Where to do German and history degree?

[InDIYHell]

I'm trying to help DD and she thinks she has settled on a joint German and history degree (her 2 favourite a levels). Can anyone suggest what unis we should focus on that has a good reputation in both? Thanks!

@DorritLittle
So many languages are in decline. Mandarin has slightly bucked the trend but might reflect Chinese family influence? I’m unsure what numbers study it at university. Some universities don’t care about background of the student. The only people I know with German degrees are half German (mothers) and learnt it from birth! This issue can make other students feel very demoralised.

Most universities seem to state that their Mandarin/ Chinese courses are not open to applicants who are native speakers although I don't know what the position is where someone has more distant family links eg one parent from china but they grew up here.

Taking German opens opportunities and UCL or Edinburgh are very good options to study a combined German and History degree. The standard offer for UCL (BA) is ABB while Edinburgh (MA) now asks for AAB.

UCL has good contacts with Humboldt-Universität in Berlin and Freiburg while Edinburgh has options to do a year abroad in Heidelberg and Vienna.

@JocelynBurnell
It absolutely does! Universities want MFL grads and it makes a lot of sense to make use of the German with a highly competitive subject like History. These grads stand out.

@Thedogisdrivingmemad
As the people I know have German mothers and one mum was a teacher (of German) it’s not checked up. DD was more or less fluent in German before uni. Name doesn’t give anything away as father is British. So how does anyone know? Exactly the same for Mandarin I expect. DD had plenty of duel nationality DC on her MFL course. It’s bums on seats and they do have an advantage.

The only people I know with German degrees are half German (mothers) and learnt it from birth!

But why would they want to study it at Uni if they're already fluent?

Much better to study history/economics/anything and spend a year in Germany as part of their degree..?

DC’s friend is planning on European Studies. I think at Nottingham, (not sure if other places do it too.)

It is a modern language and then history modules related to the relevant country, and you do a year abroad - sounded v interesting, and maybe a bit more focussed than a joint honours language plus history - worth a look?

@pinklavenders
Im assuming you have not done a MFL degree at a top university? They are not just speaking. However some elements are do you get an advantage. If you can read the language but need improvement, have spent holidays in (say) Germany where you are immersed in culture and mum is a teacher why would you not try for Oxbridge or similar? It’s a gimme!! Well not quite but you can add another language for some challenge! My point is that loads of people do this. Any MFL grad will tell you about half French, half German etc people on the degrees. It’s pretty common to do something you are good at. It’s like the children of gifted musicians doing music and not English if they are also high achieving in an instrument. Or the DC of mathematicians having expert help at home - for years. MFL is no different. Of course they want to study what comes naturally to them.

@TizerorFizz yes, I do understand. My dc are bilingual and so did benefit from an 'easy' language A level!

But they had absolutely no interest in studying it at Uni. They're both studying different subjects and one is actually spending this coming year in Germany - so that's often an option for non language students too.

@pinklavenders
That is commendable of your DC but not everyone thinks like that.

And yes, you're so right about lots of fluent bilinguals having 'British' names - as the other parent speaks the 'minority' language.

I have a German and history degree from Uni of Glasgow. Can recommend!

@TizerorFizz you're right it is pretty demoralising to do a languages degree with a native speaker. And it is quite common although understandable. I also had a slight advantage too as my mum was a German teacher and we went there a fair amount. Not as much of an advantage mind!

I must say my strong impression on arrival at uni for my German degree was that everyone spoke it better than I did! Very few were German (only two that I recall) but all seemed to have spent a lot of time there, while I came straight from school and a summer working in a factory. It was Bristol tho so lots of rich folks who had taken a year off after failing to get into Oxford. I imagine it is different now. Hope so anyway.

OP I would advise some research into the proportion of native speakers and how many people take German at all. Joint hons may be a plan here actually.

I don’t see how you can research native speakers. They don’t declare themselves! DD was at Bristol. Long story - but she did get offered a place at Oxford. Never spent more than a week or two anywhere with target languages. She didn’t do a gap year either. She did no languages before age 11.

I wouldn’t really recommend a MFL at a Scottish university. Couldn’t find History snd German at Glasgow but any language degree will be 5 years I think. Unless A level students go to y2 immediately.

Hello @InDIYHell !

For a career, many of us change tack at least once. Our daughter changed degree choice suddenly after Year 12 and career choice following a formal Summer Internship after her first undergraduate year. She is now in a completely different sector and in a different country. Just something to bear in mind.

Nowadays, a good degree class and showing gumption, enterprise, resourcefulness and adaptability in non-academic and vacation activities generally matter more than the university an applicant was at. (My partner sits on selection panels.)

University organised Overseas Placements or Internships? Worth looking carefully at the German Department web pages and also worth emailing someone there. For example, if interested in Marketing, avoid placement as an English Assistant in a school in Germany and look for evidence that the Department places undergraduates in ad agencies and corporate contexts.

TizerorFizz · Today 00:14
I wouldn’t really recommend a MFL at a Scottish university. Couldn’t find History snd German at Glasgow but any language degree will be 5 years I think. Unless A level students go to y2 immediately.

This is not true. Once again @TizerorFizz, you clearly do not know what you are talking about.

MA (Hons) programmes take four years to complete in Scotland, including a full year studying or working abroad in Year 3.

I think Tizerorfizz is correct about Scottish degree length.

I had a few friends who did joint honours language degrees at Glasgow (and St Andrews too), including with German. I’m not sure of exact combinations, I know some of them did MFL with film studies, some English lit, some another language, can’t remember about history.

This wasn’t recent, but they were definitely all 5 years long - I’d be surprised if they’d changed it since then, or if history was somehow different to all the others.

Edinburgh definitely do 4 year joint German and History but I think Glasgow's might be 5 years if you do a full year abroad.

My ds comes from a family where absolutely no one speaks German, I have to say and a lot on his course have it as their ab initio so it's not all German families with already fluent children heading to German courses.

My niece did Spanish & Sociology joint honours at Glasgow and yes, it is a five year course, so worth considering how long you want a degree course to be.

Aberdeen also offers a four year joint history and german (semester abroad rather than full year) but like StA also offer 5 year option too.

St Andrews offers both a 4 year and a 5 year MFL option. I know dd's friend was on the 4 year option but changed to the 5 year. I think (not absolutely sure) that if it's a 4 year then part of the 3rd year is spend abroad but studying at a uni, whereas on the 5th year option it is a year abroad but employed - ie in a school

With languages degrees, it's really beneficial to do 5 years. The difference between those who went away for a whole year and those who went away for a semester was very noticeable when we all came back. If you're going to learn a language, you need to spend time in the country or else it will be very difficult to reach a level of fluency

Most Scottish degrees are 4 years INCLUDING a year abroad in the 3rd year.

Yes that is my understanding too - four years which includes the full year abroad.