Warwick University

[ZandathePanda]

Just watched the new documentary on bbc iPlayer about the rape chat on social media. I would be so angry and ashamed if I had a son that did this. How can they be flat mates and friends with girls and then talk about them like that? And the university handled it appallingly. I wonder if it will affect the numbers going there?

I think it must affect numbers going there. I am involved in graduate recruitment and Warwick is one of our big recruiting grounds. For over 10 years my first thought when hearing the word Warwick is “good for maths”. And now it isn’t.

The people we will be interviewing will not be involved in this. (The men involved are history types - we don’t touch history types!) And I won’t let what happened impact the poor kids who had nothing to do with it and want to apply for a job. But it will be hard. I won’t be thinking about how good for maths Warwick is any more.

Although they were history students you cannot tar all history students with the same brush!

They are just ignorant, misogynist, horrible types!

Although they were history students you cannot tar all history students with the same brush!

Sorry - it may not have been clear - the reason we don’t touch history students is nothing to do with what happened - it is because we are after mathematicians!

I can't see how it won't affect numbers. I didn't consider Warwick at recently when looking at universities for a masters application whereas i would have done before. Others must think the same.

I can't see how it won't affect numbers. I didn't consider Warwick at recently when looking at universities for a masters application whereas i would have done before. Others must think the same.

Yes - it may not even be a conscious thing for many - just when you are doing an initial trawl and thinking “where seems a nice place to go” then instinctively Warwick won’t!

Yes, certainly it was instinctive as I didn't realise I hadn't considered it until this thread whereas I did for my undergraduate degree.

The problem is the word "types". If you had said the men involved were history graduates and we don't employ history graduates that would imply they are not suitable for your career area.

By saying the men involved are "history types " implies that this behaviour is usual for history types.

The problem is the word "types". If you had said the men involved were history graduates and we don't employ history graduates that would imply they are not suitable for your career area.

I’m a mathematician. We don’t think that hard over words. Especially when typing at midnight!

These young men were not only history students, they were studying a range of subjects. And I’m sorry to say that there are male students like this in every university in the country. This is far from being the only such case. The only difference lies in how the universities have dealt with it.

Yes, I think it's more a disgust at how Warwick subsequently handled it that makes - or should make many young people wary of the institution.

Anecdotally, on the various applying to uni threads this year quite a lot of young people seemed to be put off Warwick : I think especially in history as , at the time, it appeared any first years in 2019/20 could end up studying alongside some of the offenders. That seems not to be the case now on the latest news. Those young men will now be headed somewhere else...

Unfortunately, as a teacher of sixth formers, I can tell you that this kind of behaviour amongst young men is pretty rife and does actually seem to be on the rise.

Very sadly, I suspect that this behaviour (or similar) is likely to be present in every university in the UK. There is going to be a small minority of nasty misogynists in every large community.

There were significant errors of judgement in the way that Warwick handled it; hopefully they have learned from this and have now put better processes in place.

I attended a university of a similar calibre in the early 1990s. There was an acquaintance rape case which was mishandled by the faculty; the scandal and resulting outcry reached the national newspapers. I don't know if it reduced the number of applicants the following year, but any damage to the university's reputation was just a temporary blip.

I realise that case was different in that it was pre-internet. I just googled it case to see if there is anything online, a quarter of a century later. What remains online is mostly from The Independent but also the New York Times and the LA Times. The university mishandled the situation, but the case also raised general issues around acquaintance rape and victim blaming, and was widely discussed.

The reputation of the university may have suffered briefly, but they recovered rapidly and were not affected in the long term.

Warwick is too big a name to be affected by this. They will learn and they will do better if there is a next time. Going to a university that has examined its procedures is, in my view, better than one that hasn’t!

I can see no objective judgement that says maths grads are not amongst the best at Warwick. They are still sought after as they are for Engjneering and other numeracy subjects.

Going to a university that has examined its procedures is, in my view, better than one that hasn’t!
Yes, one would hope that now their processes are as robust and as transparent as it gets.

My son has accepted an offer from Warwick. We discussed this and also a far right activist previously associated with Warwick heavily before he accepted the place. Our feelings eventually were that if an institution has learnt from an episode then it is a better place to go. They handled it appallingly originally but students and staff protested. If anything like this ever had the misfortune to happen again their attitude would be under a microscope. No other place of learning will be immune from students or behaviour like this unfortunately.

It would put me off the history department for mine. Not just the way that the university handled the complaints and the young women making them but the fact that these boys were in a position of popularity and social power ...on the committee of the department society etc They weren't a far out group that no one spoke to.... from what I read at the time they were the well to do 'in crowd'. That would worry me in terms of environment and reputation.

To be fair, the history department themselves were at the forefront of the protests to the VC about how it was handled. I don't think the subject can be blamed (unless we really do believe history attracts such unpleasant young men - in which case that would be the same at all unis). What would put me off is Warwick authorities' handling of it : and I remain unconvinced that they are penitent or have learnt form their mishandling of events. I sincerely hope they have.

Interesting discussion as I’ll be looking at universities with my younger child in a couple of years, and we’ve had discussions about this and lesser incidents where loutish inappropriate behaviour had been in the media. It has changed my opinion of Warwick, but I think Bubbles makes a good point that they will have had to review how they deal with incidents in future. This could happen anywhere so you want to know that any university’s disciplinary procedures and student support are well designed.

Any institution has to put what they say in policies into action. That’s the crucial point and you really cannot tell who would do this well. Warwick certainly made mistakes and their investigative procedures were poor too. It’s really difficult to consider everything when making university choices! Sometimes an event that’s rare colours opinion but you cannot be certain how other universities would deal with this. I sincerely hope they don’t have to!

This in the Daily Mail today:
Two female students sue Warwick University for hundreds of thousands of pounds after being subjected to vile rape threats in WhatsApp group chat
so pleased that this has not just "gone away" and that it is going to court