Would you pay for this service

[user1487755366]

I don’t know if this is allowed but I’d like to get a feel for a business idea, I’ve worked in universities (including Russell group) and schools for many years and have informally and formally through the university admissions process- choices, helping them see through the glossy prospective. personal statement advice and guidance, mock interviews.I have done this for kids of friends and have been told that I should charge and that’s what I’m considering doing.

Would you, as a parent, pay for a package of support for your child that would be tailored to them to help them with the process. It’s a little what a head of sixth form or sixth form mentor would do but much more personalised?

Personally, no, because I have enough knowledge and experience to help my dc with this myself. I imagine a lot of parents would pay though.

No.

I suspect the people who can afford to pay for it will already get it through the good quality schools their kids attend or they can do it themselves

AND

The people who need it most wouldn't be able to afford what you'd need to charge to make it worthwhile.

Sorry.

It's been done. I'm not sure if they are still around but there was a company called Oxbridge applications. At the time I worked in the admissions office for one of those universities.

They claimed to be able to tutor you through interviews and help you prep your applications

They'd hang around our open days like a bad smell. We weren't too keen as all their information was several years out of date. They also charged for support that was available for free from the admissions office. They made people feel that you needed their services to get into the uni which wasn't the case

Very interesting. Thank you. Oxbridge Applications are definitely still around and they charge extortionate prices. They also have a very snazzy website.

More well off kids will have a school careers service that will do this.
The more disadvantaged kids can access this through university widening access or uni connect teams.
So I don’t think thered be much of a market.

I think it’s a great idea to use those skills - but through a charity (like IntoUniversity). It would be wonderful to use your expertise to help young people who don’t have access to that intel from parents or school - potentially life changing.

No, children from more affluent backgrounds will access this sort of support through their schools and families on a lower income wouldn't be able to afford this. If my dd hadn't accessed this through her school, I could have done this myself.

I agree with PP. Your service users will be disadvantaged students.

Higher education is one of the only ways for children to escape poverty and ignorance. It's meant to be accessible to all and universities do so much to enable access of disadvantaged students. They know that there is a huge pool of untapped talent and intellect within this group. If we want Britain to stay great, we need to locate and use those brains, not just for that individual, not just for the principle of eqality but for the greater good.

Teachers/governors/mentors in state schools all over the country work tirelessly for free to find, convince and facilitate the passage of the poor to greatness. They do so much for these children to make it a level playing field.

My own DD announced in year 9: "I'm going to x university to study y". I laughed and told her: "You're not smart enough to go there". So, with no money spent apart from textbooks, she made it happen.She worked out which GCSE subject teachers were not teaching her to grade 9, downloaded the examiner reports and taught herself. No private tuition.

On a personal level, she literally spent years crafting her PS. She found out what supra she needed for her course and starting doing it intensively from year 9. She used the internet to work out exactly what she needed. It was all free. The only cost was blood, sweat and tears and everyone can afford that if they are willing to pay.

There are thousands of determined children (and their parents) out there, using the natural resourcefulness of the poor to make the best of their situation. University access should be one area that is not determined by your ability to pay. Please don't make us pay for it.

I hear you. I really do and feel strongly about giving a level playing field but how does this differ from paid tuition? Or buying a house in a catchment area that affords better school opportunities?

I absolutely respect the fact that there would be a limited market. I get that and will review BUT I don’t expect that it is an inherently unethical services as long as appropriate parameters were set (ie I would never write a personal statement for a student). I spent years working in widening participation and university. It isn’t as altruistic as some of these posts might suggest but often completely ingrained in the universities admissions and access policy and the £9k plus fees that students would be looking to spend. Worth a thought

Unless you’re looking at medicine/ Oxbridge (and I guess one or two other institutions, e.g., St Andrews or Durham), the overwhelming majority of universities ignore personal statements, and just go on GCSEs and predicted grades.

Even in the case of Oxbridge, my two eldest DCs went to UNIQ summer schools (widening participation) and we’re told by admissions officers that the personal statement was really only looked at to give something to discuss at interview.

In other words, you probably made no difference to the outcomes.

That should be were, not we’re.

