Accounting and finance personal statement

[halohell]

Can anyone with experience of accounting and finance uni applications suggest some things my dc (between Y12 and Y13) could be doing (a) to learn more about accounting as a career and (b) for the UCAS personal statement. School haven't been very helpful. Obviously it's too late to get work experience over the summer, but I'm wondering about books, videos, online courses or anything else? Thanks.

My DS chose accounting and finance as a) he obviously wants to work in that sector, b) a maths degree would require further maths, c) economics at a good uni needs either further maths or an A Star in maths & d) history was his least favourite a-level! So it's all very well other people advising to do another academic degree but if like my DS, your DS doesn't want to do a history degree, there really aren't many options in my opinion.

I am a Chartered Accountant (ACA), qualified in 2006 after 3 years at my top 10 firm. I would agree with everyone who says not to do A&F degree as a precursor to an accounting qualification.

I had completed a Physics degree, and in my cohort, people had degrees in Geography, English, Maths, Law, Physics, PPE and a couple had done A&F degrees. When you start at your firm, everyone starts from the same base, they assume you know nothing about accounting. From memory the few who had done A&F degrees got a couple of exemptions, and spent most of our study time chatting, as they had covered some of the material previously.

Being under a training contract is not like having a normal job. The majority of grads in his peer group will have finished uni in the previous 1-2 years, and you have a lot of study time off. It's like being at a second uni! Obviously my experience was pre-Covid, however us grads used to be out Wednesday-Friday night every week, and had lots of weeks where we only went to college. E.g. I started in the September of one year, and until the January 4 months later, had only spent a week in the office, hadn't met any clients yet, but had studied for, and passed 2 exams. Accounting is a great foundation qualification for going into any kind of business, and I still love it almost 20 years after I started.

Thanks for all the recent posts. It's not been what I expected, with so many querying the A&F degree, but that info is good to know. DS says he will think about alternatives, but as some pps have said, he is limited because he doesn't have further maths, so would probably get into a lower ranking uni for that, which might not be the best option for graduate jobs? I think he'd struggle with motivation for history or economics at degree level, so surely that's going against the idea of doing something he'd enjoy. I'm not sure what else he could do, and I'm worried I've not really helped him by posting - I think he might have been happier just getting on with applying for accounting and finance. He is adamant that he wants to go to uni, not an apprenticeship route.

Regarding all the other advice on here, he's now had a reply from a local accountancy firm who say he can go in for a day next week, and a friend's dh who is an accountant working for the civil service is going to have a chat with him, so that will also be useful I hope.

Sounds like some useful background for his personal statement.
re studying accounting and finance my ds studied this degree at Warwick and had I think 6 exemptions from chartered accountancy examinations. One of the advantages of his degree was he secured two internships (summer year one and summer year two) and I doubt he would have without some accounting knowledge.

OP, I would really be challenging your son on why he wants to go to uni. A degree is supposed to be for the love of a subject, and while I get he wants “the uni experience”, at c.£50k over the 3 years that’s a very expensive party! Just a thought.

Also to note many firms don’t offer the exemptions any more now that the routes are mostly apprenticeship structure (even the grad schemes).

He is adamant that he wants to go to uni, not an apprenticeship route.

But is it really worth spending over £30K on a degree that may not even be required to become a chartered accountant?

And doesn't it depend on which Uni he goes to?

@halohell
Just had a sudden thought. Has he looked at management degrees? Bath are brilliant for these and it’s enabled DC we know to get to a broad spectrum of jobs. DC can change their minds re careers whilst at university which can make accounting look narrow. Management is broader and he’s certainly qualified to look at these. Bath, for example, has placements which increase the degree to 4 years, but grads can be taken on by the placement firms. DD has two friends that did Management at Bath and both now work for EY. The beauty is you are not pigeonholed into a career that’s difficult to move away from. With only 3500 young people going into apprenticeships, employers obviously do take grads! It’s a blend. And why shouldn’t he look forward to university?

Therefore, I do fully understand what your DS wants and of course university is a good bet - at the right one! It’s worth bearing in mind, in 2021, only 3500 18 year olds got degree apprenticeships. For the best ones, the competition is fierce. So of course a degree is worth doing but be choosy. Yes, he should earn enough to pay off the loan as a grad (do it quickly!) but he is making a valid decision about university and a broader degree will give him plenty of options, eg converting to law, doing HR, marketing, finance - all sorts of business functions. It’s quite possible he might really like other business and management functions as opposed to accountancy and finance. Just a thought…….

Thanks @TizerorFizz I will suggest he looks at management.

Have a look at Warwick, Exeter, Nottingham and Bristol. The latter two might not be quite so high up the league tables for this subject but often DC who go to these are highly motivated to do well regarding getting a job.

I'd have thought a management degree falls into a similar category as A&F but other accountants may have a different view.

