How to choose 2nd language in MFL degree

[InDIYHell]

DD was looking at a joint German & history degree (people were very helpful on another thread).
Having looked at course details she's now thinking of doing just German and adding a second language. Problem is which one?

She did Spanish at GCSE and got a 9, but she fancies trying something different. She thinks Italian (or other Romance language) would be easier to pick up, but is also tempted by Korean - she's following a couple of YouTubers and found it interesting but a lot harder.

She has no idea at all what she wants to do for a career,

Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions please?

Remember that an MFL degree is only partly about language and is usually also about literature, society, culture, so choose a language for a place she's interested in all that for.

Is she interested in learning about Spain/Latin America or Korea more?
Can she envisage herself living or working in one particular place in future? How would she feel about spending half or all of her year abroad in Korea vs Spain?

I asked how she felt about going all the way to Korea and she said it would be exciting!

She is interested in the culture of the countries as well but doesn't have any real experience to draw on outside of Europe. Whereas she already knows quite a bit re. germany from her History A level (plus we've visited).

She doesn't think she wants a gap year either so will probably leave it to the last minute to submit her UCAS application.

Maybe she could try a bit on Duolingo and see how she likes the language before deciding?

@InDIYHell some unis don't require you to choose you languages until you get there - or even towards the end of your first year. So it would be possible to apply for a 'Modern Languages' degree and then choose a second language and in some cases a third as well. Bristol, Newcastle and Durham I believe take this approach so worth her looking around.

Ummm… stab wildly at one that seems somehow complementary, and hope for the best, in our last-minute DC’s case.

Luckily the hunch was right, and the second language and culture possibly a better ‘fit’ than the A level one. (Glad it wasn’t Russian in current circumstances.)

I suspect the number of universities that offer Korean here in the U.K. may be slightly limiting, particularly the combination with German? I think I would start by researching whether it’s even possible. Or research which universities appeal to her and seeing which language combinations are offered by their MFL departments. It’s not always as flexible as you might think. Whereas the German/History would be more straightforward in many institutions.

If she has no idea what she wants to do I'd go for a language that will enable her to go into MFL teaching if she needs to at some point. So French or Spanish. That keeps a door open for her. After all, MFL doesn't lead on to anything in particular.

If she's looking for something different, I would choose German and Russian.

Yes, Russian.

My ds is in his second year at Birmingham doing German and Japanese - I think more unis do Japanese than Korean. Briefly after GCSEs he thought he wanted to do German and History but from start of Y12 onwards he very much knew he wanted to do a MFL degree. I'd try to go to lots of open days this summer and see what takes her fancy with the other languages. He was, for a fleeting moment, tempted by German and Russian at Bristol, partly because he loved Bristol and at that point they didn't do Japanese, but only for a very fleeting moment because he is far more interested in Japan than Russia.

He spent quite a lot of time googling different language choices and seeing which unis came up - for him German and Japanese ab initio gave him Warwick, Birmingham, Newcastle, Cardiff and Manchester and he got ABB offers from all of them apart from Warwick who offered him BBB and Cardiff who offered him ABB or BBB if he put them first.

Just so she knows, most unis have people spend longer in your third year in your ab initio language country than you do in the language you already know, so my ds will be in Germany from October to December, but in Japan from January to September in his third year and that seems to be fairly standard rather than a 50/50 split. After all you have to be at degree standard in a language you only started a couple of years before. Also it's worth asking at open days whether you go to universities in your third year. My niece did Sociology and Spanish and worked in Madrid, rather than going to a university. Ds is going to universities in Germany and Japan and hoping to go to a German uni that does Japanese so he can carry on doing Japanese, but in German, which as a non-linguist myself, I think will totally fry his brain but he seems happy!

I hope that helps a bit - I know it's not quite the same language but it might give you an idea of a path and how to find the ab initio language.

Neerdoneerdo - MFL has a very good graduate employment rate by the way. It's one of the higher employment rates for degrees because lots of companies like the discipline of MFL courses, quite apart from the companies that are looking for language skills. Also despite the fact that it's a commonly held MN belief that there is no point in doing German, it's one of the most looked for languages - probably because everyone on MN thinks no one should do it so they are low in numbers and in high demand grin.

