Which universities don’t read personal statements?

[User2975976427]

Or does it just depend on the course?

dc is struggling writing hers. It would be good if I could reassure her if a couple of her choices dont use them!

I don’t think that’s fair to say that a committee has written it! My dc are / were at a grammar school and wrote their PS entirely themselves - after they were written they were read by a teacher - dd had a suggestion to amend one but as it wasn’t clear and that was it. I’ve not read it. So hardly a committee. I don’t know any dc who are not writing their ps.

Queens uses exam grades.

My answer would be to randomise/have a lottery or directly ask for things that you want to discriminate on. So ask about readings ask about work experience

Its not clear to me that the social benefits of spending all this time trying to get the right students exceed the social costs (to diversity and mobility)

she's just a perfectionist and getting herself into a state about it.

ahhhh, this is the problem. “Perfectionism” is a wonderfully virtuous excuse for procrastination!

Get her to brainstorm- bullet points about what she loves about history - what drives her to want to study the for 3 years. Not the expected stuff or what she thinks we want to read, but what drives her. Not how good she is etc etc, but what really interests her in studying history.

Get her to think as widely and laterally as possible.

Maybe try setting a timer - how many bullet points or sentences or points can she get onto paper in 20 minutes.

Then when she has an idea of what she wants to say, she can start to craft a couple of paragraphs.

But first drafts are ALWAYS rubbish. That’s why we edit. She can edit bad writing; but she can’t edit a blank page.

DS is mid application. He spent a lot of time on his PS. However it’s all supra curricular stuff and not extra curricular. He mentioned historical places he’d visited and books he’d read (not about course) such as biographies of Hilary Clinton and Obama.

He mentioned historical places he’d visited and books he’d read (not about course) such as biographies of Hilary Clinton and Obama.

Further to my advice to @User2975976427 I'd say to your DS @Radiatorvalves - just mentioning those things means very little. What has he learnt from them? How have they influenced or framed or changed his approach to the study of history?

That's what we want to know.

Really really standard at all the schools I have taught in BUT most of those schools are in areas where we had students applying who were the first in their families, or who wouldn't necessarily have parents with the experience to help and support.

I'm sort of surprised at an indie doing nothing, but perhaps they assume parents have the skills and ability to help? Although equally parents who didn't go to uni in the UK may not be familiar with a UK PS?

All schools are obviously a bit different but usually the tutor or someone similar will run a session with general advice on how to write a PS, and perhaps some support sessions will be run for those who are struggling. And then usually subject teachers will give feedback and make suggestions, and the PS will be checked for a final time for coherence etc before the PS is sent off.

WRT how unis use the PS:

My understanding is that a lot of unis use the PS as a sort of basic filter- if it's really badly written (not as in a few typos, but really poor grammar, very difficult to follow, or the applicant writes something truly bizarre or shocking or offensive) then it can be used to filter applicants out at an early stage.

Some for some courses will also filter out applicants who are clearly applying for a wide range of courses or very different courses and this is usually obvious from the PS.

Some unis will then use the PS to decide between similar "borderline" applicants when deciding who to offer to.

Some unis use the PS as part of their selection process as standard, and they'll usually have additional advice on their website about what they want to see.

Some unis will use the PS on results day, to decide between applicants who have missed their offers if they have say 10 places left and 20 people who got the same grades.

Some unis will use the PS if applicants apply via clearing, as well.

I don't think there are many (any?) unis that openly state they never read the PS, because they may want to use it in certain circumstances. But some definitely put more weight on it than others. Those that value it a lot will usually mention it in their admissions requirements or on their websites somewhere. Courses that interview obviously put less weight on it.

OP- To get your daughter started, could she just write a paragraph on why she wants to study history? Tell her not to worry about extra curriculars or reading or anything else for now- just get the basics of why she wants to study history on paper. I find with perfectionists, once they've written something, it's easier to keep going!

But if she's finding that genuinely difficult, are you sure history is the right choice? I'm not saying it in terms of academic capability- but if she can't articulate why she wants to study the subject, then is she sure it's the right choice for her? Sometimes people struggle to write the PS because actually, subconsciously, they'd rather be applying for something else!

Plymouth read mine both times!

Thanks @WindyHedges he has of course done that - He’s lucky and has had plenty of advice from school. The difference for me (thinking back 30 odd years) was the lack of interest in extra curricular. I hadn’t heard of Supra until very recently.

The difference for me (thinking back 30 odd years) was the lack of interest in extra curricular.

An admissions tutor at a well-known university told me directly that he 'couldn't give a toss what students do in their spare time'. I've heard similar if less forthright opinion from several others. They no longer seem interested in music/sport/DofE etc.

If the applicant can show how extra-curricular activities feed into their studies, then they should tell us about that. But we are also aware that extra-curricular activities are not available to all applicants. They are often a only available to affluent families and those in fee paying schools. So on grounds of equal opportunity we have to see extra-curriculars as largely extraneous to the applicant’s demonstration of potential for university studies.

Sometimes people struggle to write the PS because actually, subconsciously, they'd rather be applying for something else!

I think a very high proportion of applicants choose the subject they are best at / enjoy the most at school. They don’t have a particular “passion” (dread word) for it. They just know they want/need to get a degree, not really sure of career direction so choose something they can make a fist of. So the PS is often going to be something of a fiction (eg might refer to books that have not been thoroughly read) in the knowledge that many (most?!) will not be examined that closely if the applicant has the required predicted grades.

In my view it’s a bit of a game that favours those whose teachers and/or parents can help
in honing, editing and endlessly rewriting the PS and discriminates against those with less help from teachers and/or parents who have no knowledge or experience of university

My DD is looking at history next year at s very different set of unis, she is on her 4th draft of personal statement, ironically her tutor is her history teacher and is coaching her as to what to put.

Whether they read it or nor is a different matter but I tell her she’ll get a course somewhere if not her choices, most universities seem to offer history if not at offef stage or clearing.

Love this - a bit of reality. 🙂

It may be for some, but not for all.

For some courses the PS is critically important. Over 10 qualified applicants per place for LSE economics, with the finer decisions decided largely on the PS. Ditto UCL and Warwick.

These are bright kids who have probably always achieved academically. They will have read up on the different courses and have de3cidede where they want to go. Then they have to write four paras which will determine whether they get what they want.

I completely understand why some end up staring at a blank sheet of paper.

(The trick obviously is to work on structure and what you want to include, then write something, anything. The edit, and edit and edit.)

I think I would end up staring at a piece of paper because it is such a bullshit activity. I just don't know why we reward people who are good at this sort of thing. It's so narrow.

Maybe we should stop kidding ourselves. Most people's abilities just don't vary that much and we could assign places via ballot in the event of an academic tie.

From your list my DD's offer from Lancaster mentioned two things from her PS. One regarding a module where she expressed an interest in and the other relating to an extra curricular activity. We were both very impressed with the marketing and thought that pastoral care would be good at Lancaster.

My DD is at Exeter.

Been editing all week and still editing this weekend in our house😏