Second year houses, is it normal to pay rent over the summer

[FrameyMcFrame]

Just wondering if this is par for the course?

Dd has found a house big the tenancy starts in July!

Apparently we have to pay 3 months rent when she's not even going to be living there?

I don't mind paying for essentials but this seems like a MASSIVE waste of money.

It will also depend on who owns and who is running the hall in London.

My daughter didn't have to pay rent until September when their tenancy started, she only paid over the summer when they signed up for another year.

Bubbles, my recollection from your previous post is that your DD was in private halls some way out from the centre, and that it was altogether unsatisfactory. Her experience seems to have been very different to the experience of those at UCL Imperial, Kings, LSE etc. Private provision has also improved dramatically in the past decade, with lots going up in pretty central locations.

The major London Universities tend to have their own halls in quite central locations, and usually guarantee first year accommodation. Definitely not year round, though some because of the high proportion of overseas students who find it difficult to store belongings, will require rent to be paid through Christmas and Easter. University websites give details.

It is typical for contracts to run and to pay rent for house shares from 1st July. Most Halls have mid-September to end of June contracts, and some require rooms to be emptied over Christmas and Easter where halls are rented out for conferences (this happened when I was a student in London, everything had to go at Christmas and Easter). Halls can be more expensive that private shared houses (as is the experience of my son in Swansea) so you may find that post first year accommodation works out about the same (or cheaper )as cost in halls even with summer rental. Also it has the advantage that everything doesn't have to be brought home in June!

That makes sense TreeClimbingCat

Mine ran august to august i think. So the first year i didnt move in till august so didnt pay over the first summer and did the second summer and third summer.

Where i was there were no halls beyond first year, benefit was generally that you didnt have to move your stuff out, back home then back in for the new term, you could just do a straight swap.

I haven't heard of discounted summer rates before. It did make halls a similar price to private rented

We also had to pay for 2 weeks I'm June. The agent tried to tell me it was a retention, when I queried this as we had already paid a deposit. Turns out June was when the owner did all maintenance.

@Needmoresleep

Ah that explains it as I was a student in London so yes, things were different.

We could always give notice before the end of term to move out in the summer.. as it was assured short hold tenancy so you can leave any time after 6 months.

DS1's rent runs from late September to mid August. WHhch suited him really well last year as he has an internship for July at uni. He kept the same flat for the following year, but had to leave it for the 6 weeks, though he was allowed to leave stuff in boxes in cupboards at his own risk,

DD is in Scotland and it seems to be a bit different. No student contracts, she and her flatmates can give a month's notice anytime. They did start the tenancy a month early as they found a flat they liked.

A retainer over the summer (I think half rent) was normal when I was a student many years ago. This model where you just don't pay at all and get another house in September isn't one I ever saw. People wanted to know they'd definitely have a place to live and what it would be! If you think that's a waste and would happily take the risk of your DC being homeless or ending up in a really crappy place, that's your call, I guess..

Imperial usethe same hall as my DD was in for their undergrads. Interestingly for 39 weeks. And cheaper weekly rent too. I wonder if they subsidise it? My DD was only offered it for 50 weeks and not 39. The same hall!

Yes, my twins in Bristol paid from 1 July for their 2 places both over summer holiday after year 1 and summer holiday after year 2. When I was at university we could pay a "retainer" - half the rent for the 3 months of the summer although I can see why a landlord who has a mortgage to pay could not afford to do that..Ah I see Butery has written exactly the same point - I think these retainers are now gone.

Bubbles, it appears very normal for private hall owners to have deals with specific Universities. A friend who manages private accomodation says it gives them access to University discipline procedures, ie you don't graduate if you have not paid your hall bills or have too many complaints filed against you, and it allows them to advertise via the university website and be part of the allocation process, and thus a guaranteed occupancy. KCL currently seems to be doing deals with the developers of every new block in central London presumably to be able to match "rivals" (UCL, LSE and Imperial) offer of guaranteed accommodation for all first year.

I suspect in London, Universities are also able to provide tenants for the summer from their lucrative summer schools. UG and PGs from Europe, the US, and Asia flock to London for a chance to spend four weeks in the capital, learn something interesting and perhaps improve their English. All of which gives Universities a handle to negotiate lower rents for their UGs.

Imperial have been developing a second campus at White City, elements of which are still being opened. My assumption was that early accomodation near here was difficult to fill, so was opened up to others, but as the University has expanded, and the area improved, this is no longer the case, or won't be when Crossrail (finally) opens and it is all more accessible. It could well be that it is now, or will be, exclusively Imperial.

Some, non University linked, private accommodation is very very expensive, though often quite swanky. My guess is that they have their eye on richer overseas students, and also single working professionals who want their own space and the benefits of a central location, a concierge and communal facilities.

And Framey, yes. As a landlord I have accepted 9/10 month fixed term tenancies from, say, overseas Masters students. Another difference in London is that for students rent is often payable in advance, as it is difficult for overseas students to find UK guarantors. Rent in advance is very attractive to landlords!

One problem with waiting till September in London is that you are then competing with new graduates starting well paid jobs. It is well worth starting two months early so in late June to find something available in late August.