My DS is hoping to study Spanish, with Russian ab initio - and maybe another language too depending on where he ends up; one or two universities offer this as a possibility. It might be worth her thinking which universities appeal to her, and then seeing what the options are, as not every combination is possible everywhere. I suppose what I'm saying is, particular combinations might limit where she applies. In our case, it was a useful narrowing-down exercise!

I agree with @Neerdoneerdo . DD1's boyfriend studied MML at Cambridge and did German & Latin. He's now teaching but couldn't do his PGCE at Cambridge as they needed French or Spanish.

DD2 spent a term (was meant to be a year but curtailed due to Covid restrictions) in Japan. She found it amazing and her university has supported her in carrying on her Japanese, even though she's studying sciences. South Korea and Japan are highly industrialised nations and with German too, your DD could be a very valuable employee.

Thank you everyone for your thoughts! DD has been looking at uni and language options and making a list with pros and cons. Today she came across Norwegian which she said is very similar to German and thinks would be relatively easy to pick up! She discounted Arabic as too hard.

Her interest in Korean was based on Warwick offering it next year. We haven't had a chance to visit other unis unfortunately so she'll be applying 'blind' (but will go to offer days assuming she gets some). There's almost too much choice and she previously thought she'd prefer a campus uni but Bristol & UCL have some interesting courses so now she's in a pickle! Thinking Warwick, Exeter, Lancaster etc. No idea where would be a good back up but I was wondering if she'd have a reasonable chance in clearing if a levels don't go to plan? Currently predicted AstarAstarB. Might be able to get the B up to an A before submission as worried it might impact her offers for the best unis?

It's good to hear that MFL grads are well thought of as she was worried where it would lead her. We've just said to follow her 'passion' (but reading threads here not to use that word on personal statements 🤣). Particularly as her B prediction is a STEM subject that she only took because she thought she should.....

I've learnt so much from MN so thank you again for you comments as they've all helped.

@InDIYHell - check the requirements for Lancaster; I've got a feeling they require 2 language A levels, which ruled it out for DS - but may not be a problem for you. Exeter, the other hand, looks very flexible - lots of different pathways and combinations.

DD did MFL at York - St Andrews also has a good reputation but DD rejected it as she felt it was too remote. We are a trilingual family and DD added more languages whilst at Uni. She is now working for the EU and has recently completed a post grad qualification as a conference translator

I have two degrees in German. Nowadays I would suggest your daughter considers something complementary such as a business degree, which will offer her many more options in life. She can always learn another language on the side if she's interested.

Check the year abroad details for Exeter - DD was applying for IR and a language and wanted to do Arabic ab initio as well, but was put off by the requirement iirc to do the whole year abroad in an arabic-speaking country, rather than half and half with her post-A level one. This was four years ago, though.

All I would say is:
-going with gut instinct is fine when choosing between two (or more) good options
-I think there could be merit in choosing two languages with wide differences
-The culture aspect is important too

DD1 is doing a joint honours degree in German and Russian - German is her post-A level language and she started Russian from scratch. She found Russian extremely hard in her first year, and is still struggling to get her head around pronunication and aspect in particular, but is making good progress. Friends at uni who are studying two more similar languages (French & Spanish; Spanish and Italian) are having a much easier time and a lower workload, but she doesn't regret her choice and knows that the 'breakthrough' moment when it all starts to click into place will come.

Stating the obvious, but students will spend a huge amount of time on any language they study ab initio, so it's worth doing as much research as possible before making their choice to see if it's the right one for them. Look carefully at the course structure to see how many hours contact time are involved, and how those hours are structured. Look at the balance of language modules vs literature, culture, history, politics etc. Also look at the year abroad options - most joint-honours courses with an ab initio language require students to spend more of the year in the ab initio country, for obvious reasons.

I was in her position 30 years ago. I chose Italian- on a whim really as I had never been but it sounded nice. Ended up moving to Italy permanently after graduation! Be careful what you choose- and Korea is a long way away....😉

Eat in mind that years abroad to support Russian are rather tricky at the moment

AAB is a fairly standard ML offer so if she's AAB she'll be fine. Bristol, for example, is ABB - www.bristol.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/2023/modern-languages/ba-modern-languages/

The universities are desperate for language students and offers reflect that. As I said up thread, my ds was offered BBB for Warwick for example.

It's irritating when MN decides to change the carefully typed A, A, B into an A and a bold A....

And it has done it again.... Astar, Astar, B...

😂