Research tools for Uni/Course

[Sonnex]

What is the best way/resource to research all UK unis where my DC could study Business and then narrow down via entrance requirements/predicted grades please?

We have access to unifrog but bit overwhelmed with how to start finding the ones he could apply to.

@Sonnex
Where did you go in Bristol??? I think that’s quite dismissive of every city and I do think he’s a bit narrow minded. It’s the university going to. Central boozy areas might be a bit off in every city but Bristol isn’t bad in the university area. It’s a fantastic place to be a student. Many ex polys are in cities too! He simply won’t escape this element in Nottingham, Southampton etc.

You are looking at a big difference between Solent and Bristol too. He doesn’t have the A levels for Bristol or Bath I would have thought. Lancaster should be on his list and where he goes will make a difference to employment. RG still mostly confers an advantage.

For a complete change of pace has he looked at Exeter Penryn campus based in Falmouth?

For a Business degree? The location limits opportunities for exposure to employers and work-based learning opportunities. Although it does offer the chance to get a highly rated Russell Group university degree at a lower standard, I suppose ...

I agree about Lancaster - fantastic university in a gorgeous tiny city. Research-led, but not a particularly high ask for A Level grades. It's not Russell Group but it's very much a research-led university - it's equivalent to York, but doesn't have a medical school (one of the prices of entry to the RG).

(Lancaster is such a well-kept secret though that I rarely want to sing its praises in case it gets invaded!)

League tables - you need to be aware that the different league tables use different key performance indicators to compile their lists. For example, the Guardian doesn't use REF scores, which I think is a mistake, as you have no way of judging the intellectual stature of the academics actually doing the teaching .

And you need to be aware that the league tables have NO official standing. They are produced by journalists & newspapers, presumably for commercial gain.

but doesn't have a medical school (one of the prices of entry to the RG).

Yes the London School of Economics is renowned for its medical school...

OP,

As a former Russell Group admissions tutor I think you’re getting a lot of good advice here.

That web site you asked about is TheStudentRoom, by students, for current and prospective students. Your DS can ask specific questions there.

I thoroughly agree that he should be thinking more deeply about what he wants. If for any reason he can’t or won’t do that, it may be a sign that he needs a gap year before he is ready to get the most out of HE. Like the other lecturer whose name I unfortunately can’t remember, I know that students who begin uni before they are ready tend not to thrive and that a gap year can make all the difference. None of this contradicts the point made by @tizerorfizz that some applicants do benefit from a parent’s help in thinking things through.

Agree about Lancaster!!

Oh OK! Yes you're right there @titchy But when various research-led universities apply for entry to the RG, one of the things looked at is the establishment of large-scale research investment, and a med school might be a proxy for that ...

Certainly, there was a moment when Lancaster's collaboration with Liverpool on their medical training looked like he start of a bid for RG entry (which is how Exeter did it).

He's not applying to Bristol or Bath or Exater or any of the RG in fact as they all want AAA and he's only predicted ABB (and hates Bristol :) ). These were just places we looked at on open days earlier in the year to get a feel for the range of unis out there and range of entrance requirements. We often holiday in Falmouth and I have to say it looks like a really chilled place to go to Uni :) - I don't think there's a suitable course really though.

One thing that puzzles me. If the school's predicted grades are ABB, does that mean applying to anywhere that states AAB is a completely wasted slot? Or do the unis recognise that some people do better than predicted (as well as some worse) and so might give him an offer of AAB 'in case' he gets that based on their numbers, his PS etc.? Or do you have to stick rigidly to predictions? (Which are conservative I think due to the precited grades hoo ha)

My DS is looking at doing business too. We haven't found many unis with an ABB offer. Definitely Lancaster is worth a look as others have said. (My other DS is there now and loves it). Lancaster and Leicester are ABB. Most others seem to be AAB or higher other than the ex-polys.

They weren't - high research rank and a few million £ was what they were after....

If school are predicting ABB he should definitely apply to one or two AAB - the strong likelihood is that he'd get offers. Exeter offers AAB - ABB for business at the Cornwall campus, as does Cardiff. So he really shouldn't automatically rule out RG. He'd be more than likely to be accepted if he applied!

In no particular order: Surrey, Sussex, Swansea, Reading, University of East Anglia, Nottingham Trent, Oxford Brookes, Bournemouth, Lancaster, Kent, Northumbria, Sheffield Hallam: some of these are very low offers on UCAS points! He could even try Sheffield at AAB. Cardiff is within reach too.

Again, with my admission tutor’s hat on, I think the question of applying to AAB places takes some analysis. The reason is that your DS did not sit GCSE’s. How accurate do you think the predictions are?

Universities are very crowded right now and many are running at a loss. The idea that they will continue to overcrowd next year may be simplistic. If your DS gets an AAB offer, what then? He should not rely on being accepted if he doesn’t make it.

I always think students need a safe insurance choice and define safe to mean one grade lower than their PGs. If your DS accepts an AAB offer, he will either be letiing go of offers at the level of his PGs or using an offer at the level of his PGs(no room to spare) as his insurance. I would never try to prescribe for anyone but I do urge you to think this through.

BTW Leicester is famous for student support throughout the university and I know a couple of students, children of friends and colleagues, who have had wonderful experiences at Sheffield Hallam. RG and tariff points aren’t everything, says the RG STEM academic.