I did a geography degree which, in the main, had no relevance to studying for my ACA. But I still wouldn't have missed out university to go straight into accountancy, it was a brilliant experience. I also wouldn't have managed to get the same role in corporate finance post qualification as a non-grad. In fact, I can't think of a single person in our department who hadn't been to university.

It can be tough picking a degree when your A levels don't line up perfectly for certain subjects. My younger son will have a similar challenge.

Another Chartered Accountant (ex Big 4) here. I did Economics at Warwick without even Maths A Level (it was really hard!).I'd also echo not doing A&F as a degree - it's quite a dry subject and I think hugely frustrating when he then started work and would feel like he was going over old ground. Also, what if he gets partway through his second year and realises it's not for him as a career?

At Warwick, there were all sorts of Business/Maths/Economics degrees, and I'm sure it would be similar at many other Unis. Friends of mine at Uni also did MORSE, ManSci, Econ History, Maths with Stats - just off the top of my head. And my cohort when I started my Accounting qualification - History, Classics, English, Natural Sciences, various Business degrees etc etc.

I'd be spending some time doing some more in depth research into the variety of Uni courses available - it doesn't need to be straight Maths, Economics or History!

Business and Management degrees are not the same as Accounting and Finance degrees. They are wider ranging and have broader employment opportunities. Just a quick look at Bath’s courses would tell
you that. I’ve no doubt grads can choose modules that suit their future career choices but that doesn’t have to be accountancy. But it could be. These courses at top universities are very sought after and so are the grads.

DD who I mentioned down thread is doing MORSE at Lancaster. No further maths A level or economics (A* in maths though). She really enjoys the variety and has a PwC grad scheme offer for next year.

I disagree with nearly everyone / most on this thread, particularly some posters who seem to have strong views.

If you are all interested in any of this, then you probably have enough have enough 'nonce' to have already considered most options. Most know you don't need to do an Accounting degree. If you have another interest, love your A'level do that degree. But if you really want to do Accounting, fine. If you want to and finally mange to get on a linked degree, great. Apprenticeships with EY, BDO also a fab option. Or apprenticeships in business.

So many options. Please don't berate someone who has considered every avenue and finally decided on which one they want to pursue.

Back to OP. I'd chase a days experience at every local firm. Plus re PS explain what he's done. And where his interest originally came from. How did his interest grow and develop? Is he doing an EPQ? Ds1 linked his PS to his EPQ which looked at capitalism, and peoples love of money.

Back to the original Q, it sounds as though your son has lots to put into his PS. There is absolutely no harm in doing an A&F degree course if that's what he wants to do. At least 20-25% of those doing L7 apprenticeships that I work with have graduated in A&F. There is absolutely nothing wrong with him picking a degree course he wants to do. If it was that dire universities like Bath, Durham, LSE and Southampton wouldn't offer it.

Is he doing an EPQ? Ds1 linked his PS to his EPQ which looked at capitalism, and peoples love of money.

I agree. My son did an EPQ related to his degree subject. We'd been told to expect three or so Uni offers and he got five. I'm not saying this as a stealth boast but his non-EPQ friends with very good grades weren't as fortunate so I think the EPQ was probably the differentiating factor. Some unis also drop their standard offer for an A star at EPQ.

I will say that the EPQ was quite a long slog, and as much, if not more, about the 'journey'/log than the actual product. If he sticks with A&F, there's lots of interesting angles for an EPQ.

Depends where you live as to which Uni courses he might want to consider.

Like others I recommend, in no particular order :
Southampton, Bath, Exeter, Durham, Bath, Warwick. Plus the PwC linked degrees at Nottingham or Reading.

Haven't RTFT.
DH is an accountant and strongly advises don't do an accountancy degree (as he did years ago). It's so limiting.
When recruiting he tends to lean towards those with good solid degrees in traditional subjects, such maths, history, geography, STEM etc.

Bath has an excellent A&F course, but with enough flexibility to allow students to branch into other optional areas of more general management. They also have a wonderful placements team with a dedicated placements officer for A&F and many leave placement with grad offers already in place. It's a fantastic course :-)

I don’t think an accountancy degree has to be limiting. Dh is a cima fellow and moved from accountancy to general management ( large site in China employing 1000 staff) and then back to finance. Some of his finance colleagues were ex charties, some were cima qualified with engineering degrees and some were accounting and finance graduates.

@AliTheMinx
I was suggesting Bath because if had great courses that are more general than Accounting snd Finance. This means the DS can sample other business disciplines but still become an accountant if he wishes. I would say this gives greater flexibility.

Adults in the workplace have careers that go in all sorts of directions but at 17/18, this is difficult to predict and young people cannot always plan what organisations they will join and what their careers will look like. So I can see the sense in looking broadly at a general degree and filtering out what you don’t want as you go along.