The problem I would foresee with a service like this would be that it would be detached from the school, which could lead to problems with choices based on predicted grades etc. A student and parent might tell you that 'oh yes, they're on target for AAA, and you might recommend unis accordingly, but ABB might be the realistic target which the school would be better placed to judge.

No for two reasons.

The people who could afford to pay will in general terms have involved and educated parents who will know how the system works or know how to find out. They will likely be at schools with a history of sending kids to university who will provide an active programme from Y12 to prepare for Uni applications. The people that NEED this kind of guidance won’t be able to pay. Mentoring through a charity would be much more effective.

Secondly for the vast majority of applications the Personal Statement is not read, all those predicted sufficient grades for the course will receive offers. Far too much time in my view is spent agonising over this aspect of the application process, for the majority of applicants.

Just popped on here to say that I'm paying an arm and a leg in school fees to a v high profile boarding school and all the application to medicine information was from me for DD. In fact the school advice was worse than useless as it would have meant DD not applying strategically as an individual and their PS advice was counter to friends advice who actually read PS for med sch applications. She has got 4/4 interviews which is good in medicine I think.
So the presumption that independent schools are good with this is flawed. Her school maybe good for other subjects though/oxbridge to be fair but I have no knowledge of that

No because that's what parents do - the only kids who really need outside support won't have the kind of parents who are able or willing to pay. Plus a parent knows their child best and an outsider is more likely to be sticking with traditional bias as opposed to more nuanced reasons

Hmm I am not sure if universities don't read personal statements. Apparently the delay in response from LSE for example is because the personal statement is read several times.

@chopc

Hmm I am not sure if universities don't read personal statements. Apparently the delay in response from LSE for example is because the personal statement is read several times.

This depends on whether they're a selective university or a recruiting university - ie whether they're oversubscribed.

OP are you familiar with what international recruitment agencies do for universities?

@chopc the likes of LSE, Oxbridge, Durham, Medicine and Vet are the outliers. Most other courses at most other universities will not place any importance on the PS. They will offer according to predicted grades. The PS might be relevant if going through clearing. But it certainly doesn’t need to be blown out of proportion in terms of effort/time/paying someone to advise

My dd is yr13 so has just did her uni application. She had a lot of support from her 6th form who worked with some current uni students and staff to perfect applications. We are in a very working class area where parents wouldn't be able to pay for additional services. My dd has successfully completed her interviews and has four offers to study medicine. The support from current uni students who provided their time for free was a massive help. Some were incredibly honest and really pulled apart my dd PS. They were a brilliant help when revising for UCAT too.

@user1487755366

I hear you. I really do and feel strongly about giving a level playing field but how does this differ from paid tuition? Or buying a house in a catchment area that affords better school opportunities?

It's no different and I don't like those either, (especially paid tuition).

@Annecat Her (amazing) daughter comes from a working class area and has just received four medicine offers, using the current free system available to all, in particular, the emphasis on the PS.

Your provision of paid assistance to raise that bar gives the rich children yet another advantage over the poor children. Maybe Annecat's daughter will miss out, as will her patients. Is that what you want?

This is not the answer to your original question, in that I have changed "would" to "should", so I apologise for that.

We might. We are relatively wealthy and our dc will be at private school, but if they don’t provide enough support for this then we may feel our dcs would respond better to an expert than to advice from us - I remember not really thinking my parents knew what they were talking about! So it’s something I would probably look at at the time. But that’s got to be a pretty small market honestly - wealthy enough to pay, but not able/willing to access all the free advice available.

Of course, some people believe that anything they have to pay for must, for that reason alone, be superior to anything that is provided for free, so there probably would be a market for it. In some quarters.

No, unless my child was applying for Oxbridge.
For full disclose, my children are 2 and 1, so this is all hypothetical!

Some universities, for some courses, do not read the PS at all until they have you in front of them at interview - in other words, mainly Oxbridge, Med and Vet courses.

Yet you must always write your PS as if it will be gone over with a fine tooth comb. Unis such as Durham and LSE often accompany rejections with "your PS was not up to scratch" or words to that effect.

OP, your service would be best offered outside of the UK for students whose parents are unfamiliar with UK unis - but you'd need to get pretty familiar with the secondary education scene in whichever country you were thinking of - and you 'd need to speak the language/be fairly plugged in to the culture too.

I think it's a terrible business idea OP both on ethical and financial grounds