very sporty in a general sort of way nothing like the level they need there (which also don’t think helped his application) and I don’t think that would help his feeling of self worth whilst he was there. I think he would constantly feel not quite good enough.
Also agree Loughborough is a bit of a dump!

I know Loughborough University extremely well for reasons not connected to my DC at all. DS and I also then went to an open day for a course not connected to sport. DS realy liked the campus but decided not to apply since he also had concerns about his feeling of self worth whilst there.

I had a long chat with him last night after he has had a week to think about everything. He is slowly coming round to the idea of Birmingham. It’s such a good offer and quite honestly he would be mad to reject it.

He wanted an aspirational stretch to prove to himself that he could do it but anything could go wrong during the exams and with Birmingham he can realistically obtain the grades.

The placement years on all the other courses were promoted as a one way ticket to getting a job immediately after but that’s clearly not the case, I also pointed out there is a good chance he wouldn’t actually want to go!

Crikey this whole thing has been stressful, I seriously hope my younger son doesn’t want to go to Uni in a few years time!

Many years ago I dropped my sandwich year because I was having too good a time with my mates and they'd be gone by the time I got back.

DNephew has just changed his course to drop his work placement for similar reasons. He wants to stay with his cohort.

Hi OP. Glad your DS is coming round to the ode of Birmingham. My DD has also been rejected by her first choice despite high grades/ predictions so I understand his distress.

just a further thought - I work in a uni although i haven’t been involved in clearing for a few years. Last time I was, students couldn’t get a place on our course through clearing if we’d already considered and rejected their application in that academic cycle. I’m not sure if that still holds true or holds true for every course.

sorry not to offer more definite information. However I wonder if it’s worth checking out (or someone else on the thread knows) as if this still holds true, it would mean he definitely has to put aside hopes of getting into Loughborough through clearing.

Ahh thank you, that’s definitely something to consider (I shall investigate). I know it sounds like I’m doing a lot of the groundwork at the moment but in between revising and his job over Easter holidays he hasn’t got a massive amount of time to be researching stuff!

If that’s the case then he’ll definitely have to put any idea of Loughborough to one side unless he wants a Gap Year.