Medicine 2025 entry

[HGC2]

Inspired and slightly terrified reading the 2023 entry threads and how much prep has to go into a medicine application!

DC wants to do medicine, probably in Scotland as a Scottish student, doing well at school but this doesn't seem to be enough! School has little / no experience of applications for medicine as a not fantastic state school!

Can anyone advise what work experience / volunteering they will need (currently volunteering at sports club with hope of job)
what are the spreadsheets that people talk about?
How do you strategically apply?

I have one child at uni and they just applied and got a place, this seems like a whole other level!

Reapplicants are also applying with grades in hand. They won't apply if they have not made the grades so will be a stronger cohort. The added year's maturity and previous experience of the process (practice UCAT!) will also help, as will an understanding of the need to be strategic.

I note another reason (apart from fees) for some Scottish students to avoid studying in England; they might be required to take a year out before starting as they don’t turn 18 until February (cut off date for school entry in Scotland) after they leave school. Most courses require you to be 18 by October.

Remember that everyone applies to 4 Unis and some people will get 4 offers and some will get none. And some will get a mixture of both. So statistically it's hard to know who gets 'rejected'. Some students have been called for interview in the last few weeks to a few unis after initially being rejected. Some will get in off the waitlist once IB results are out.

Just focus on what you can at each stage. For now, that's the UCAT. Then it's where to apply to maximise chances of interview. When you see the headline of '4 A star student rejected' it's either that they applied to the wrong Unis, or they tanked the interviews.

Then it's the interviews themselves. Know the GMC competencies and the pillars. Know what that course offers.

Then get the grades !

There is also the element of luck. If an applicant goes to four interviews with 50% chance of a place (they are good but so is the other applicant) there is a one in 16 chance of no offers, four in 16 chance of one offer, 6 in 16 chance of two offers, four in 16 chance of three offers, and 1 in 16 chance of four offers.

You can't control luck, but you have some control of the other elements.

@ColouringPencils to answer your Q, my elder DC didn’t go on to studying medicine in the end, he had a very bad accident in yr13 that meant he had to take a lot of time out and essentially redo the year. He was left with a physical disability (although it’s lessening with time and treatment, so we’re hoping it’s not permanent, touch wood) and chronic fatigue that meant he had to re-evaluate things and what he was able to do from a practical standpoint. So medicine was out, but he went to a London uni to do something science-y and medicine-adjacent. Not smooth-sailing, but he’s OK!

I do hope experience of someone who has been through the process is helpful, even if not everyone agrees.

That’s misconstruing what I was saying @Needmoresleep

My further advice would be to consider making it a two years process

This is good advice… for those that can afford it. Unfortunately many can’t. And for some students, it’s best for their emotional wellbeing to go to university and move away from home straightaway.

I appreciate that your DD’s public school gave this ‘think of it as a two-year process’ advice, but I know many state schools definitely won’t say that. But u appreciate that on MN it’s likely to be a feasible option for some.

In fairness I did say "consider".

A gap year can allow a chance to earn and build up some savings, as well as gain some experience. If someone really wants a medical career and does not get a place first time round, I think it is really worth thinking hard about taking a year out. Lots do get in second time round.

The issue is in part that many schools wont be able to offer support to reapplicants, so may prefer to see them placed first time round. It is at least worth a conversation. There can be advantage in starting a demanding course with that extra year's maturity, and having a break between school and University.

Well yes a gap year can provide those advantages @Needmoresleep and no many state schools won’t be able to offer support to re-applicants. But it’s important not to dismiss the fact that some 18 year olds just aren’t able to take a gap year for financial or other reasons.

Historically, the process of getting into medical school has systematically favoured the middle class and/or public-school educated. I think it’s a shame in a way that those at some independent schools have the advantage over some other students of being able to consider a two-year approach because their school supports that for a fee and they have the means to take a gap year.

