BA Security, Intelligence & Cyber...thoughts?

[catsharingmychair]

Does anyone have any thoughts/feedback on a BA in Security, Intelligence and Cyber? Just to qualify, it is not a computer science course - it is all about international governance, communication & diplomacy around terrorism/security with some Cyber modules also. It is only offered at undergraduate level in around 6 Unis, none of them RG.

The one she's most interested in is at Buckingham and is actually a two year intensive degree - with a very, very small campus. We visited informally last week.

She really wants to go to university for both the intellectual stimulation and the experience, but just isn't keen on continuing with traditional/purely academic subjects. She doesn't wish to continue with her A level subjects as a pure degree (History, Geography & Politics, AAA) however is interested in applied contemporary history & politics relating to international security. She doesn't see herself enjoying a pure History degree with mostly essays/exams. The BA in question uses different types of measurement e.g. coursework, exams but also interviewing techniques etc so it is much more practical.

She's keen to work in a field related to international security/terrorism prevention or potentially Detective work. (The graduate program/training for Detectives doesn't require a specific degree title first so she could take any subject). She's also explored and discounted Policing degrees/ Degree Apprenticeships and Law degrees/Degree Apprenticeships. She's obviously reviewed modules/degrees in International Relations & Criminology.

I'm happy whatever she chooses to apply for; she needs to study whatever she finds most interesting. However I do have a slight concern if she ends up applying one day for the Civil Service. Would it find a first degree in security, intelligence and cyber too specialized or limiting? Might it prefer to see a traditional degree first and intelligence studies as a Masters?

And when you look on LI at grads accepted onto the govt Fast Stream programs, many seem to have followed the 3 year, RG route, some with Masters. So going fully vocational, plus going down the 2 year intensive route - any ideas how this might be received?

Any thoughts most appreciated. Many thanks.

Thank you sendsummer. I understood they were elite and French Presidents have favoured Science Po I believe.

I understood they were elite and French Presidents have favoured Science Po I believe.

Some are, some aren’t. When I worked in Paris, ENA and des Mines seemed to be the prestigious ones. As Sendsummer says, Sciences Po may be less competitive. Getting into ENA was a big deal. Even for British exchange students.

To come back to War Studies, here is a link for you OP:

www.theuniguide.co.uk/search/course?utf8=%E2%9C%93&c%5Bq%5D=war+studies

and then also:
www.theuniguide.co.uk/aberystwyth-university-a40/courses/strategy-intelligence-and-security-ba-hons-2021-7e028ee84048

I am sure there are others but these are the course that seem to match what you are describing quite well.

I am not sure how they are all assessed , mind, other than I was told the Aber one is not all via essays.

And also this :

beta.salford.ac.uk/courses/undergraduate/intelligence-analysis

Thanks very much for all your comments, ideas and links- all really helpful.

Having visited Royal Holloway yesterday (for poss IR and Politics) she's fallen in love with the beautiful Founder's building - which I grant you is pretty stunning. The nearest town, Egham, however is so tiny it makes you wonder what Uni students can find to do when they are not head down studying? (It is quite a small campus- but a very pretty one). Not having gone to a campus Uni (I went to a City Uni - Cardiff) I'm not in the know about how often campus based students might splash out and train/taxi to a larger city to find a nightclub or bigger music venue...? Doesn't it get (dare I say it) a bit claustrophobic if you don't get out occasionally?

Thanks again.

RH is a beauty. I have heard that a lot of their students go home every weekend . Not sure how true that is.

RH suits some but not others. It’s very very quiet at the weekends and Egham is dull and lifeless.

DS1 did a module about terrorism in his geography degree at Southampton, a while ago. They do a MSc in international risk and terrorism. DS2 looked at Southampton for History and Politics but didn't want to go to the same Uni as his brother.
DB went to Royal Holloway- it was a boring place to be .....

Buckingham is very low ranking for those grades.

It is interesting that your DD is attracted to Buckingham and Royal Holloway.

Both are Universities that the MN collective seems to have doubts about. I disagree. Our observation is that both really suit some students. The smaller, calmer, campuses are possibly closer to a Junior Ivy than UK Universities like Bristol. Horses for courses. FWIW we know two students who were unhappy at their first Universities (Exeter was too rah!) but went on to do very well ot Buckingham and RH. I would drill down on what attracts your DD to those Universities and add it to the mix. A frantic freshers week and busy student social life is not for everyone.

On subject, many degrees on the social science/humanities border allow a certain amount of flex. Looking for future employment a degree with economics in its name can appear more relevant. Economic history might be a good one.

I once worked in an international relations field. Lots of different degrees, but not many with IR degrees, and even then mainly from the LSE. A rarer language: Russian, Arabic, Chinese or Japanese might stand you in better stead, or history/economics. Or a combination of both. Or for international organisations, law.

Sorry, I got confused between this and another thread about economics without maths. That said my comments still stand, though in context sound quite brusque.

OP, has she done any of the Smallpeice Trust cybersecurity summer courses, sponsored by GCHQ? It's the best way to find out if she likes the subject area.

p.s. www.smallpeicetrust.org.uk/cyberfirst

If she's interested in contemporary history & politics relating to international security, then a International Relations & Politics degree is the way to go IMO.

I'd also like to second Hull uni for their politics dept. Most of their politics courses offer a one trimester internship down at Westminster, or you can choose to complete the internship abroad.

War Studies at King's College London sounds perfect for her. Top-notch IR/terrorism scholars.

My DS literally just graduated from RH on the infosec stream of their compsci degree. Egham suited him - he has ASD and did better in a shared house of mostly masters students in years 2/3 than in halls for his first year. He enjoyed his time there but found that the wide range of experience and ability in the intake made a lot of the course slow going. He was supposed to be doing a 4 year masters but just stepped off with a BSc as he was learning more in his job than on the course - his employers have said they’ll fund his masters later.

Cyber first - son was offered this but declined it. I don’t know if they’ve improved things but the application process was ridiculously slow. He applied in the early autumn of year 13 and decisions weren’t made until late October or maybe even November of the first year of uni - how can you plan your finances if you don’t find out until you’re over a month in? They also wanted a 3 year commitment after graduation. He did work experience with PWC in London who offered him a contract distance working p/t during term time and in London in the summer breaks, as it was a job there was no commitment post graduation but the offer of a job was made. He enjoys the work and the team so it was a no brainer, they paid him well while he was a student and his starting salary as a graduate is well above average.

Anyway, I don’t know if it’s the comps I course at royal holloway that you were looking at, but if you have questions about the course or the uni just shout. Worth knowing is that they seem to keep the undergrads well away from the ISG which was a source of frustration for DS as he felt there would be more opportunities than there actually were.

Not too fussy about the degree subject - www.gchq-careers.co.uk/early-careers/graduates-and-future-leaders.html

On the 'general interest' side:
facebook.com/events/s/cyber-war-crimes-tarah-wheeler/3411851418876022/?ti=as

Gresham College talk (but not until next March, so I would have to set myself several reminders).

Oh, I massively want to be a spy sprouts . I think I many have left it too late ....

No Piggy do it! I read somewhere we midlife (assumption there) women are so invisible we're ideal spies. Maybe it was a recruiting site .

midlife how very dare you!

That happens in the first series of Line of Duty , too. No one notices Kate watching them because she's a female.

There you go, fully qualified !

Excellent! Remember , I am watching you....