Still shocked by UCAS clearing

[ThePonderer]

Imagine you book the holiday of a lifetime, using all your savings. You're going on a cruise in the Caribbean.

You are delayed on the way to the airport and at the check-in desk they tell you, "Sorry, you're too late for your flight. But we can offer you these alternatives instead:

1. Cruising in Norway
2. A beach holiday in Antigua
3. Walking in Oporto
4. Snorkelling with sloths in Yucatan

Choose which holiday you want, run across the airport to the right check-in desk, and you might just be in time."

It could all work out well, if you know your geography, or if you'd been having doubts about your original booking anyway. It might even be the beginning of an epic sloth romance. But it's still massively stressful and an absurd way to make such a big life decision.

Surely there must be a better way?

I would think the vast majority of students who end up at a different university from their first choice (whether at their insurance or through clearing) are perfectly happy.

There are also students who end up at their dream first choice university and who are utterly miserable.

My DS was one. He missed a grade and had to have one paper remarked. While that was happening he looked at clearing, got immediate offers from three unis, he did not have to decide immediately whether he wanted to take it up, he had several days.

In the end his remark came through and he ended up at his first choice. That's where the nightmare year began.

He reapplied to UCAS the next year, with grades. The process was smooth and stress free. He ended up somewhere he hadn't dared apply to first time round and is very happy there, as well as being much more resilient.

It is stressful, but we learn to cope with stress by dealing with these situations. This is the first big challenge for them, and they need help and support from us to get through it, and they will emerge from it better equipped emotionally and practically, ready for the next challenge. It is no long term help for them at all to remove this difficulty from them completely.

561,420 DC applied via UCAS this year. Not 275,000. 64,000 went through clearing last year. Let’s get the stats correct. These are huge numbers of students so how can this volume be examined, get results and get offers and accept them in 2 years if we don’t use our current system? We are not little Ireland. I have heard a suggestion of a 7 term 6th form and start university in Jan. I’m not sure how this would work but sometimes the Devil you know......

When I google those are not the stats I get for the U.K.

And a lot of kids go through clearing because they did better than expected. Either way it's a small percentage who do it, and the over whelming majority get their first or second choice.

Interactive tool here (very slow on my phone, unfortunately), plus access to other UCAS data.
www.ucas.com/data-and-analysis/undergraduate-statistics-and-reports/statistical-releases-daily-clearing-analysis-2019

Are the numbers higher than in Germany and France? It would be interesting to know.

It will be really interesting to see the outcome of the review next April.

It's stressful because you spend all summer not knowing what's happening in September but you have your insurance, you can take a gap year and your firm might well take you on with lower grades.

Ds researched everything to the enth degree and knew exactly who he was going to phone for clearing.

I think the key thing is to have a plan in place so it doesn't seem too overwhelming.

Not being funny but there 18 now if they are going uni so you should stop controling there life. If they are doing clearing it's because they did something wrong. Leave the uni and student to it and stop being overbearing, nosey and selfish people.

Not got older kids then LEAVETHEM? I find people want input when they are contributing thousands of pounds to their children's education.

There are huge emotional and financial implications to making decisions. Some dc will be mature and independent, others will feel very stressed and disappointed. Should parents, staff, carers, friends etc ignore that and not support them? What kind of person would? And dd was still 17 on results day.

@LEAVETHEM1

If they are doing clearing it's because they did something wrong.

Or how about the teachers did something wrong. Or wrongly predicted their grades. Or a parent died halfway through the course. Or the computer they were typing the paper on due to dyslexia broke during the exam. Or even because the results were better than anyone expected so the student “trades up”.

I expect when your DC get to this stage you will not leave them to it, but will be equally “overbearing, nosey and selfish”. And I do hope your spelling improves before you proof read the application form.

I work in Higher Education. Currently there are a lot of studies in clearing, what we call in HE "post qualification applications". They're looking into how universities are marketed to students and how those who entered through clearing compare to those who didn't.

It's a sort of marmite subject in HE circles, there's some stuff on WonkHE about it. Ultimately it is what it is, though.

It's a hugely stressful process, my daughters friend got a grade lower in her maths than was expected and didn't get her first or back ups as she wanted to do maths, She went into clearing and was on it immediately.

