Leaving university, without ever having had a job?

[VerenaR]

Just that really. What would you think of a person, generally and also from an employment point of view, if they had left university without ever having had a job?

My DD is currently in her second year of university, and I am really trying to persuade her to start looking for a summer job. She has reliably told me she will definitely get one this year, but she has said that for the past two years! She says she doesn't need to work as she wants to enjoy her time off doing the things she likes doing, and she insists she doesn't need the money (she receives a big maintenance loan from uni, that would last her over the summer). I know this is true, as she never asked me for any money last year. She earns money from selling clothes, but I keep on telling her that won't cut it on a CV if she has never held down an actual job.

Please give me your opinions and advice, I want her to see that I am not nagging her, just trying to help her in gaining experience which will help secure a full-time job after university.

[stressedoutpa]

It depends on who she is up against. If she applying for jobs where there is a lot of competition then she may be filtered out early on. I would say some sort of previous work experience would be one of those filters.

In my mind, no work experience before/during degree = bank rolled by rich parents and that would concern me. She may be in for a shock. Work environments are very different to selling tat on eBay.

[VerenaR]

Thank you for all those messages, she just got back from the library so I sent her the thread and we have been discussing some of the messages while she starts cooking .
Yes, I know she has experience in terms of the eBay, tutoring and organising, but I'm really worried that employers will go 'oh no, definitely not worth considering, as this candidate hasn't had a real job"

Also, her ebay is not a business account, it's still listed as personal as she didn't want to fork out for postage (you are obliged to offer free postage) so I'm worried that they wil think she is lying. I've seen he stats and she's sold over 10k worth of stuff, which I think is great, but I'm worried a potential employer won't be able to see that.

[VerenaR]

Stressedoutpa - yes,I'm concerned that is the vibe she will give off, when in fact it's the total opposite. She's afforded not to work because we are low income household and makes her student loan and bursary last/sells high street and designer clothes on EBay.

[grimupnorthLondon]

But you should see the kind of things kids have on their CVs now @DelphiniumBlue. I have interviewed 20 year olds who have worked in the local shop for years and set up a new projects to make the shop owner money through importing spices and adding a cafe. And 18 year olds who have set up freelancing businesses as software developers, building their own websites, keeping timesheets and accounts and devising invoicing systems. And lots of kids from families with no' contacts' who can tell me anecdotes about becoming supervisors/team leaders in minimum wage jobs. A bit of tutoring arranged through school and selling what is presumably her own clothes bought for her by her parents on Ebay isn't really the same thing and wouldn't stand out to me on a CV or give the OP's daughter much to talk about at interview. Obviously different if she is making/up-cycling the clothes herself and the £10k since 2013 is pure profit, but OP has not said that.

[Xenia]

Making £10k from on line selling might have given her a bit of relevant experience. I only know about law but for that it certainly helps if you can get on the very very competitive vacation schemes (which are paid) which you tend to apply for in year 2 of your degree although you can be recruited without being on one - my daughter didn't do one and got a good job at a London firm but she had done some law work experience separately from that - a week or two and also worked in some other jobs (eg for a holiday company in some university holidays).

I don't think my son who worked in a hotel last summer for a month has a better CV really than his twin who didn't at this point for most of the jobs they might in due course apply for but I do think it was very good experience for him.

My sons are at the same stage and I would rather they enjoyed what might be the last summer of freedom of their lives than working in a job which is not specific to a future career. On the other hand I do want them to plan next steps this summer ready for next year.

Perhaps ask her to think about careers and then any work experience etc can be tailored to that. My other son walked straight into a job and has never been out of work despite no job whilst at university, but that is because he has no interest in money nor status and is very happy with his low level career. In other words some jobs you can easily get as they are low paid etc.

[titchy]

Hang on- she runs an online retail business which has turned over five figures - that's brilliant!!!! Loads of transferable skills there. Far better than 'do you want fries with that' She (and you!) need to recognise and formalise those skills.

Time management, costing calculations, marketing, customer service, product presentation, income and expenditure monitoring...

[titchy]

No interviewer is going to whip out their phone, log onto their eBay account just to check whether she's a personal or business seller btw!

[VerenaR]

Yes there is a real mix of opinions here. I still want her to get a job though, for all the reasons that have been cited in this thread.

Just to clarify, The clothes are only some of her own, which she has paid for herself, she sources the clothes by trawling through charity shops and looking for bargains and selling them on.

[grimupnorthLondon]

Thanks for the clarification VerenaR. That does show initiative on her part and she should definitely present it in a positive way on her CV. If she can discuss it enthusiastically in a businesslike way at interview I'd be impressed with that experience.

[Wormentrude]

@VerenaR The ones who got back to me after I applied did say that they were looking for more experience, yes. My degree isn't something that leads naturally to a career (Linguistics - generally, you'll need further training on top of the degree to do a related job), but there were a few jobs that would have been related enough, and at that point my lack of any work experience at all really counted against me.

[MissDemelzaCarne]

DS was the same, he graduated last year without ever having done a days paid work.

He was on the minimum maintenance loan but was very frugal. He has AS and couldn’t seem to grasp the concept of having to focus on more than one thing at once. I encouraged him to apply for all types of summer jobs but to no avail.

He was unemployed for a year after graduating and still didn’t listen to what I was saying about the need for any work on his CV, despite me recruiting as part of my job.

My low point was paying for him to travel to London fir a graduate recruitment fair when he returned full of enthusiasm as whilst he hadn’t been offered anything he had received some great advice from a bloke called Gavin who had advised him to get any work experience on his CV No shit Gavin, I’ve been saying that for months!

