A level Choices for DC who is unsure between Engineering or Economics at Uni

[Iamsodone]

Dear all,
Could I please seek A level choice advice for a DC who isn't too sure of what uni course to pursue later on between sciences or Economics ?
DC is put off by Economics A level (edexcel) as it is an essay-based subject.
So preliminary choices are physics/maths/chemistry and one MFL (has to start with 4)
However, we have been told that not choosing Economics may play against us if finally applying for Economics at uni, as it is available at our sixth form.
Our plan (if not taking A level economics) was to go for Economics EPQ and clubs/project to demonstrate interest should the uni Economics' path was ultimately chosen rather than take now half-heartedly a A level in case ...

I think the question applies to other subjects ie not choosing a certain A level but ultimately wanting to do it at Uni, in our case the trade off is with a so-called facilitating subject.

thanks !

@PresentingPercy

It is. However Geography should now come into the equation if a DC wants Civils. Climate change is impacting engineering.

Having worked in environmental / civil engineering I found my geography A level pretty useless (my geology A level was more applicable but something like chemistry or biology would also have been useful). Geography A level would certainly be useful if you were looking at environmental science / geoscience degrees.

As the third subject is not so important, looking at the world via Geography is not a bad thing. It can certainly look at issues that engineers can help solve. It also very much depends what work you do. I do think Geology is useful, but so few schools offer it. Environmental engineering is a big area of work and is not just something you do via Environmental Science.

DS had a similar dilemma when choosing A Levels. To keep his options open, he took Maths, Further Maths, Physics, Economics and Politics. He ended up finding Politics very interesting, dropped Physics after a year and took an EPQ in Economics. He is now reading Land Economy at Cambridge (Law, economics and environment).

I do know that environmental science is different to environmental engineering, given my previous line of work.

I think you might have a misconception of environmental engineering, which tends to deal with emissions control, waste management, EIA, decontamination, water treatment, geohazard mitigation etc - it generally builds on civils or chem eng principles.

Climate change, sustainability etc tends to fall more under the environmental science remit.

DH is FICE, FCIHE, and FIStructE. He has worked extensively with housing developers and others on water mitigation and flooding relief. I am not saying Geography is vital. I am saying it useful if DC is interested in climate. He is not an environmental scientist. SUDS is very much engineering. It is very much in demand. So, yes, in his line of work, I do know what it is.

Good for your DH, but you’ve also pointed out that environmental engineering is proper physical engineering and that maths, chemistry and physics is really the ideal A level combination

And yes I’ve done SUDS, waste management, brownfield remediation, EIA, EMS, flood mitigation, IPPC etc. Geography A level wasn’t a great deal of use for any of that.

I did not say it was. As you need maths and physics, most engineers have some free choice over a third A level. That might be MFL, Geography, Geology, Economics etc. DH did not do Geography either did Engineering A level back in the day) but Geography has its place as a third A level. Of course, as an engineer, it has little place now, because degrees and CPD and interests take over, but the same could be said of MFL, Economics, etc. However no A level in Geography is a waste. Chemistry is not needed because usually an interest is environmental engineering is sparked by Civils. However for environmentally conscious DC's, Geography can be of great interest. It is not a requirement to have Chemistry for Civils.There are few Environmental Engineering degrees.

Chem eng degrees can also be a natural progression into environmental engineering MSc.

Chemistry is actually a pretty good third A level for environmental engineering - I had to get up to speed on that a lot for remediation, projects, waste repository design, emissions reduction design etc. I’d only suggest geography as a 4th A level for anyone wanting to do the less fluffy side of environmental work.

I’m an engineer, I did maths, physics and chemistry (my school didn’t offer further maths). Engineering degrees should meet the accreditation requirements of the engineering professional bodies (IMechE for mechanicals, ICE for civil engineers etc). If doing a BEng you usually have to then do a masters after this to meet the professional requirements of the institutes, or else you go straight for the MEng courses. If you are thinking Cambridge the course is general for the first two years and then you specialise in your second two years by taking more modules in your chosen professional area (civil, electrical, whatever you choose) otherwise the course wouldn’t meet the professional accreditation requirements. This course arrangement was great for me, as I wasn’t initially certain which branch of engineering I wanted to go into, and has been useful in later life working in multidisciplinary engineering teams. Also, many uni courses have some kind of outreach/ student support website, and many indicate which a-levels they accept/ require for which degree courses.

Engineering is an amazing area.. It's so broad. We will always need engineers.

The things that would excite me would be to do with robots, or space exploration.

But it's such a vast area.

Like I say I'm biased though :)

I can't see a uni turning away someone with great grades in maths FM physics chemistry from an economics course? O don't know though.

Also. These subjects are still seen as 'hard'. The most asked question in all my job interviews has been about having a physics degree. Ok it's unusual for a woman. But even so, it's seen as very difficult and those 4 a levels get interpreted as a sign that you are v clever. So there's that.

There are loads of other excellent universities for engineering.

Of course Cambridge has amazing reputation and is great on paper (wow!). But from what I've read it's probably worth looking at others?

What about imperial college?

I went to a university that was sciences and engineering only and it was an amazing experience.

Definitely worth looking around, several of my family are also engineers, one went to Glasgow because he wanted to do Design and Engineering and his course, at the time (don’t know if it still does) had strong links with the Glasgow School of Art.
I only mentioned Cambridge because if someone is uncertain about which specialty they want, general engineering to start with can be good, as you try them all, initially.
Also, if he does go for engineering, look into sandwich courses too, where you spend time in industry as well as at uni.

Engineering is clearly a wide field. Back to my suggestion of the DC reading the course list at Imperial (because they probably offer the widest variety of courses) and deciding what might interest him. Then make sure he picks A levels that leave those options open.

The basic problem is that the DS does not know what he wants to do, but is ruling out some important A level subjects; FM and economics.

NiceGerbil, top economics courses can be incredibly competitive. LSE is probably ten applicants to a place. Not having an essay subject may well be a disadvantage. That said strong maths will be enough to get you into most courses. The irony is that theses courses will probably be more essays less maths, precisely what the DC does not want.

@Needmoresleep thank you for the detailed explanation. We will look at imperial’s yes. And have a chat as to whether the MFL should be scrapped (but that is an enjoyable subject for DC :( )

Think writing will be ok if on a subject of interest
So much easier when you have a target/goal/direction. At least it will be less enjoyable subjects in the context of achieving rathe than taking a subject to keep a door open.
I am really grateful for everyone’s contribution.
DC is now head down in GCSEs as does pire being ‘scrapped’ they will be having continuous weekly tests to provide evidence for teachers grading which doesn’t live much headspace for working out what one wants to do.
Thanks ever so much !