Should to pay your child's course fees?

[MollyHuaCha]

Just that really. Students now start repaying their loan once they earn more than £25k per year.

If you can afford to fund your child's course fees and living expenses in order for them to avoid taking out a student loan, should you do it?

Any thoughts...???

Most of the Londoners at university in those establishments don't live at home either.

Living at home in those places would make you an outlier. Nowt wrong with that. But best not to give the impression it's the norm.

Most of the Londoners at university in those establishments don't live at home either.

That's not mine or my DC's experience but I appreciate everyone has a different perspective. Times have changed a lot in the past few years, especially since 2012 when the uni fees increased. More and more are living at home if they can as they see it as a waste of money to rent. Plus, the London uni culture is just not the same as campus based unis as they are more likely to meet up with a wide range of friends than hang out a lot at the student union. So being an "outlier", is not an issue.

It's not about perspective. It's about fact.

It's easy to access how many students are living at home.

And the cultures of those universities are not anything like you describe.

It is different for those less selective estsblishments.

I don't know why you are implying that my DC are at "less selective establishments", but that is simply not the case.

If you have a different opinion, fair enough, but there is no need for that sort of sneering remark.

As a 28 year old with a substantial student debt, I'd say definitely don't pay towards uni fees! (Assuming you're a PAYE employee) you never notice the missing money as it's deducted at source. The loan is just something which the vast majority of students accept they'll have to take out. Having said that, it was definitely never an option for my parents to contribute, so I guess it didn't cross my mind that there might be people who weren't taking out loans.

If you can afford to give you children a gift, why not give it to them to save in a Help to Buy account, so they can benefit from the government uplift on a house deposit?

My observation is that it relates more to cultural background, and cultural background influences choice of subject. So even in my day there were lots of North London Jewish students who studied accountancy and lived at home. Equally lots of female Muslim medics seem to opt for London medical schools so they can live at home. Hence DS being happy to move home saying there is no real advantage as social life is the same. His friend at Imperial took a similar view. They save money and will have the sort of degrees which should pretty much guarantee they earn above the repayment threshold.

watch I'm not sneering or implying anything about your DC. I don't know them or you from Adam.

And yes, we are all entitled to our own opinion but not our own facts.

And the fact remains that if you stay at home with your parents and study at the places I mentioned, you will be in a minority. Including Londoners.
And the culture of those universities still includes lots of communal living and activities.

It is different at less selective universities in London.

Of course your DC experience is not CW reed around the hubbub of student life. They don't live there. That's kind of the point. Those that stay at home have a very different experience.

I didn't say it was worse. But it is different. And it isn't the norm.

evelyn since you think you know so well what my 'twisted' views are, there should be no more need for me to indulge your 2-year old attention-seeking rants, and we can both go our respective ways perfectly happily. May I suggest to you that nobody is actually interested in our trading insults, and whatever initial sport there may have been has quickly become truly tedious? On the other hand, it will take you at least another 50 years to get that...

I was specifically talking about vet med students, where gaining entry is highly competitive (and actually more of an issue than debt, which they are among the most likely to repay), but as usual you like reshaping things to serve your twisted needs. I also don't see UK fees being a problem for you, since you live in 'a part of the EU' where the taxpayer pays for it all. So why this needy attention-seeking?

No teachers or nurses? You really a sad twisted person. How about all those teachers and nurses who trained in your part of the EU? Oh yes, they're already here, and if they left, perhaps the Kiwis, Aussies and other Commonwealth ones will join the many Brits who choose those professions. There are a fair few British teachers who work and stay on overseas, EU or elsewhere, so two-way traffic must be fine. I hope not everyone thinks like me! You however have provided ample evidence that you are the opposite, and will twist everything, and demonise others, to suit your needs.

However, it is wrong to say only those who are wealthy pay for student's fees/loans.
Sorry, what ?

Half of all UK adults earn less that £19,000 a year
Half of all Londoners earn less than £23,000 a year
Half of all UK households earn less than £26,000 a year

Student Tuition and Maintenance loans come to around £16,000 a year
only the VERY VERY top few percent could even consider finding that amount of money over and above their day to day basic expenditure

Yes, if you are that rich, do it
but unless you think that the current crop of politicians have the best ideas
do not slag off those who need loans to reach their academic potential

Like you said above talkin I feel pretty pissed off for this generation.

Whilst I know most students have to take loans I still think it's bloody awful for them.

The Loan situation is not good.
Its not sustainable
Its regressive
BUT
The only way out is to admit that degrees need to go back to being only for the most academic 10%
which would mean owning up to the fact that extending the education leaving age was always about massaging the unemployment numbers from the 90's onwards
which ain't gonna happen

If 50% earn less than an average salary, 50% earn more...

I still find it odd that kids are turning up at University with car loads of new stuff, and then spending a fortune on booze, when with a bit of care they could have reduced their borrowing.

I am not convinced that the main function of University is to give kids a chance to grow up. Instead it should be to learn and get educated and to open doors for a future career.

If you need to grow up, take a gap year. Then start University with some savings and ready to learn.