Thinking of it as a 2 year process and getting a job if it doesn't work out first time round is definitely not a private school privilege (unless you're planning to spend the year holidaying). It's what most people who dont go to uni have to do! But if you really really want to study medicine and dont get a place first time round then a job ideally in health or care can do wonders for interview skills and confidence. Mine both went to the local comp and were given this advice.
Dont let the stats on applicants to offers ratios terrify you. The figures are pretty meaningless Yes it looks stark if 80% of applicants dont get a place on any one med course but most of those who meet the criteria WILL get a place somewhere else. Not all that 80% will be serious applicants.Some don't get the grades or haven't applied strategically enough, some change their minds, some never wanted to do medicine in the first place, some 'fail' due to other factors such as a criminal record. I've met someone who applied to do medicine at a certain uni but didnt even realise she had to take UCAT so her application would've gone nowhere. She'll be one of the 80% who didnt get an offer that year.

Sorry paragraphs disappeared.

Gap years are not possible for everyone. On leaving school they lose any benefits and many families will need them to work, not just to 'help out' but to fill the hole left by the drop in income. Most 18 year olds will not get a job that pays thus well. And they'll want time off for interviews and ucat. Poverty does not afford the luxury of part time, flexible work.

Going to Uni they get a loan, bursaries and are no longer a drain on their parents.

All state schools will support replicants. They do it every year for any student that takes a year out.

@Haffdonga I’m glad your DC’s comp recommended a 2 year system; they were able to support a second submission

of UCAS applications then?

Getting a job because you’re not going to uni and getting a job for a gap year is not entirely the same thing… Anyway regardless of working, I wanted to gently point out that for some people living at home for another year just isn’t an option, because of cramped living space, or because it’s not safe, or because their parents can’t afford to subsidise them.

I x-posted with you but YES, this is one of the points I was making, thank you.

Good to know state schools support re-applicants. That wasn’t always the case 5 or so years ago.

Sorry to hear about your DS's accident @SkillDuggery. That sounds like it was very hard for him. I hope he continues to make a good recovery.

Money aside, the '2-year process' mentality also takes some confidence, which is perhaps why it is more prevalent in privately educated students. When I applied for Oxford many years ago a lot of my fellow interviewees (all privately educated) for an English degree were on round 2 with grades in hand, whereas I probably would have lacked the confidence to apply again if I had been rejected (which I was, but then messed up my A levels too, so didn't need to worry about that!). I can imagine my DD might feel similarly, although she is a lot more tenacious than I am. Nonetheless, I will tell her to think of it like that, as I can't see any harm in having the idea in mind that if you are unsuccessful you could try again.

@ColouringPencils no need to do that yet. Keep positive, get that UCAT and we can worry about a gap year next year 😊

Thank you @ColouringPencils

@Karolinska stop. Or I'll report you for bullying behaviour. I'm here to help. So stop.

mumsneedwine my contributions are absolutely every bit as designed to be helpful as yours are. If you can find anything of substance to report then please do. It’s actually seriously important that the current applicants know what the challenges are further down the line. You have had a lot to contribute yourself on this subject. I genuinely think you should air your take on it here, so that these Y12s have an understanding of what’s going on. It’s inconceivable that a discussion of the issues can be against any guidelines. This board is for information and mutual help. The more that seasoned parents of older DC can contribute then I would have thought the better.

but it’s a reality that these young people probably do need to face, so that they can genuinely ‘apply strategically’.

@Karolinska

I am genuinely asking, not being snarky: how does knowing the future for current F2s help apply strategically, when getting interviews/a place depends on UCAT, work experience and A Level predictions? Other than perhaps, contribute to strategically deciding not to apply for medicine at all?! (Which would be an understandable choice!)

Absolutely fair point.

I guess if the stats create options, go for the unis which are known to be more represented in more senior ranks?

Maybe things will change.

Very sorry to read about your DS.

Thank you

1. I help students apply for medicine because I believe it's a great profession

2. I can see the massive issues being caused to doctors post foundation training which have got much much worse this year with training positions non existent. And pay at a ridiculous all time low. £15.53 an hour is a fact for F1.

What is so hard to understand? If you want to be helpful stop talking about your DS and his friends and be helpful.

The problem with year 2 is if you get rejected you will either need to take yet another year to apply for a different subject or go in via clearing which would not be such a considered option.

Gap years I always think of as happening when you have your place so you have a free year. Retaking requires you to be able to go to interviews and possibly more open days so you don’t have the same freedom.

@Sloejelly true, but it can work. Interviews in autumn/early new year, and if offer comes it's unconditional and you can be travelling by Feb, having 6 months doing stuff or earning money. If it's doable, it can be a fantastic year.