Every uni she phoned basically by the time she got through what places were there were gone. She eventually got one who said yes, she was offered a place verbally. to then have an email an hour later saying she didn't. It was appalling. And she then had to do it again. It had her in tears and she didn't get sorted till mid afternoon.

The unis have a shit load of people answering the phones, so there may be a small number of places available on a given course and they can go in minutes. Literally mins depending on how quickly you get through. And of course you're also competing against the others phoning. So you can end up in the situation she did, where they verbally say yes then rescind,

I don't know the solution, but it's an awfully stressful process for the kids.

Surely there must be a better way?

Things need to change so students apply after they have their results
The current system relies on predicted grades and predicted grades are more often wrong than right. It’s ridiculous.

The current system relies on predicted grades

To be honest for the majority it doesn't. Most applicants will get the standard offer regardless of predicted.

Place are awarded based on actual, not predicted. once results come out.

Really all the predicted does is inform the applicant what level of offer to aim for - but given that they have five goes, and most sensibly put down a range of offers, it's not a bad system.

Remember there is NOTHING stopping an individual applicant applying with grades in hand.

I think there is huge pressure on the school leavers to progress straight onto HE though. If only to make the school's destinations look better. There may also be an argument that a year out may mean a loss of momentum in learning , especially for some subjects, and applicants may find alternatives or work in e meantime but if culturally it became more normal to apply after results and take time out, using the interim period to enhance skills or find internships, it might be to everyone's longer term benefit.

My daughters friend got a grade lower in her maths than was expected and didn't get her first or back ups as she wanted to do maths, She went into clearing and was on it immediately. Every uni she phoned basically by the time she got through what places were there were gone. She eventually got one who said yes, she was offered a place verbally. to then have an email an hour later saying she didn't.

This year top ranked Russell Group universities went into Clearing For Maths and were accepting students for several days. Overall Maths acceptances are down over 10% & many courses are still open in Clearing. The story is either incorrect or not from this year.

I grew up and studied abroad and was baffled the first time I heard about UCAS/clearing etc. All just complex, convoluted, stress-inducing, stake-raising and not for any good reason that I can see, for most students. And the universities now offering students "scholarships" to accept them over another uni, and fighting for student numbers against one another... I don't think these things drive quality in higher education.

It's not from this year, it's from four years ago,,

titchy is right really. If you look on Which, it tells you the % of applicants given offers. For many courses, this is over 90% (obviously to Oxbridge and the real competitive courses elsewhere) and sometimes near 100%. Essentially, nearly all applicants are just given an offer for many courses which is the published grade profile. The sifting happens then after results. Now, it is true that most students will have PGs in the region of those offers but I do know of students who had BBCish type predictions who applied to ABB institutions and did receive offers (of ABB or sometimes lower as it is a contextual offer school). The two I know of did end up in clearing, as their predictions were in fact pretty accurate!

And the universities now offering students "scholarships" to accept them over another uni, and fighting for student numbers against one another... I don't think these things drive quality in higher education.

And yet our universities are consistently the best in the world....

The stats pages above will not open to have attached two graphs from the ucas report for 2018. The figures I quoted were from a newspaper report but they were accurate.

Some are the best in the world. Down the lower end, clearly not! There is over provision and the sector needs to realign.

@ThePonderer
I totally agree.
We have just been through the hideousness of clearing and I'm still not over it.

I think titchy has a better analogy.
I think many students would be better being aware that clearing is an issue rather than assuming they will get into their top choices, and making a contingency plan. For example, choosing a second choice which has a significantly lower entry requirement. Or they could make plans to take a gap year if they don't get the required grades, giving them time to research which universities would give them an unconditional offer for the next year.

About a hundred years ago I went through clearing to get a better course (my first and second choice offers were 2e’s ) I left after two terms and ran off to join the circus (okay, the military) and went back to a different place later. Dd is in third year at her first choice now, and ds did not apply. He opted out of the crazy as he was overwhelmed by the experience. Now he has his results in hand he’s applying for next year, and hopefully it will be much more straightforward (as long as he can decide where he wants to go). Dd2 wants to do medicine. So we’re heading into two years of stress now...