Sorry, a bit of an essay on the London property market. At the moment there is not much money to be made in London BTL, but good returns from up-market hostels. (From employers needing to attract staff as well as Universities.) So that is the direction large investors are headed.

Well the new Imperial Hall at North Acton will be very convenient for the White City Imperial campus. Where DD lived, Imperial students didn’t have many rooms. Mostly UAL. Hence the 50 weeks! The Imperial students appear to have got a better deal in the same building with 11 weeks less rent!

@Butterymuffin I've paid the deposit now... yes you're right, it's important to have settled on a place.

Anyway, I'm happy it's a nice house and she's happy with the people she's living with!!

I'll just have to eat beans on toast over the summer to pay for it.

A couple of pieces of advice.

1. Joint and several liability is common, as are guarantors. This means you could end up paying if someone else defaults. Try to negotiate that you are only guarantor for your child's share, or an alternative, if you can, is to pay up front. Otherwise you are reliant on the DC to select reliable friends.

1. It is important to check the inventory carefully when you first move into a property. Try the shower, use the washing machine, turn on the heating. I went down with my daughter to do this. The letting agent had loads on properties turn over in the same week so inventories were pretty sketchy. We had a three page email of additional faults (blu tack on walls etc) and five items that needed fixing urgently. You then check that the deposit is put in a proper official scheme. If the landlord then refuses to give the deposit back you saw you want to enter a dispute with the deposit holders scheme. It is almost certain that, providing the flat is in an equal condition to the annotated inventory, the landlord will back down as he will almost certainly lose. There seems to be a game of making small unwarranted deductions, roughly £50 per head, on the assumption no one will object. We also used the time to select utility suppliers using an internet comparison site, including a referral from our Virgin broadband account. A bit of care at the start saved a lot of money, and it was useful learning for DD. She did it all herself in her third year. (Actually the current landlord is really amateur. No inventory provided, plus the landlord has not registered as an HMO. The latter is illegal, so lots of leverage to get the deposit back in full!)

I agree on the guarantee issue. I refused to be guarantor but my chidren's father has been. He has the best deal - I pay all the rents and he guarantees it and it is unlikely all the other students won't pay the rent and nor will their parents pay up.

I did advise a client who asked about this to pay all the rent for 12 mnoths up front rather than guaranteeing the rents of 8 people in the house and that might be another option landlords will accept. The problem most parents have is their children don't want to see difficult when many of their friends are signing things without reading them so it is not always easy as a parent to put a spanner in the works.

DD's rent this year is based on a 38 week let in uni accommodation (annoying to have to empty it at Easter, but hey ho!) but her halls next year are only let to 2nd years on a 44 week let. So it's more expensive. It did seem to be pretty much what it would gost for a house share, but staying on campus is going to be a much better option as I've mentioned on here before.

If you think about it from the landlord's prospective (and they're not running a charity here!) they are unlikely, unless in a holiday area, to manage to fill a house for 3 months.

Dd did look at a house that had 9 month tenancy-but it wasn't worth it because basically you paid 12 months rent over 9 months, but then weren't allowed in at all over those 3 months. She's hoping to be able to move a lot of her stuff straight from halls to the house.

Good advice generally, thanks.

@DrMadelineMaxwell, I suggested campus for next year to DD but it seemed that all her friends were going in houses, unfortunately.
I'd have much preferred her to stay on and I think second years get a good choice of flats too.

DD already knows which building, floor and flat she is in next year. It's another of the new build buildings, with ensuite again, which she is pleased with. And self catering which I am happy with as it means there will be the huge communal kitchen which is the only place DD currently socialises in. A lot of the flatmates that are into drinking have already paired/grouped off and looked at houses together.
If DD was in a house, she'd see the few people in her house and her course mates. And that would be it. In campus accommodation, she sees 11 other flatmates that share the floor/kitchen. She's done more friend-making than ever so far this year.

@Needmoresleep that's brilliant advice, thank you. I hadn't appreciated that we/DD could pay the whole rent upfront to wriggle out of the guarantor part - I know I don't want to be a guarantor for the joint & several part.

The only thing I would add is that on entering the property, as well as trying all the appliances & fixtures, you should photograph everything - the inside of the oven, the fridge, the walls, carpets etc. in case the LL tries anything on about the deposit.

Malbecfan, it is up to the LL, but my guess is that most landlords are happy to accept an offer. I just sent an email to the landlord. It can be an important option for overseas students who can struggle to find UK guarantors, so worth suggesting if there is an overseas student in the group.

I know students who will finish at Easter this year, but still have to pay for (then empty) accomodation until July... Its ridiculous

12 month full rent normal, I paid 1/2 retainer when I was at uni but that was a long time ago.

I do question the assertion that landlords have to charge for 12 months otherwise they are missing out.
They are already earning a higher monthly rental as hmo rather than private letting to a family. There is no way for example that they could charge a family £3,250 per month for some of the properties I have seen if it were a family renting and not 5 individual students at 5 x £650.00 per month. (£39,000 per year) Imho