If 50% earn less than an average salary, 50% earn more...
Average and median are NOT the same thing

when with a bit of care they could have reduced their borrowing.
That is not how student loans work.

The student applies in advance based on family income.
If they are clever and do not spend all of the money, well done them
but last year, DDs hall fees used up all but £21 of her maintenance loan (self catering)

Instead it should be to learn and get educated and to open doors for a future career.
Indeed, but some careers will never, ever be highly paid
but now require a degree to get into them
(eg nursing, social work, child care, midwifery)

If 50% earn less than an average salary, 50% earn more...

Mathematically incorrect (I have more than the average number of legs for example).

Regardless to be able to afford upfront fees and maintenance you need to be in the top 5% of earners anyway.

Car loads of new stuff - well a few will clearly have heaps of new stuff, but the majority just come with their normal clothes, bedding from home and a few items pilfered from their home kitchen. Even spending £1or200 on 'stuff' isn't comparable to having a spare £20k net.

Ha titchy, exactly what mine did. But plenty of flat screen Tv's and new stuff was evident on move in day. Even the occasional (and rather smart) car.

Sure if you have more money you have more choices. But it is not an absolute. It depends on what your priorities are. We are better off because I worked full time and ran a small business. Friends' DC benefitted from SAHMs but will have to take out loans.

Perhaps the kids themselves should be asked what the right approach is. All I know is that my DC have turned out surprisingly frugal. They know the money they had, has had to be earned.

I still find it odd that kids are turning up at University with car loads of new stuff, and then spending a fortune on booze, when with a bit of care they could have reduced their borrowing

"car loads of new stuff" - isn't our experience, with either dc nor their flatmates - as said above, they have had stuff pilfered from our linen cupboard and our kitchen, with a couple of gifts from Godparents and an Aunty.
"spending a fortune on booze" -generalisation, much ?
"they could reduce their borrowing" - you don't seem to understand how it works. The amount they can borrow depends on parents' income (regardless of outgoings). In my dd's case, the loan does not cover her (self catered) accommodation - and she is nowhere near London or the SE generally. How, exactly could she reduce her borrowing ?

Reduce borrowing by not taking the maintenance loan if the the student or the parent can cover that. Ds had no loans at all for his BA, neither will he for his MA this year. Furthermore, whilst gifting money for a house deposit has tax implications, there are none for funding a child through university.

I am unconvinced that the current rules will apply for the next thirty years, and we prefer ds starts off debt free.

"Tuition fees were not something we even thought about
we got housing benefit in the holidays on our digs"

Talkin this was my era. It is easy to speak about today with the hindsight of yesterday (smile)

& one more

you know what Talkin - I think I see your point and Carl's and that is not meant to be elitist or anything but a whole load of debt for a whole bit of nothing is not a good deal - caveat I am not an accountant.

I would never tell a young person whose parents can't or won't fund them not to go to university.

A good course, at a good university is worth the debt, I think. If there's no alternative then go for it.

That's certainly what I say to sixth formers on my endless rounds as part of widening access.

But that doesn't stop me thinking it's an awful way to start adult life - hocked up to the gills. Just because I can avoid it for my own DC doesn't mean I think it's fine for everyone else's.

The truth is most parents can't afford 15/16 k per year ( the average loan - some are higher). Maybe double that if two go at the same time ( I have twins for example). Especially when most parents will be topping up and keeping their DC during the holidays ( 20 odd weeks per year at most places).

Something that's beeen noticed recently is the increase in students taking out a loan for fees but not maintenance. Thus reducing the debt substantially. The repayments remain the same but the debt gets paid off much more quickly. Obviously. Some of these debts are being paid off in full on graduation or not too long afterwards also. The interest accrued plus penalties are not proving too onerous for some.

Back for Good. Probably not true for all Universities but I don't think many would recommend spending a Friday or Saturday night in the centre of one of the major party universities in September or October. A lot of money is being spent on booze. Fine in itself, but not sensible if you are borrowing at high interest rates.

The majority of young people pre load their alcohol before they go out.

A supermarket botttke of vodka is 15 quid. They will share that between 5 or 6 and then spend almost nothing in a club.
Similarly Weatherspoins offer ludicrously cheap spirit deals.

This is one of the reasons for so much being sick. But it is far cheaper than hitting the pub for beer or wine.

The idea that students spending thousands on alcohol is a bit far fetched.

A lot of money is certainly not being spent on booze when loans and grants barely cover most people's student housing costs.

A supermarket botttke of vodka is 15 quid. They will share that between 5 or 6 and then spend almost nothing in a club.
Similarly Weatherspoins offer ludicrously cheap spirit deals.

Apparently Sainsbury Basics vodka is £8 making 'pre' a merely couple of quid at most!

DD spends sod all on booze.
They do "prinks" gosh I hate that word on cheap stuff from Morrrisons
then a happy hour jug of cocktails at spoons
then hawk around which clubs will give the girls a free drink to get the lads in the door too
and then sober up during the evening

kids do not drink the same way we did