Completely unaffordable to do a masters

[sergeantmajor]

DS wants to become an economist. It seems he would need a masters (which he'd love to do) to pursue this line of work. He is in his final year of his Economics BSc, doing very well. I just can't believe that tuition fees alone are c.£25k for one year, while the government loan is c.£11k. He seems to be priced out before he's even begun.

There don't appear to be any scholarships for a masters in this subject. We saw one job ad that mentioned sponsoring their trainees for a masters which would be a dream come true, but only one.

He has some savings from bar work but this doesn't come close to enough. Our own income has taken a massive hit this year, so we can't close the gap.

Is there something that I'm missing???

It was a master of science, so yes it was a STEM subject.

MSc doesn't automatically mean STEM - lots of management masters courses are MScs, but management isn't STEM.

And Economics of course is not a STEM!

So if he's so passionate, he does what the rest of us did... he gets a job and self- funds, and puts in the work over and above ... because that's what it has always taken. Sorry, but postgraduate qualifications require more than "I want", and always have. That's from someone with two masters and a PhD. If he is exceptional, then universities would be chasing him. They aren't. And exceptional that days is beyond "really clever". Becoming "an economist" isn't a career path. It requires application. It's the application of the study that he needs to look at.

Well it looks like I have got on your nerves @Quveas. But as I mention in the post that you quote, DS has worked and saved for years. There is still a shortfall.

Yes, it is an "I want" scenario (is that bad?) but it is only funding that is standing in his way, which is why this thread has been so helpful to me in finding out what funding options do, or mostly don't, exist.

I did not call DS "exceptional" or "really clever", did I? I said "suitable". Becoming an economist is indeed a career path. He has worked for economists in the summer breaks and I don't think he imagined them.

You are entirely misinterpreting what I'm saying. It didn't matter what I wanted. I had to work AND study at the same time. This had long time been the way. And I did not say that you said he was exceptional or really clever - nor did I say the opposite. I said that if he had something exceptional to offer then someone would be snatching of his hand to study with them. I wouldn't be arrogant enough to say that I'm exceptional, but I did have a place offered for my PhD. But even with that I couldn't afford to take the offer - I continued working and studied part- time. This is how it is. So "I want" is irrelevant. You can want whatever you like, but that didn't mean someone wants to give it to you. And splitting hairs may be fun for you, but it still won't get you what you want. His likely most realistic option is to get a job and study part-time. That takes discipline and sacrifice. But if you want it bad enough that is what you will do. It is what the majority of postgraduates do. And if that isn't a tenable option then that's the choice you make. Nobody gets everything they want.

Quveas. Did you read the earlier posts?

Op is asking about Economics Masters in a select number of Universities. These are more like professional qualifications for economists. Akin to a law conversation. There is not time to work other than a certain amount of TA or RA work. (The University were crying out for Masters students to apply.)

Its a summer school and then very hard work till the end of the academic year. No Christmas, nor Easter. Just hard work. DS had it easier as he had taken his UG degree (Econometrics) at the same University so his course flowed logically. Other had to make up gaps, and found the first term very tough. S did 10 hours a day seven days every week. On top of studying he was applying for jobs and PhDs and RA work. The exams after Christmas were important as they were used for applications. There was no slacking - you had to hit the ground running.

Its fine saying that others at different Universities tasking different courses are able to self fund by working part time. It really is not advised on one of these courses, in the same way as I assume it is not advised on a law conversion course.

Oddly the UK PhD he was offered came with a surprisingly good tax-free stipend and quite a lot of guaranteed paid teaching work. It means he was as well off as many of his working peers. Again different from your experience.

Same experience here @Needmoresleep, although this was a STEM subject rather than economics. DD2 started her Masters thinking she might be able to work part-time, as she had through her undergrad. No chance. She told me and DH about 3 weeks into her course that she couldn't work as she needed to study – evenings were often taken up with lectures, weekends with catching up on lab notes, reading papers and books around her subject and frequently discussions with her tutor about the following week's research. She might have got a pass if she'd carried on doing some paid work but she was determined to get a distinction, and did, but it required her full focus. It was for 12 months too so no summer break – which is partly why she is about to take some time out travelling before applying for PhDs.

Titchy, mine was a STEM.

Yeah I'm financially comfortable. I'd have taken the loan regardless. In fact, I did. Postgraduate loans aren't means tested.

It wasn't a mickey mouse master's.

Still, nobody has EVER been interested in it. They wanted to know my UG classification.

I'm in a job which I'm oddly more qualified for than my superiors because they did a more specific DIPLOMA.

Do a master's if you want to pursue academia or you really want a nice, impressive framed certificate on your wall.

If your son is exceptional and really clever then it's absolutely OK to say so.

I know my apostrophes are all over the place. I've had a few wines.

I'm not exceptionally clever, in fact, in many ways I'm the opposite. However, I can write a cracking essay.

I'm a massive imposter 😆😆

DS is also in his final year of an economics degree. He has been applying for grad jobs alongside researching master's courses. (The advice of his uni tutor was to apply for Master's now and worry about funding later.) He was recently offered a grad job which includes the opportunity to study for a relevant Master's degree after two years. This is probably the best route for DS given the cost of post grad degrees.

I work in a field where technically I've got way higher qualifications than those up to two bands above me, who are more knowledgeable and earn way more than me.

They don't necessarily have a degree, let alone postgraduate.

That's very interesting @ofteninaspin and congrats to your DS! I've heard that just 5% of Warwick and LSE Econ masters students are UK nationals, which could be for all sorts of reasons, but I feel one reason may be because home students find it financially challenging.

I think the figures for London are always slightly skewed @sergeantmajor because foreign students want to be in London. My DD did her STEM Masters at a London school (not LSE) and the majority of her cohort were from Europe. She saw this as a plus as it made it really interesting with students coming from different backgrounds and having different perspectives. And the fact that they were paying a lot meant they took it really seriously and wanted to do well.

Further education is also about your own individual advancement and self growth. It’s not solely about recouping from increasing future income. I have both a Masters and PhD, funded by loans and hard work. If it was just just about financial advancement, which obviously can never be guaranteed, then I’m not sure anyone would do it. Your DS needs do decide what’s important to him, and it may be that now is not the right time. It’s never too late