PS. My last remark came out wrong. What I meant is that I honestly think the RG is an outmoded artifact. Another point in Lancaster’s overall favour as a university, for example, is how well it did in the recent REF
(Research Exercise Framework). Others, also.

UEA?

www.uea.ac.uk/search?query=Business&facet=course&primaryFilter=&secondaryFilter=&yearFilter=2023&departmentFilter=&organisationFilter=&tagsFilter=&firstStartTimeFilter=&lastEndTimeFilter=&facultyFilter=&page=1

Thanks all, really interesting. I think his predictions are pretty accurate as they are based on 2 lots of AS paper mocks that they sat in June and very begininng of this term as well as course work, internal assessments etc. However, I have to say, they are lower than what the year above actually got in their A levels this summer eg one of the subjects he is being predicted B for, nobody got lower than an A etc - so I don't know. My gut is that he will get ABB or AAB if he puts the work in. His third subject he has reached his limit with a B I feel. He has already revised Y1 pretty well by doing the (voluntary) mocks on the first day of term which I think will be useful for him in hitting the ground running for Y2, hopefully.

Neither he, nor I, really care that he is effectively barred from RGs now - and I say that as someone with 2 degrees from two consistent top 10 RGs. As other PP with far more direct knowledge than I have have said, he and I are very aware that universities are struggling and that there is a backlog of covid students, its a bulge year for 18 year olds etc. etc. so it's a tough old time to apply to university. I also understand that the RG framework is long in the tooth now and there are other factors to consider. I work for a successful company with high graduate salaries that interviews people with 2:1s + - they genuinely don't care what institution. So it is not the be all and end all that it used to be, for me. But equally, I want him to maximise the quality of the degree he can get for his situation.

Lancaster is AAB annoyingly if you want a placement year, which he is very keen on. ABB otherwise. What is the advice in that situation?

Neither he, nor I, really care that he is effectively barred from RGs now - and I say that as someone with 2 degrees from two consistent top 10 RGs.

He isn't though

Lancaster is AAB annoyingly if you want a placement year, which he is very keen on. ABB otherwise. What is the advice in that situation?

If offered take the ABB place, then assuming grades are good (usually 2:1+ range) switch to the placement year course. Those sorts of switches are usually straightforward, though note he'd have no recourse to the extra year of funding.

Thankyou, that's really helpful. So apply for the ABB non placement year?

What are the implications of the extra funding year? What does that mean in practice? No maintenance loan while.on placement?

Hi again, OP -

Pupils and students exceed expectations all the time. We from afar have no reason to think your DS would not be one of them. Nothing I said was meant to imply that.

But AL grades this year were moderated to fall about half way between achieved 2019 normed grades and 2021 teacher assessed results. As far as we know, that won’t be happening for the cohort of your DS.

I agree with you completely that in the current climate a 2.1 is much more important than its pedigree. One is most likely to attain that where one is happy and able to thrive

All students are entitled to funding for the length of their course (ie the one they started on) plus one year (in case they want to restart the first year elsewhere, or repeat a year). Switching to a placement year would use up this extra one year so he'd be fully funded for it (well as fully funded as placement years are - they get less), but if he then for example needed to repeat his final year, he wouldn't have any wiggle room (although if he repeated due to medical issues SLC do have discretion to fund).

OP I am going to PM you if I may as have some advice that’s a bit outing!

Wow, thank you all for your input, it's been so helpful and illuminating. I am actually astounded that we are expecting 17y olds to see all the nuances themselves so I am glad that he is listening to my input. I feel bad for kids that don't have any parental guidance, I didn't and I would have made a right hash of all this firm, insurance etc. I think he is realising that if he really wants to go to University next September, which he is adamant that he does, it's not going to be an easy ride and so he is rapidly becoming more flexible about locations! Big cities have been ruled back in! (but not Bristol ;) )

"But AL grades this year were moderated to fall about half way between achieved 2019 normed grades and 2021 teacher assessed results. As far as we know, that won’t be happening for the cohort of your DS".

Good, is all I can say to this. I am absolutely sick of all the gaming of the system that has gone on since Covid, as a parent, though I understand it is not the fault of any of the universities themselves. I am absolutely sick of hearing about such and suches daughter that got into a uni with 3 As in subjects they clearly know little about, but are now struggling on courses that are too rigorous for them. I feel equally sorry for the kids who got top marks, A* and As, and were always going to but were still made to feel like failures because the unis couldn't tell if they were inflated or not or were too full or whatever. it's all a mess created by adults and I am sick of hearing about how badly it is affecting our 17/18/19/20 year olds in this country. The sooner it gets back to properly moderated and standardised public exams where an A or a B or a C has actual meaning in terms of grasp of a subject, knowledge of what's on the specification etc. the better! (I naively thought this was always the case ...)

Can I also mention the spectre of accommodation which has been a nightmare for lots (including us though fortunately finally solved) this year. We were unlucky and got caught up even with a firm choice but insurance choices can be much edgier in terms of accommodation options so do check that out too!

For anyone concerned - Lancaster does have a medical school.

I would agree regarding accommodation. It’s short at many places. Although not in some I heard today. So I would try and get offers from ABB universities which he can actually nail. Unless a university makes it clear they have accommodation for all first years.