He finally got a post in local government but probably only got to interview because of his declared disability so he was ‘lucky’ in that respect.

I’ll try really hard not to let DD make the same mistake.

[Springisallaround]

If you are a low income household then your dd might qualify for additional help through the careers service- our uni offers a bursary scheme where lower income household students are offered a months fully paid internship/work experience during the summer months or before they graduate- the idea being that wealthier students can afford to take unpaid work experience or intern but poorer ones can't. There may be some 'ins' there if she looks about. The key thing is to use the careers service as a portal to this information- they will know if there are similar schemes also with some of the big employers. We are keen to level the playing field, as those who do say PR internships for free are rarely from low income or working class backgrounds as they cannot afford to live in London for free for months on end. Our university also offers internal internships, all paid. In fact, we do not advertise or promote any unpaid internships at all, any work placement has to be either very short or tailored to the course.

[Springisallaround]

I should also say in my uni's case, it is not just really low income households that count for bursaries, it's low and middle income households, so it's actually quite a lot of students that could benefit.

[VerenaR]

Thanks for that info, I’ll get DD to ask in her upcoming careers meeting whether there is a similar scheme at her university - fingers crossed there is!

[EdWinchester]

This was my son this time last year. 2nd year student and had never worked a day in his life.

I forced persuaded him to get a job over the summer and, amazingly, he went back to it during the Christmas and easter breaks. His cv looks pretty good now and he has just secured a permanent job after he graduates this year.

[Bodicea]

Personally I think her eBay venture shows a lot more nowse and entrepreneurial skill than shelf stacking in a min wage job.
She just needs to make it a selling point on her cv Ie say Running her own eBay shop, maybe an accounts page showing her profits or something.

[BubblesBuddy]

I agree. Lord Sugar would be impressed even if MN Recruiters are not. It’s way more impressive than shelf stacking and shows real business acumen and a desire to do well at what she enjoys. There is nothing wrong with running an embryonic business and many entrepreneurs start this way. They probably don’t worry about 9-5 in Sainsbury’s or time serving. The great thing about doing your own thing is that you think outside the box and you are not a wage Slave. Absolutely it goes on the cv under work experience! She’s made money!

May I suggest she looks to volunteer in a decent Charity shop? That would at least follow up an interest. It can lead to a management role within the charity of its big enough.

My DD1 didn’t do paid work. She wasn’t offered any, despite applying and calling into businesses. She did however volunteer for the National Trust and then managed to get paid relevant experience and volunteered extensively for the CAB. It really doesn’t have to be paid and menial work doesn’t always fit with career intentions.

She did a year abroad whilst at university and also was Chair of a ball committee at university and that involved many transferable skills! She proved she was a self starter and that’s what your DD should do. Successful career now but she was hugely dedicated to getting the career she wanted.

[stressedoutpa]

The majority of employers are looking for people who can operate in a team and you don't get that by selling stuff on eBay.

Does she want to be the next Alan Sugar?

[MariaNovella]

Work experience is really important. Our DCs did internships from 14 every year, in different companies, and they really needed the build up in order to get a job in their preferred industries.

[sendsummer]

Our DCs did internships from 14 every year, in different companies, and they really needed the build up in order to get a job in their preferred industries.. That’s a rather negative view of your DCs’ personal strengths MariaNovella . It makes it sound as though they were only capable of getting those jobs by aligning (or it being aligned for them) every possible engineered advantage in experience.

OP it sounds to me as though your DD has initiative and entrepreneurial skills. She should certainly use the university careers advice, get her CV ready and work out what sort of direction she wants to go experience wise if she does not get the internship. Personally I think doing minimum wage jobs are n’t a bad thing if other paid employment is not possible. She could find something with fairly minimum shifts and use the rest of the time to build up her interests and skills in other ways.

[NicoAndTheNiners]

My brother did this. Came out of uni with a good degree but couldn't get a job, not even minimum wage jobs, he tried retail jobs, etc and didn't get a look in. Went back to uni to do a masters. He spent over 12 months applying for stuff. Got a part time job in a shop while doing his masters. Finished his masters, got an office junior job. A year later is now on a good grad scheme but it was worrying for a while.

[TuftyBum]

I used to work in graduate recruitment and your dd would lose marks for never having worked or done a summer internship for our roles. They never made it to assessment centre.

[VerenaR]

I definitely don’t want her searching for a year after uni for the right job - she’s definitely getting a job whatever it is this summer.
I’m worried not even min. wage job will hire her, so as soon as she gets back she’s logging on Indeed/Reed jobs to try and find something! After reading these, she wants to get a job at least and feels spurred on. Hopefully after careers meeting she gets a rough idea of something she’d like to do in the future.

[whiteroseredrose]

Interesting reading. My DS never had a job in 6th form because he was very focused on academics. We supported him because he didn't spend his holidays asleep but went to Central library doing pre reading and studying around his subject. He did however volunteer in school to tutor younger pupils and worked in a Charity shop for D of E.

He is now at Uni and didn't want to apply for a NMW job for his first summer because it's not going to help his future career.

Like others on here I was concerned that nobody would look at him without previous work experience. He has however secured a six week job in an area related to his degree and will be earning more per hour than I do!

[lucy0132]

Any kind of job - doesn't matter what it is - demonstrates work ethic, responsibility, commitment and teamwork/people skills. All essential for any job. I don't think selling clothes from the comfort of your own home - essentially a hobby even if it makes money shows any of these to a prospective employer. I think you should encourage her to get a summer job - then at least she'll have some experience and a reference from an employer. University holidays are extremely long so she'll still have time to relax and enjoy the summer.