Closed till September - why?

[emkana]

I don't understand unis that are already closing now till September. Seems rather premature when we don't actually know what will happen? I know there's talk of 10 to 12 weeks but still?

Most were about to shut for Easter for 4 weeks, quite often that it's just exams anyway...

Not much teaching etc happens after the end of May.

Dd was going to have four more teaching weeks, then exams

Have they not moved onto on-line teaching?

Think of a lecture hall, 200 hundred students like in for an hour then leave, then the next 200...

We have lecture halls that are used 9 hours per day so they have 1,800 students passing through all needing to open the doors!

They are not closing. They are moving to online teaching and assessment. Students have been refusing to enter exam halls, and are not attending teaching either because of concerns about the virus or because they are rushing home before the borders shut.

Universities across the US and Europe have closed this week due to Covid-19. Those working in universities in the UK are not fools and also recognise the danger.

I think it's a reasonable question though - a bit like Emkana I wondered on another thread what the rationale for these measures is at places where there are not yet any reported cases (of course I realise that isn't any longer so significant as there won't be testing of non-hospitalised!), and there hasn't been any advice from DfE or DoH to go online/close.

Not all universities are doing it - I think on the other thread Newcastle was mentioned as a place where it's business as usual. Would be interesting to know if the students there are continuing to attend.

My husband has gone in to work as his place is BAU (they have had a reported case). But he’s had a flurry of emails from students over the last few days telling him that they are going home, even though there are four weeks left of the semester. He expects there to be others who just don’t turn up. Add to that staff and students self-isolating, and that’s a lot of disruption to teaching. Some institutions will have taken the view that online teaching, while not ideal, at least offers continuity, as well as protecting student and staff welfare.

I work in a huge campus uni with a large number of international students and I wonder if that influences making the decision? Some student facing staff will have to continue to be there as not all students will be able to return home

While Durham, just down the road, has effectively finished term early, cancelled the first year exams due to happen this week and advised those living in college to clear their rooms (which obviously raises the possibility of next term not happening). There's one confirmed case in County Durham, not in the uni itself.

I don't have a view on what's right or wrong, just find the varied response quite striking.

haha GC, I spent two minutes trying to work out which university BAU was! Business as usual will definitely soon be a well known acronym!

Yes, I see the point about better continuity of online teaching. That is I suppose slightly different from the universities that are effectively telling the students to go home until September. It would be possible to teach online but keep the university 'going' in terms of students who wanted to stay doing so - for libraries, societies, sports, social life etc. Obviously those things sound frivolous (not libraries, of course!) but are quite a bit part of what students are doing university for, and as yet there is no official guidance to stop them. (I realise this may change!)

And yes random, I suppose the international/national mix may affect the decisions as well.

They've been asked to clear rooms for deep cleaning I believe? Plus some halls always have to clear at the end of each term?

Uni buses are quiet this morning!

Newcastle was mentioned as a place where it's business as usual. Would be interesting to know if the students there are continuing to attend

Yes, they are as far as I know. They are still going out and socialising as well. DD’s lectures are all put online two days after each lecture, but they don’t put seminars online and lab work obviously can’t be done online. DD has been lucky that she hasn’t been affected by the strikes either.

I don't have a view on what's right or wrong, just find the varied response quite striking

Neither do I goodbyestranger, and I can’t understand why the universities are taking completely different stances. I suspect that it may be to do with the number of students/staff who have contracted the virus.

Newcastle has a lot of international students.

I meant those who wouldn't normally have to clear RandomMess - but deep cleaning is a bonus going forward! What a job for the cleaning teams though - I hope they're drafting in extra people to spread the load.

The impact on some local economies of universities shutting down for a term would be quite marked (I know on mn we're not allowed to care about the effect on employment, self-employment etc but universities are a significant source of employment, retail, catering etc - again I know we're not supposed to care about that here, but there you are.) Less so in large cities I suppose.

Gin not a single member of the Durham uni community has tested positive yet.

I literally have no view - quite a novel experience :)

Quite right - the economic impact will be absolutely massive in Durham.

I feel sorry for the cleaners who have to clean the kitchens. There are some seriously skanky students who have no idea how to clean up after themselves.

I think Newcastle are just trying to hang on for the remaining two weeks of term, but I think it’s highly unlikely they’ll be back after Easter.

It takes a lot of coordination to get things online. I think that they wanted to act quickly to minimise disruptions. There’s no real need to have real life contact in most course anyway.

What would be the point of going to university then? Sitting in a small room in a hall of residence watching lectures online is very isolating and an expensive way to get a degree.

"There’s no real need to have real life contact in most course anyway."

Yes for some courses that may be true (though not stem, art/design?) but the reality is that most students who leave home to go to university are doing so in part for the social/living experience. As gin for dinner says, I think.

Does it not depend on what departments/experts these uni have within? They might be giving different advice depending on their research POV.

Yes, that may be the explanation Feesh. Certainly it doesn't seem as though DfE or DoH has advised this - so univs are all taking their own decisions.

What's the students' response i wonder? - are they relieved, pleased, disappointed - I expect views vary as on mn!

There’s no real need to have real life contact in most course anyway.

That is complete nonsense. My teaching is all discussion-based, with small groups of students. Lectures are about 5% of my overall teaching. You cannot replicate seminar discussion online, not without serious compromise. Students also need to develop transferable skills, such as collaborative working, which our teaching formats enable. What about labs, studio work, etc? You can’t do any of that sitting in your bedroom on a laptop. There is a reason why MOOCs have not been the revolution they were touted as. They have a massive drop-out rate.